Encounter locking - lets talk about it.

I kind of think his comment still applies. You pay sometimes, and you aren't paying for FTE somewhere else.

No, actually it doesn't. It implies that there is some reason I would be playing EQ because it doesn't use FTE when in fact the opposite is true and I probably won't be interested in EQ without it at this point, possibly aside from live where it's less relevant. I also actually current play other games that use open tagging or a variation so the entire assumption was completely based on fallacy and assumptions.

Just out of curiosity; is there one that has successfully implemented it after the game has been released for a couple of years, or have they all been built with the system in place? Also WoW has all but ripped the system out (guess it still possible if you are War Flagged but that is PvP so doesn't count), and pretty sure FFXIV doesn't have encounters locked (as in I am pretty sure I've helped a few randos while on my Paladin out in the open world).

Wow has gone to open tagging afaik. FFXIV is a nice variation of that where you have to not only tag but do a certain threshold of dps.

So the two biggest MMOs have gone away from or never really had encounter locking.....

And no MMO has tried to show horn it in after the fact. Now to be fair EQ has been first in some very sucessful instances; namely TLP/ Classic servers.

Not sure. I do think FFXIV's open tagging but requiring a certain damage or aggro is the best. That increases social positives the most. Would prefer that but FTE is what we have. Maybe they will follow the same evolution, who knows.

You cant do open tagging without personal loot or everyone will have to be solo all the time to get the most loot possible from everything

And none of those games revolve primarily around open-world content. They're different games. They don't have economies, itemization models and content access quests that revolve around rare mobs in places accessible by everyone. FTE is of no consequence in a game where there's no incentive to compete for mobs. At worst it'll be a minor nuisance if someone else tags the nearest bear while you're at 9/10 bear arses, but there's no real consequence. Everquest is unique in this regard. The game's fundamental design makes it incompatible with a lot of features that have become the norm in other MMORPGs that don't share these design philosophies. And you know that, too. You're just arguing in bad faith because you think having an opinion that differs from the majority makes you superior or something. There's no way you're too unintelligent to comprehend why all features aren't universally applicable to all games within an entire genre, because if you really did think that, you'd be an absolute imbecile.

Yeah a shared loot table option would be nice (once a DPS threshold was met), but they amount of loot then entering the world would probably explode some purists heads (which in of itself could be kinda amusing).

My biggest issue is with DPG's track record of implementing some on the fly; I just know FTE is going to be a massive train wreck. I would rather it go live on the Test server for a few months before they try pushing it elsewhere.

Also with them taking over a week just to get us basic information; such as their plans on how it would work and what they are hoping to achieve by this change, doesn't bode well on how much thought and effort they put into it prior to the announcement. I am pretty convinced this was a concept they had half heartedly tossed around in the office last few years but not taken it seriously until the massive blow back on the EQ2 Pay to Raid fiasco. Then the powers that be were like "Ohhhh crap we can't do that on EQ; quick what is something experimental we can toss them since J.Chan opened her mouth in that one off interview?"

I hate this idea. This is the sort of "feature" that has diluted and watered down every MMO since EQ to make them all streamlined, homogenous, soulless garbage.

This is similar to trains and leashing. I never realized back in the day how important trains were. They were a nuisance at times and could be used to grief other players but what I didn't realize is how much they contributed to the community and player agency. They add an unpredictable danger to the world that can be caused by someone's mistake or poor play or even someone's malice.

Players who did this on purpose developed bad reputations that impacted their ability to get into groups and guilds. Other players might provide much needed assistance in the aftermath of someone's malicious train event. All of this contributed to the community of EQ and that is one of the biggest things missing from modern MMOs IMO.

I don't even understand how FTE is supposed to be helpful. It solves one problem by creating new problems. In some instances it might prevent someone from KS'ing you but in other instances it makes it easier for someone to steal mobs. Not to mention the inability to help other players that might be having trouble. Again, this type of "feature" just devolves community building elements that made EQ what it was (even if it wasn't by design).

At the end of the day it may not matter all that much in how it plays out but I think mucking around with the core EQ gameplay mechanics should mostly be off limits unless absolutely necessary.

so you're not a fan of: aoc's, picks, no more corpse runs, keyring, loot locked turn-in spawned mobs, shared bank, parcels, advanced loot window, origin, soul binders, no meditate button with spell book open, weightless currency, 1k stack tradeskill items, daybreak store with xp potions, in-game maps, no heck levels, no racial/class penalties, /melody, /autofire, /autoskill, bandoliers, (mischief) random loot, 3-5x loot drops, (vaniki) no resist checks based on level

??

Honestly I don't even know what most of those things are. I assume those are things added to EQ since I quit long ago or maybe specific to TLP (which I haven't played outside of P99). Also, I did say "core gameplay mechanics" so not sure spellbook or currency weight etc...would be classified as that. Now that you mention it I would be against things like weightless currency (though I don't think this is a core mechanic). These little things separate EQ from all the other bland MMOs out there. I'm also very much against XP potions (not just in EQ but in general). XP potions and other cash shop garbage is literally what made me quit EQ2 and has mostly kept me away from retail EQ. One of the big benefits of P99 IMO.

Also, I'm not saying some things shouldn't change where necessary. I know they added instancing for some raids (again this happened after I quit). I would say this is a core mechanic change. In general I think this is very much against the spirit of EQ. However, I do recognize that EQ in it's current aged state may need this and the fact that EQ has a lot of open world targets seems like a reasonable compromise. That being said I haven't personally experienced this arrangement.

what are you doing here then? trolling?

anything that is quality of life will affect core gameplay mechanics.
original ui, with your spell book open, you had no idea if a roamer was upon you, till you get aggro and get hit.
currency weight being gone allows you to stack up all that cash and not have to see a bank or destroy copper/silver in order to move around at normal speed (or not affect AC as a monk). you are a p99'er - i know people still take fine steel, copper in exchange for plat in remote locations.
both of these changes affected core gameplay.

I was considering trying out a TLP server. Is it also against the new EQ rules that someone who actually enjoyed EQ in it's original form have an opinion on that or are we all just trolls now?

That's your opinion. There are gameplay mechanics and core gameplay mechanics. Sure it's debatable what falls into "core" and what doesn't but that doesn't mean all mechanics are "core" to EQ. The spellbook change you mention was changed very early in EQ development to the point that it was still in the "classic" EQ era. It was overall a good change. Please refer to my original comment where I never said mechanics should *never* be changed. If it's broken or doesn't work well or is somehow detrimental to the game by all means fix or change it. However, if it's not broken and only serves to make EQ more "modern" like all other MMOs I am not in favor of that. Just my opinion.

All of those mechanics are available on all Everquest servers and some of them started out on the TLP servers before moving to live.

Really great points, being unable to help people who are dying is a big deal. It's one of the defining things in MMO's, the social aspect. I can't even begin to count how many times my has been saved by someone wandering by, or how many times I've jumped in to help someone.

If everyone is just doing their own thing, it could be a bad thing. And then there is the problem if superfast bards...

I play a SK, and sometimes pulls are complicated and take a long time. Like if your trying to peel out an NPC from a few guards. Or a raid boss from their guards. I can see this being a headache

I still like the idea of making rare spawn epic mobs or key type mobs free tag. With a random roll for personal loot for anyone who hits and making the corpse not lootable by anyone that didnt tag it. There should be a chance of NOT getting loot and balancing that out obviously.

The times ive been camping a cleric epic mob and had to wait days to get the camp ooof. Usually held by a mage box team to sell.

i apologize for calling you a troll

tlp's are far from original form - your opinion on messing with core mechanics is fine, i simply pointed out that there have been a large amount of changes, and fte isn't out of line with the other things other tlp's have done when addressing "core mechanics."

Just watched a video of the FTE in action on the test server. Seems like it is utterly broken. Guards no longer help if you train mobs to the guards apparently? I'm sure trolls won't run huge trains into noob city areas or anything. Nah they would never do that! FTE also complicates the social aspect of helping people in trouble. I get what they are trying to do but I think this is an example where the original core concept (including the downsides) is still better than the fix (that has worse downsides).

Yep there does appear to be a lot about it that is broken and it is not ready for a live server.