Consider making deployed sunderers much more resistant to mines and c4

They are proximity mines, they are not motion activated. Your mine goes "Hey, is that an enemy vehicle? Imma blow that ***** up!" Its a moot point though when you can shoot them to set them off.

Do you have any idea how much it costs in certs to be able to carry five mines, never mind the resource cost of the mines themselves? And what you have to give up to carry them? No flak armor, no nanoweave. Max rank mineguard is FAR cheaper than being able to carry five mines, and I think it takes...seven to kill one?

Putting a Sunderer as close to the tower as possible usually is the best location. Why you ask? Well, when it's put away from the tower two major things can happen.

1. Enemy HA on the tower will probably see it and Sunderers don't last long when in sight of a Heavy (they tend to multiply quickly). Find better cover you say? See #2 below.
2. Get too far away from the tower trying to find good cover and friendlies will blow it up so they can place one closer. Trust me, lost more that a few that way. If it doesn't get TK'd people will most likely start publicly abusing you for it's placement. Yey! fun.

I have ALLOT of hours in this game and have yet to see any significant amount of randoms, or even outfit players, spend time and resources CE'ing up the area around a Sunderer. Random players did that in PS1 because CE was free (not counting the cert investment) and each CE certed player had 10 mines to start with, not 2. We also had spitfires and motion detectors for free.

Good luck in regards to begging over local chat for people to CE up around your Sundy. Just don't expect random players to happily skip around your Sunderer dropping mines like candy and you won't be disappointed.

With 10 or 20 mines one can most certainly deploy an adequate mine field around a Sunderer. With a maximum of 5 AV mines, and 3 AP mines (and a HUGE cert/resource cost) "being stretched thin" is an understatement.

Again, your talking about stuff that just doesn't happen often. Game mechanics should be laid out to accommodate the average player in the average scenario with consideration given for special players in special circumstances, not the other way around. The game should not force players to do super-duper 360 turret duty (READ: boring) just to defend a spawn point from one, single, enemy with two mines because the TTK is insanely fast.

I don't wish for Sunderers to become fortresses, but the ability to stop suicide bombers needs buffed. My suggestion is a 20 second arming delay on dropped mines and if the enemy is killed before the mines arm they deconstruct. Now one person can still destroy a Sundy but we've added a dash of the "survivability skill" in there as a requirement.

Vehicle drivers want to be immune to infantry, basically.

Anti vehicle mines are *proximity based*. It is perfectly acceptable for them to explode beneath a stationary vehicle.

If you don't like dying to mines, which cost lots of certs to unlock and lots of resources to deploy, buy the cheap as chips mineguard and equip that.

2 C4 is not enough to destroy a full health sunderer in one go.
No engineer can carry enough tank mines to destroy a fully mineguarded sunderer in one go.

All the tools you need exist to keep one person from getting to your sunderer and destroying it.

So why are you whining?

If you sunderer is full health and has mine guard up, it's not dying instantly to one LA/Engineer, period.

Just put your own anti personnel mines around your sunderer and you don't even have to be there to guard it!

There's nothing to address. It's working fine.

The only people who think otherwise are crybabies who want their sunderers to be invincible to mines WITHOUT them having to buy mine guard.

I put mine guard on my sunderer and it doens't die to a single engineer doing a suicide run. No reason everyone else can't do the same.

Anyone and everyone can pull a sunderer. There's no particular reason for them to be almost impossible to destroy when left alone and unguarded. In this game you have to protect your assets.

No worries m8. I went ahead and bought lvl 1 and 2 mines for my engineer last night and proceeded to mess up every sunderer I could find. I was having so much fun pi.s.sin.g off the drivers that I called my friend in to increase the carnage. It is much easier to use than C4. Good times.

Btw, every sundy kill I got was with troops guarding it. Amazing time.

Yep, love people who park their sunderers right next to a doorway so I can just pop out below the coverage of the gunners with my 100 certs in tankmines and instagib it. At least make it so you need level 2 mines in order to do that

Sunderers should be more resistant from C4 and AT mines IF, and only if, said C4/Mines are dropped by a friendly.
On Miller, VS forces are currently losing deployed Sunderers since whenever they are engaging a certain TR outfit, suddenly VS Light Assaults and Engineers show up, TK the Sunderer and then suicide rush the enemy.
Now, it's probably a coincidence, and they are getting reported, but the current system is not enough to discourage this behaviour, since everyone on all three sides can do this.

When it comes to mines and C4 deployed by the enemy, though, I think it's good as it is: Blockade Armor stops C4, while Mineguard stops AT mines unless a lot of them are used. The player has to decide which upgrade to use and if he wants protection from one of these threats, or more flexibility (like ammo or repairs).

No, it is a terrible place. Exhibit A: Your sundie is dead. Rather than deploying it in a safe location, you're crying for nerfs to the things that killed your sundie.

It takes no effort to make no defense. It takes neglible effort to drop some mines. If you don't want to make that effort, don't cry when your sundie dies.

Actually, the cost per person is quite low. How many people are deploying on your sundie? A squad? Two squads? A whole platoon? Imagine if every soldier placed a single mine, costing them only a mere 75 infantry resources. For four squads of twelve, that's 48 mines. That is a tremendously dense minefield. All at the cost of pennies per man. That's why you don't see the good outfits whining about AT mines. Worst comes to worst, it is very inexpensive for a platoon to just saturate an area with mines.

I'm aware that the vast majority of sundies are laughably defended. THAT is the problem. AT mines and C4 are fine.

we get this argument constantly on forums, everytime some xp farmer looses his gravy train he gets upset an rushes here to demand a nerf, while sprouting how dire the game is in need of "balance"/mirror imaging... an if it doesn't happen soon he will leave (obviously they never leave)

But an heres the funny part, tell them to use mine guard.
Tell them to use NVG on their mounted weapons.
tell them to work with others to defend their sunderer.

They will instantly call you silly schoolyard names an go off on another rant.

No, because if an Engineer makes it to the Sundy to lay down C4, then the tactics for Sunderer security blows and you deserve to lose it. I already have to plow many times more Prowler rounds into a Sundy's rear than any other tank to bring it down, that is enough armor and then some, imo.

I'll bet the loudest whiners in here just deploy their Sundy then run off to the fight thinking... "Look at that XP tick! daddy's going to be a big boy tonight!"

The reason these people don't want their Sundys to die to ATM or C4 is because they don't want to guard it, if their Sundy survives by a sliver of health they can count on some other "smuck" to repair it for them while they keep running into the meatgrinder.

Rule #1: Never expect people to guard your Sundy for you!

I still remember the person who wanted vehicle ownership rules changed so they could deploy a sundy and then fly around with their ESF.

Op is right, just think about the nerf to 4th empire Sundys TKers.
After being on the ****** side of a really bad Sundys TK Takedown on Miller tonight

I'm not seeing the issue, if you let a guy waltz over to your sunderer (which you can and should equip with a mineguard if you're an infantry spawner sundy) then you and your whole team weren't paying attention and now you need a new sunderer.

If it is doomed to stay deployed with mines underneath, it makes sense to take advantage of the Sunderer's spawn point and never move it again. Mines shouldnt go off magically, but by shooting at them, granedes or anything exploding close to. That sould make things more difficult for kamikazes.

... which can be as soon as a Flash (enemy or friendly) bumps into it slightly.

Why do you think C4 is for vehicles only ? Its nice for cap points as well.
I'm pretty sure Anti-Vehicle mines are for vehicles and I'm glad to see you figured it out.
Now go enjoy your un-mineguarded sundy kill every 30 minutes

Magnetism isn't a magical property.

Time delay the empire change.

Depending on the Sundy's location, I've seen enemies fly ESF's above and jump out as LA to land ontop then drop C4's on it, or an engineer zipping through the base to get to the Sundy and you barely notice him until it's too late (I've seen one wearing camo that had similar color to our's).

And look at my sig, it's a popular thing to do now.