Thyriel are you playing the same game i am??? You are spewing so much false information its making me sick. app2 to adept1 is nearly 100% more damage NEVER seen an upgrade that large from app2 to adept1....IF this was true my nil distortion adept1 would be doing 1200 damage at adept1... Have you ever seen the difference between a normal 3% regeneration rate and 10% regeneration rate? At 27 i can make this difference with adept1 (dont know english name of the spell its the common ooc mana regen buff we have), if u get additional some good drinks (those 2s thingys from npc), you regenerate 15% per tick, so i would definitly say HUGE difference when the entire group is ready again in double the time or better. NEVER seen anyone regen 15% a tick...not even with bard+chanter+warlock+best food .... if anyone has seen 15% regeneration please speak up...this is complete bull crap. Warlock power regen power are nothing spectacular.... Ever tried adept1 health to power? Yes, I have adept 1 painful mediation and adept 1 Grisly Contract...but yet again at lvl 27 you believe you know about all the problems people have at 40+ Sorry if this sounds aggressive, if so, it should be so. I wroted now 2 times, that u are comparing things like McD and 6star hotel eating, stop doing that bull[expletive ninja'd by Faarbot], you just cant compare adept1 with app2 without the knowledge what exactly the dmg difference is on this. I am comparing adept3 of a level 23 spell and app2 of a lvl 37 spell which is supposed to be an upgrade...no matter what the app or adept the spell is at the lvl 37 spell should ALWAYS be more powerful than the lvl 23 spell. And here the big fat sentence i waited for. Grinding thru nearly 50 in 2 months or less, and NEVER took 5 minutes to read the manual. INT increases your damage in HUGE differences. Every INT seems to be like 1% more damage (at my current level range), so having 30 more INT or not, is a huge difference. I exp'ed the other day with no gear on for fun, since we were extremely bored...i saw no difference in the damage i did with or without int gear...if you can post some hard data and prove me wrong please do so. PLEASE prove that 1int = 1% damage increase becauce once again i call this false information...no where have i seen this kind of damage upgrade come from int gear. Yes, i read the manual...did you know the manual says that sitting increases power regen??? The manual must always be right. Please dont post false information here. Message Edited by Victicus7 on 01-04-2005 02:09 PM
I agree with Vic's posts. A lvl 50 warlock friend of mine with Adept 3 Nil Distortion told me he does at max 830ish, averages for 700s. At 36 I do 620 max and averages for 500s on Adept 3 Dark Distortion. Maybe it's just me but grinding 13 levels to get an upgrade of 200 on a main nuke isn't much of an upgrade.
killzone i'm just saying that if you have nothing better to do than to flame other people with penta-posting and whining on these boards rather than do mature /feedback in the game then you should pull one of those options. I'm not saying just cuz they're broke do it. I just hit 30 and I'm still going to keep playing because i understand that not everything is gonna work perfectly from the start. If you follow the proper channels for feedback instead of throwing a tantrum on the boards you are much more likely to be heard. I understand ya know. I'm sure it sucks to be broken. There are just better ways to handle it.
Unfortunately I completely agree with the original poster. Other classes may have balancing issues, too, but warlocks are really the most broken class in the game. Past lvl 40, we are truly the most gimped class in the game. We were supposed to be damage dealers. Damage ? Almost every other class easily outdamages us. - the scout classes ? don't even think of getting close in damage with them. An assassin, swashbuckler or brigand does 2x the dps we do at lvl 44, rangers and the bard subclasses about 1,5x. Plus they can take hits much better than we can, plus they can evac... - the fighter classes ? Well they are supposed to tank, not to do dps, aren't they ? At lvl 44 warlocks get outdamaged by berzerkers, bruisers, monks and guardians (exactly ... these are those with the highest ac and hp !). Only shadowknights and paladins lag a bit behind. - the priest classes. Well they are supposed to be healers, not dds. Which doesn't mean, of course, that furies eg. come very close in dps to warlocks. Plus the heals. Templars and Inquisitors can solo mobs that a warlock of the same level doesn't even dream of ! - the other mage classes. Wizards: they have harder hitting nukes, plus they can easily switch between ice/heat nukes without losing damage, while ALL our hard hitting nukes are poison based ! Plus they don't have this issue with their spell upgrades sharing the same timer. FOR GOD'S SAKE WHY DO DARK DISTORTION AND NIL DISTORTION SHARE THE SAME TIMER ??? they are our only hard hitting nukes until 50. CHANGE THAT OR GIVE US OTHER HARD HITTING NUKES !!! Illusionists: Well they have their issues too. But after all they can mezz and therefore are useful for groups who need crowd control, so dps is not that important for them. Summoners: They have their pets as their free "dots", Necro has some nice dots, the other some nice nukes. Plus they solo pretty well, even at 40+. At current state, warlocks are pretty useless in any party after lvl 40. They can't dish out enough damage, the buffs aren't that great, they can't heal, they can't tank. So why should any group choose a warlock ? N.B.: I know that a warlock between 25-30 is a pretty strong character. But it doesnt get any better after lvl 35 and completely stagnates at lvl 40.
Ok, dinged 37 a couple of days ago so now I feel I can honestly comment on this as well. First thing I did was run out, find a yellow solo mob, debuff it and blast away with my new spell that I worked so hard to get. I think the mob laughed at me. I took the next day and soloed, and I really am not a big soloer. I soloed and soloed and soloed all day and into the night. I was dirty and starting to get the shakes from playing too much but damnit I had almost a platt from farming. I found a rare on the market and found Zorander(the greatest sage ever) and placed my order for an adept3 nill distortion. Now everything is going to be ok right? Wrong, I spent a few hours with some good friends trying to make some money and gain some xp (mostly make money since I just blew my life savings on an adept 3 scroll) What I came up with is this. Dark distortion at lvl 37 adept 3, mob debuffed and my int atm was 134 max hit was 657---- cool , not too shabby and good damage (at lvl 30 or so) Nill distortion at lvl 37 adept 3, mob debuffed and my int atm was 134 max hit was 689---- you're kidding right? I just busted my butt and got an upgrade for a level 23 spell, then farmed for hours on end and spend every gold piece I owned for an extra 32 damage!!!!! this is pathetic. As I have said before, the same revamp that dard distortion recieved should and probablly is coming to nill distortion. I have complete confidence that SoE will adress this issue and hopefully soon. To the people here that actually have the spell and therefore are familiar with it's inadiquacies, Don't lose hope! Thank you for posting here and making your voice heard and keep your chin up, SoE has done a pretty good job with this game so far and one day we will get that patch. Message Edited by tennjed on 01-05-2005 10:01 AM
Wizards are in the same boat as Warlocks. The spell upgrades for the DD spells are on the same timer. Immolation(39) shares a timer with Breath of theTyrant(22), Ball of Fire(23) shares a timer with Ball of Flames(37) and Ice Comet(50). Almost all of the Wizards damage is fire based. They need to fix this asap for both classes.
Just a few comments on this. 1) Blaze went from doing 35 points to 75 points of damage when upgrading from app 2 to adept 1. 2) I can't speak for Warlock spells, but on the Wizard line, Ball of Fire went from doing 200 to around 400 when upgrading from app 1 to adept 1. 3) Ball of Flames (37) goes from doing 600 average to around 700 average when upgrading from app 2 to adept 3 (adept 1 doesn't drop) at level 45. 4) The melee classes get their BIG damage improvments by getting better weapons (i.e. sbd, ebcc) and by using the flowing black silk sash (fbss) which gives haste. They don't need to upgrade from app 2 to massively outdamage Wizards and Warlocks. With a bard and or chanter in the group their dps is even higher still. Is ours? No we can cast longer (from power regens) but the recast time on spells is still the same and thus our dps compared to melee classes is even worse (and it was bad even without a chanter or bard speeding up the melee attacks.) 5) I have played around with my int and have never seen a change in damage due to increasing or decreasing it. It only affects power. Evocation affects the damage done by DD spells.
Uninstall guys......I find that I am pretty happy with my warlock. Also, give them a chance, its not like the game has been out for a long time....
If your still level 32 then simple comments like this contribute nothing to the discussion. Prior to 37 the Warlock and Wizard are kings of damage. Think about how much you like playing the class now. Wouldn't it be nice if you could like it as much after 40?
People have been complaining since lvl 20...you cant deny that... People will never be happy I guess Message Edited by WaachBack on 01-05-2005 01:26 PM
With those 2 comments, i think the main problem here is more a bug then anything else: Dark distortion at lvl 37 adept 3, mob debuffed and my int atm was 134 max hit was 657---- cool , not too shabby and good damage (at lvl 30 or so) Nill distortion at lvl 37 adept 3, mob debuffed and my int atm was 134 max hit was 689---- you're kidding right? I just busted my butt and got an upgrade for a level 23 spell, then farmed for hours on end and spend every gold piece I owned for an extra 32 damage!!!!! this is pathetic. 1) Blaze went from doing 35 points to 75 points of damage when upgrading from app 2 to adept 1. 2) I can't speak for Warlock spells, but on the Wizard line, Ball of Fire went from doing 200 to around 400 when upgrading from app 1 to adept 1. 3) Ball of Flames (37) goes from doing 600 average to around 700 average when upgrading from app 2 to adept 3 (adept 1 doesn't drop) at level 45. The spells before had the nearly 100% more damage i wroted and also noticed with all spells, but it seems the lvl37 do not have those. So at best /bug those ingame, Spells should increase their damage buy those spells, if they dont do it like they should its definitly a bug and not an imbalance problem
Just a few points: 1) Increasing spell levels affects lower level spells much more dramatically than high level spells, as it doesn't increase by %, but by a set damage ammount... you ARE NOT going to see dramatic (100%) increase on any high level spell (more toward 20%). 2) Same on power recovery, it does not go up by % for what you get back, but by a set number of points... so with a smaller power pool, that 50 power/tick regen looks alot nicer %-wise in a 1k power pool than 70 does in a 5k pool... the power pool and cost of spells increase faster than the recovery abilities keep up.. thus lowering the % they give back at higher levels. 3) Although the manual does indeed refer to intelligence as increasing the damage of our spells, it just doesn't work (and is VERY easy to test). I parse everything, and have done tests over 80-100 fights with and without my int-boosting gear (a difference of roughly 30% of my int) and had virtually no difference in either max or min damages against the same Mobs/same levels/same everything else :/ All it seems to do is lower your actual power pool. 4) I play both a Swashbuckler and a Warlock, and the Swash HEAVILY outdamages the Warlock as long as 1)he isn't the target (gotta be positional) and 2) he hasn't run out of poison... of course if the Warlock is the target of the mob he doesnt have to worry about a drop in DPS so much as dying instantly, unlike the Swash (who has alot of aggro-controlling moves both to get and lose aggro). BTW my Warlock has alot more of his Spells upgraded to Adept levels than my Swash does (app 2s mostly there). 5) Wizards are in the same boat as we are as far as hitting a "sweet spot" in thier upper 20s to lower 30s, and then kind of fading out. Wizards ALSO only have one major DD line (fire)... cold and magic lines are thier "utility" like AE, stuns, dots, etc... for us its Poison as the main DD, with cold, disease, and some mental thrown in on our extras. Wizards seem to have slightly better DPS, while we have slightly better group-buffs (only because I like our Power regen buff better than offense+ buff they get). 6) All I have to say is wait a bit, they already overhauled the low end skills, and every class is having some difficulty with the high end skills not scaling to be terribly effective compared to mid-range stuff... wait till more people reach those levels and it will be a bigger priority to patch.
Not true at all. I didn't see any complaints about Wizards prior to level 37. In fact most Wizards that didn't hit 37 called all the people who were complaining whiners and said the class was fun to play. Well yeah, it was fun to play. Post 37 though, it would be the equivalent of them taking the level 20 spells and cutting the damage in half. How much fun would that be? As far as Warlocks, the only complaints pre 37 were before they fixed up the damage of some of the spells (hey they were doing too little damage and it was obvious.) Message Edited by killzone on 01-06-2005 06:43 AM
Warlocks are supposed to be damagedealers. Well they are till , let's say, until lvl 37. After that level they just get outdamaged by any other class. They get outdamaged by all scout classes, they get outdamaged by the tank classes. Some priest classes are not far behind in damage (plus they can heal !). So why should any group choose a warlock for the group ? Because of the mana regen buffs ? Well then you're better off with a coercer/thaumaturgist. Their buffs are butter, plus they can mezz. Wizards have to some extend the same trouble. But while ALL hard hitting nukes of the warlock are poison based, not all hard hitting nukes of wizards are fire based. (eg Ice Comet)
No it actually made it worse. They give us bellengers yesterday which today put it on same timer as dark and nil distortion. And then they also put all our mana converts on same timer and our debuffs.. Damage is still the same with adept 3 Nil distortion Level 43 Warlock Crushbone Server
This needs to be bumped. Warlocks: No ability to take damage (obvious). No utility to speak of (our buffs make no noticable difference on DPS, regen, etc) Monks, Scouts, Asssassins, even Guardians and Shadowknights do more damage than we do on average. What is the point of our class other than a place holder? I will ding 50 in a few days and see no hope for our level 50 spells bumping us back up to the "kings of damage." Right now, Assassins are the kings of damage. If you want raw numbers or data, I can provide facts, figures, graphs, whatever. Any intelligent player with a parser, however, can debuff themselves, factor in DoTs, and do the math. Frail 47 Warlock Mistmoore
Warlocks stop being 'king of damage' in the early 30s. I have grouped with a lvl 32 Assassin who can pull off a 1200 damage opener from stealth. He can then re-stealth and do it again mid combat. That plus his normal hits, we just don't do that kind of damage. And Vic's point that a spell 14 levels higher that is a direct upgrade to the previous spell and therefore should always, no matter what, do more damage is a valid point. Nil Distortion App1, fresh out of the box, should outdamage Dark Distortion Master 4 everytime no questions. It is the upgrade...what kind of upgrade is worse?
