Yay for comparing two completely unrelated items? The sash has a much higher drop rate and LGuk many more picks than SolB, but yeah, you’re right, they are completely the same. I camped the efreeti on Agnarr too. At one point my guild held 3 picks of efreeti and held of all the boxers as a mini raid. We did that for a full day, rotating people in and out. Saw 5 rings in 24 hours of holding 3 picks. My single group here got 3 sashes and we spent maybe 7 hours combine total at frenzy. The ring is rare, and just because it’s not hard to get the camp doesn’t mean it’s not hard to get the ring. Welcome to Everquest, where you can camp something for 12+ hours and never see it drop.
It's simple. There x amount of rings that drop. Those rings go somewhere (none are really going to rot..). If someone is there with 6 characters boxing, it takes x of those rings. Unless your arguing there are frequently uncamped Efreetis...and thank god the 6 boxers are there to camp them!...pretty ridicules considering the threshold for the pick. So one person is getting items for themselves that normally take multiple people to get, quite logically making it that much more difficult for everyone else on the server, particularly those that can't get hold the camp down themselves. This increased difficulty to get the item makes people more willing to buy it and less willing to camp it. You have to come up with a very good reason why it doesn't logically follow that 6 boxing drives the price of items up. Some anecdotes about 3 sashes dropping in 7 hours doesn't cut it. Sashes are probably more common...they are also far more necessary for the classes that need them then the rings are. All int casters can get a robe instead. Wis casters can use Mithril-Runed Tunic. Pure Melee is unlikely to spend that krono for 35 more hp and agi. While it is true that the sash is more common...its probably is not that much more common. According to EQ magelo they have the same drop rate...the primary difference is efreeti is less popular for leveling and less spawn accordingly. Also, 6 boxers avoid sash camps generally because they are less profitable (no efreeti boots, lower level mobs less pp) and more drama.
My gripe is that 6-boxers drive item prices up. and then they come on the forums and to deny it and talk about the business viability of NO-BOX servers.
@green_mage Can you imagine a brand new tlp? with 0 boxers and only individual players ? I have imagined what that would be like and here is my example : I imagine a baron wasteland of people in all zones that do not benefit them. ( Low ZEM , no loot value ) Meaning : high value loot camps will be even more contested then they are on a Tru Box Server. So, that first 1 to 2 weeks of the server.. you can imagine the price to stay 2 times as long as it did on Coirnav. So you think the premade guild groups / cliche groups will sell items @ a lower price than a person 6 boxing it ? You must not have played on Agnarr / Ragefire / TLPs. 5+ mage boxes at each high value spot in Classic for Ragefire. 2-3 + Mage boxes at each high value spot during classic on Agnarr /// + ALL EPIC Multi quests. Coirnav does not have a problem with boxing, if you truly think that. You must not have experianced any other TLP's
We've already established that efreeti camps were harder to get on Agnarr. I think we all agree there was more boxing on Agnarr. Could there be some causation here perhaps? Considering how completely illogical it is to assume boxers lower prices on easy to farm loot...it just doesn't follow. I get it, you box and you want to box on every tlp, and the idea of a new and exciting no-box server that proves more popular...would basically spell the end for this "true box" charade....wouldn't it? It's fine. It's not like I hate you iRL for it.
you actuallydon't need to imagine it. P99 is a no bix server and, well, a lot of people love it despite velious locked for 4 or 5 years? Boxers can really impact the economy. Look at The King on agnarr... he may have been single handedly responsible for, i think, both the idol nerf and the bam nerf. If a game is set up a certain way then people are going to play to win. That's not going to change.
Coirnav has more people on it than P99 does and it is being called a failure. A TLP server launching with P99s population would be a failure.
Another fix would be to make charmed pets, like players, unable to be dispelled by players outside of your grp. Cancel magic is quite nice for removing dots if you buff right but outside of your own group you cannot just dispel other players. Of course at the same time they would have to consider all the named mobs people might use charm to contend and code them so that they could not be charmed. Why is it other players can strip mods of all your dots, roots, snares and charms? Dispelling mobs another player is attacking is not a DPS. It's no dmg what so ever and only leads to this kind of grief. Maybe the other solution is just to remove all these items from game because it's very clear that the main reason people resort to this behavior is idea that they are gaining something. We don't need these classic items, they are not that great and every single one of them gets replaced. The easiest solution is going to be the best. "There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it. Although that way may not be obvious at first unless you're Dutch. Now is better than never. Although never is often better than *right* now. If the implementation is hard to explain, it's a bad idea. If the implementation is easy to explain, it may be a good idea. Namespaces are one honking great idea -- let's do more of those!", The Zen Of Python.
So an entire group of enchanters can lock down 6 named in a zone where no one can dispell them? Do you not see the way people can exploit this?
Not an argument because as somebody else pointed out just make named mobs unaffected by charm, that's already being exploited. Maybe as a coder this seems simple to me and as the "The Zen of Python" states; find the simple solution and implement it. You got all these exploits; some effect other players, some effect game play. Ones that are being used to grief your fellow adventure should be dealt with.
Make efreeti loot no drop. Oh you want it on your twink? Just have him loot it when he loots the rokyl mask too. 2 birds with 1 stone.
Best thing imo... Make the nameds and the highest level mobs in a zone uncharmable. Make so when a players cast dispell on a charmed mob, the person who does the dispell dies, and send back to origin. The charmed mob is no longer charmed and should then get a flag on that prevents from being charmed by any for the next 10 min. This should solve too mobs being charmed and the dispell problem too.
Well giving dispel a high agro modifier would work. At least dispelling couldn't be used as a way to get somebody kill. It would be use as a way for tanks to hold agro though, just need to have pumice. Everything you do will effect something. If dispel has high agro then dispelling dots and snares will have an effect, if the player wants to contend the mob they shouldn't mind the agro.
i think making every named uncharmable is a good step It will hurt though when you cant charm guk assassin because he back stabs like a champ, but you also can't charm gate uguk croc which is a grief point. The net of not being able to charm named is probably good though and people will adapt to slightly less dps. Also, mobs already have a rare flag so making them non charmable seems easy. Another exception might be rare quest mobs that sometimes need to be charmed. At the end of the day, i think if a dev just went through and made precision charges to uber toxic spots in classic to luclin they could made a huge amount of progress just cherry picking the easy stuff.
All of this is because of one thing ... Krono DBG needs to release a server that has no Krono allowed... Before you say that won't change anything... Rift just did this with their progression server... No Rex ( Thier form of Krono) Minimal Cash shop - Hairstyles and services like character rename, and a few pet re-skins Subscription Required Most Items droppable It is thriving, so much they have had to make architectural system changes to handle the overload, and it is becoming more and more overloaded....
No krono would help... but people still have all the same problems just less of them. Ill be the first to agree that on new tlp the krono farm drive is strong... but, not everyone who is a dirtbag is a krono farmer. Beyond that, dbg doesn't seem to be doing anything innovative if their latest brain trust came up with a staggering phinny 2.0 with worse exp.
