Raid Changes coming in July

TL fell apart. As well in luclin there were MANY cases of out mobilization where trains were used to destroy the competition. Which is EXACTLY why instancing is and will be required. Don't talk like TL was the strongest guild when there were enough cases of bull that occured from both sides. But on the TL forum crusaders are here to deny everyone's claims and support TL.

What guild got the majority of kills from Classic through PoP? By a considerable margin? and most of the ones we didn't get were GM intervention(lol). Don't act like anyone was even close.

go back under your bridge!

Exactly. Can't claim anything major because during those times there was more then enough funny business to really say anything. Detheb can kindly keep his opinions as to superiority to himself cause no one here cares or believes it with the exception of other TL members.

Aww, you guys, you're cute. Come find me under the "This way for raid loots" bridge anytime.

You said required progression - Vxed apparently is removed now, I had it and the Ferubi goat (uninstanced) but on double checking they are removed from what ZAM says so edited them out.

Summoner hasn't been required for an age either. (even longer for that one if it ever was, when I keyed for GoD almost immediately after the tone down we'd skipped it and had to COME BACK post-Inktu'Ta for doing BiC for myself and others doing BiC)

Cynosure isn't required to be dead by your hands to request Inktu'Ta just that he's dead - unlike ZMTZ (who follows the same rule, but drops an item you must have as well).

And the others I listed. Additionally you had said "half of progression targets" in the sentence you made that claim int - without a clarification of raid progression Tipt is fair game.

It's still 6 instanced vs. 3 non (all of which only require a single kill vs. many instanced that required individual flags) hardly half, removing group progression.

I honestly had no idea they removed the Summoner, or Vxed from required progression. I took a bit of a hiatus to deal with things in RL during PoP -> Omens of War, so completely missed that. Last time i did that progression was when it was current. Ok, so 33% of the Required Progression now(ALthough at launch was closer to 50%) is still open world!

You remember how the Ferubi goat fit in before? Was it something like you could do the goat or Vxed? Been so long that memory isn't solid - I remember she WAS part of progression somehow though.

so if enough casuals sit in the main instance of permafrost/solb we could essentially lock the hardcore guilds out of raid content.? lol

Prat responded earlier that he plans to uncap the Prime limit.

I remember doing the Goat and Smith Rondo, but I just went where I was told. Perhaps it was a circumvention of something, but I'm like 99% positive it wasn't Vxed. I mean, that was over 10 years ago, hell if I remember. Then again, we did every single raid, including Feaster in Txevu as many times as we could. That tractor life man

Every expansion there have been fewer and fewer "contested" targets until it bottomed out at zero. I wonder why that might be? I suppose one could argue that instancing is the cause of the shift of attitude away from cooperation and fair play. I tend to think that it was more of a reaction to it. Either way that is water under the bridge.

These servers are extremely over crowded for the content available. The answer is obvious: Instance the zones so more people can access the same content. There is no difference with raiding, there are far too many people trying to kill far too few mobs. The solution to that is also obvious to everyone.

Please name one specific instance where I trained a guild that "out-mobilized" us. Every single time I trained (all 3-4 times in the whole lifetime of Fippy) except once, it was in retaliation of Thingtoo or somebody else that trained us first. If you say LordSeru I will have to point you to my previous sentence. We sat in the corner allowing you a clean attempt until Thingtoo started bombing us. You couldn't control your members so we returned the favor. You had whole train crews, of course we retaliated. What y'all did to us when we showed up at Ssra HP first was a joke. That one time I mention that wasn't in retaliation, wasn't even vs a raid. And your posts about TL not being able to say it was the better guild in those eras just shows how biased and hypnotized you are/were. You didn't even see VT until like 2 weeks before POP came out. How many in-era Vulak's did you get? How about you cheating in POP after losing Grummus and then still losing RZ? Name a single expansion you even went 50/50 with TL until all the leaders quit?

The jousting train wars at seru were the greatest moments in the history of TLP. We (TL) trained ourselves with the entire arc through a steady stream of pulls to clear the arx while killing seru simultaneously, and still won the memblur DPS contest at 5%.

Funny you mention VT. Thraka was caught dispelling mezzes during Emp event. So your point is moot since we suffered many times where Mezzes just "didn't seem to hold". And we out mobilized on Creator and suddenly we were trained. And in a previous post I mentioned that Thingtoo was indeed a toxic player, but you can't claim "retaliation" at all it's just a cop out. Thank you for proving the point that so many others here are complaining about. This is the toxic environment that NONE of them want and should have to deal with. Hence why so many are trying to get the developers to create instances. I didn't enjoy the what was happening and many others didn't, many just suffered at the hands of those who were willing to pull crap. I also wasn't one of those banned in PoP. Now that was just a stupid move on sooo many of their parts, but I never received a ban because I never got that flag. Kindly take the "you" and stuff it in someone else's face. You trained, doesn't matter the reasoning behind it because EVERYONE else suffered on both sides. The point is that the competition was hardly a competition because the PNP was never followed. Which once again is why so many people are calling for instancing because of what you just spoke of.

Your point is invalidated by the fact that the week prior, I, had to tank 2 of the mobs which were my responsibility to lock down, because they were dotted by your crew, and i never used that as an excuse to wipe. We reacted effectively with shaman HOTs on Throndor for the rest of the fight while i spammed slow to maintain agro on them throughout the kill.

I think there will be less trains on this server and more dps races, since the GMs are okay with it and said it's the deciding factor. There's no more petitioning during a poopsock to get the GM to show up and do LOTR trivia to see who gets the boss, we compete via most damage to mob. Which means if you show up first, you should have a huge advantage since memblur is about to not work on any raid bosses. Good changes. I cannot wait.

I do think there needs to be one rule that is brought over from Fippy regarding raids, and that is if your raid's actions directly spawn a mob, such as Vulak or Statue/AOW or Emp SSRA, you should have a clean attempt at said boss. I remember when Citizen almost pulled a Vulak that we spawned before realizing the GMs would have pooped on them for it. We had a guild the other day try to do this to us in Sky. We killed Noble and they engaged Overseer. Obviously they had no chance and everybody who agro'd it died, after which we downed him, but they should not have engaged on a mob we spawned. The competition for that is the first mob in the chain. At least I hope it's that way, or things will get very very stupid when that time comes. People will sit there and not kill the trigger because the guilds will sit and wait at the real boss' spawn.

No. The point remains quite valid. Do you think that I? one of the lowly members who wasn't an officer or any of that had or wanted any part in making the entire situation worse? Again, toxic players on both sides made things miserable for both sides. There is interference where they should have never been interference. ALL of it was unacceptable behavior and it will continue to occur leaving players unhappy instead of enjoying themselves. You and others may enjoy the toxic scene that occurred there but what makes you think that anyone else would accept that? This is once again WHY people are having such an outcry for the instancing of content. Specially with a population this large.

Jain and Mugatu were the shamans that responded to our emp adds being dotted onto me.

I personally like the proposed changes, I think they were needed just for the sake of balancing the encounters better and bringing the amount of raid loot in era to appropriate levels based on time in era and population. Obviously Lockjaw benefits from it more than Ragefire by virtue of its smaller population.

For all those saying but X guild will do this or that and this only benefits them, prove it, via videos and petitions to the GMs when it happens, or you really have nothing more than DBG own internal record of who received kill credit and what guild they are apart of for every raid target to go by.

Continue to post every example of toxic behavior you are experiencing directly within forum guidelines and contacting DBG staff and GMs with such. Do that and maybe you get instancing in some form, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Better to suggest solutions that require no instancing whatsoever and work with the code you can already see being used in era.