[Suggestion] [Woodman] A Tale of KOTV, the NC and TR. Never ending story?

Hello Fellas!

There are basically four factions. Endless Moneyspenders, Spandex-Wearers, silly Miners - and always owned by their diverse own dictatorships, the TR.

So, let me see how to explain it.

KOTV (or should I still say "the Vanus"?), is basically the biggest outfit wearing the purple spandex. They're what Smurf Gods are for the NC and what ELME/CORE used to be for the TR.

Okay. I've been playing the game since the beta was launched. Now, only following the forums and reddit, I've noticed that basically nothing has changed. Even on the server -> nothing has changed. Peoples are still complaining about overpowered stuff, while they've basically no idea about what to do against that issue.

Let's sum up what advantages faction have at the moment!

The Vanu Society - I wouldn't even call it Sovereignty anymore

• No recoil.
• No bullet drop. (Overall, not talking about SlugGuns or BoltRifles.)
• High rate of fire.
• Very mobile Mag-Riders.
• Very mobile ESFs.

There's that. So, it seems to be as for the most NC guys - which have been recently buffed - and the TR, there is basically only one method to bear it: Complaining.

These complaints are addressed to Woodmans biggest VS outfit, the Keepers of the Void. Because, tons of spandex running around with strong weapons equally means: We've barely a chance. Sure, no one is willing to admit it, but it's a fact. No matter if Ingame-Chat or Reddit, people are always complaining about "huge zergfits of the VS" getting splashed into every kind of battle.

Hurray.

To continue writing about this, we've to come now to the point of the TR.
In the beginnings of Woodman, they were basically those, which were generating huge zergfits. After that, the NC had those zergfits.

Now, at the time I write this, both NC and TR don't have that kind of "zergfits" anymore. They're basically splitten in a huge variation of outfits, filling each other with tons of **** instead of cooperating together. Well, I know the NC on Woodman was always behind the idea of doing huge cooperations between outfits and still are practicing that. But not as much as before. The idea of the NC of setting up huge coop-operations is getting a "huge zergfit" being effective at the same time. You know, including tactical stuff and whatever is needed to be even MORE effective than braindead VS zombies running into fire. Last but not least, let us remember that those VS zombies follow orders and have been always indoctrinated, that being defeated is not an option.
When it comes to the TR... Well. "Strenght through Unity". In my opinion it should be removed for Woodman. There is basically no unity. It's only a fest of making jokes about other outfits and in the end, there is at the moment no outfit able set up an own platoon. Means, without randoms. There is barely an outfit able to even set up more than three squads yet. Possibly I'm just blind, but that's my feedback during the holidays.

Anyways, there is one question I've asked myself:
"If your main enemy is getting stronger - and even stronger and stronger and stronger, because it not only has advantages based on it's race, but ALSO enough numbers to throw into the battle, what would you do?"

Example given:
The VS is going to warpgate the NC. We mobilize about two full platoons to help the NC at the Stronghold. I mean, it wasn't even connected - means: We couldn't take it!
What did the NC? Yeh, bingo. Attack us at the spot, where we were basically erradicating the VS - instead of the VS/Stronghold itself. Someone might please explain me the logic behind this, because I don't get it. The most logical step would have been: Instead attacking the faction which is helping me, I sort out the bigger problem: The VS.

But that doesn't seems to arrive at the miners head nowadays. They just think about drilling, that's the issue.

TL;DR


Dear Terran Republic on Woodman, dear New Conglomerate on Woodman:

Instead of fighting each other by trying to define which is the better outfit, get together and set up even bigger cooperations. Being at the same faction, you shouldn't care about how braindead other outfits are, as long as they barely follow the same objectives and their related orders!

Currently you're constantly talking crap like:

• "Uh, ELME and CORE - a huge brainless bunch."
  Yes, they might be brainless, but they used to have the NUMBERS, which you NEED to be successfull! Having them to your side is always positive - even if they are, like many say, brainless! It increases totally your rate of success.

I like the idea of 2CA, 208, EDT - but still, dear leaders, you don't have enough numbers to do solo operations. Yet, if you do, your members are going to be frustrated because of senseless tries. Even a blind guy can see that. Yeh, you might be able to have some kind of success, because of winning 2 / 10 fights. But that's simply not enough.You'll see that your members are going to leave, because it's like you don't care about your members. Learn to share responsibility and charges, so your outfit can grow up. Do NOT try to "train" your people on about how to take a base. Just post in your forums clearly the basics of how the game works and THAT THEY'VE TO RESPOND TO REQUESTS. If they don't want to, they'll leave in the end. Anyways, they'll end up in some kind of a "huge zergfit", which will benefit you aswell, because they'll be there to clear up ****. They're hot for success being a part of the mass <- THIS IS THE POINT WHERE THE GAME CLEARLY STATES AND USES AS SLOGAN: SIZE. ALWAYS. MATTERS.(Not only in sexual terms.)
The same **** is basically also thought for outfits in the NC.

So, what to do?

1. Set up a ring of outfits.
2. Define clearly in a meeting, which roles are outfits going to take when it comes to operations.
3. Stop being dicks to each other.
4. Stop comparing the size of your virtual dicks.
   No matter if it's related to the gameplay style or anything else.
5. If one faction is the flavour of the month - basically - just get in touch with the other affected faction, by declaring some kind of cooperation like: "TR attacks from the north to the south-western, NC from the eastern to the south". Bet my *** if you gate the VS once every day, you'll see how fast the pop decreases, setting it back to a normal level. Because outfits like KOTV get pretty fast demotivated if they get humillated every single day. Seen this before in Smurf Gods - and also in ELME and CORE.

But please, if you're not going to do this, just stop complaining and stop trying to be a part of the huge drama, that the VS is apparently OP or whatever. They're OP because of teamwork based on NUMBERS. It's clear that you're not going to be successfull if you aren't even able to set up cooperations between your own faction outfits.

That is not a tl;dr, that's another post in itself.

Sorry for that

You want less VS on woodman? Play outside of 3-4 primetime hours! We are hovering around 30% server pop during the day; and the scales are swinging wildly during mornings.
Sure, one uncontrollably large outift, like enclave, can ruin the experience for everybody, but I don't think the problem is that sharp now.

Oblomoff.. I call BS on that. I play a lot and what happens still, is, KOTV. What you're suggesting is not a solution, it's splintering the population further. Do you WANT to be playing on your own? Once you max out your Certs what will you do with those weapons? Fire them at the WG? TK for fun?

There can be no player based solution to this.

"Possibly I'm just blind..."

Yes you are. The whole post seems to be written by someone that has only based his view on what's posted on reddit or written in yell chat.

KOTV is playerbased.

Exactly.

Oh - Andrew? I accept your opinion on me.
It sounds so much like I've no idea about what woodman or even this game is.
Well, you'd wonder how wrong you are.

No, I meant we can't solve the problem of KOTV having being created. We don't have enough people during Alerts, because they join KOTV and their allies. We can't regulate who joins who, why nor when. So the problem IS created by players but the rest of us can't solve it. Time of logging should not be the solution, and is in fact not. Sorry for the "BS" comment, I'm just pissed at the situation.

You're totally right on that. Anyways, even if all those people switch their alt, doesn't means we haven't enough people to counter - because, we have! Thing is just, that outfits are going for their own story and business. If they would work together, you'll match the amount of players KOTV throw when an Alert or a certain operation comes up.

It's all based on communication between outfits. There is also no need to pressure the members in your outfit, by giving any kind of activity times. It would be already enough, if outfits actively consider what's written in /leaders and respond to it's requests. I mean, if all outfit leaders of the TR would come together, let's say we've about 20 ruling the bigger and / or active outfits - I guess everyone can memorize 20 guys. If someone of those request your help, just pop up the map, take a look on it, confirm it, respond to it with action.

Believe me: Your fun will drastically increase if all fight together for one goal.

I don't know who you talk to on command chat, but from my experience when the right outfit leaders are on TR do rather well.

The OP makes it seem like all Woodman TR are in disarray, but this is not the case either. Yesterday we won the territory Alert on Indar, lost the Amp station alert and then had a draw on the Bio lab Alert which from where I was standing took a lot of inter outfit coordination to pull off.

I know a lot of the other outfit leaders and we have a set day of the week when we all use the same Alliance TS3 channel and make a point of working together. Your post indicates that you are probably not privy to this info, I personally think we should do this more than the set times we do but that's just my opinion.

Yes you are correct in the fact that TR has no zergfit to speak of, but you miss some important points.

The first is the difference in the level of communication and coordination it takes for one person to move 5 platoons about the map (KOTV) compared to five or six leaders form the TR side of things. This makes it difficult but rewarding when things go to plan for us.

You also talk of platoons with random players being ineffective on the field but under a good PL this is also a false statement, I usually have 2/3 outfit squads and the rest made up of other players that are not in 2CA. However on the Alliance events we start a 2nd platoon and start to build these early before the event starts. I often see the same players again and again returning to play in my platoon even tho they are not in my outfit, and let me tell you these players are great players with high BR's like Vhoble, Thundinator , Thanesolo just to name a few.

You also state that everyone will leave because of the VS situation this is also not the case because 2CA is still picking up new members every week. And Although we have to fight our socks off to get a draw and sometimes a win for the TR the individual battles working towards this goal is what keeps my outfit members active and engaged.

You speak of Not training anyone or just having a list of what to do.......This I also have to disregard I'm afraid. There is no substitute for experience in taking bases. With 2 tight outfit squads well adapt at the mechanics of the game I could breeze past double our numbers in randoms with poor leadership. This is because everything happens so fast and everyone knows their roll and what needs to be done, and in what order. This is not achieved by reading a few pointers on a forum, this only works by playing the game together and people knowing who is at their side.

Yes numbers do matter in this game but where TR are concerned I think its not the numbers on the server its just the numbers taking part in Alerts. Lots have become disheartened but when we all pull together, I think there is a lot to be hopeful about.

I for one take part in every Alert when I'm online and I will do until I'm the last TR on the server.

What your post also lacks is any real understanding of the forums and reddit because all the forumsiders that complain about OP stuff are usually not outfit leaders or individuals that have anything to do with the running of the factions on the server. But instead players that don't work with others or are new to the game so things will always feel OP from their standpoint.

I would say two things just to close my post:

Firstly please try and do a little research next time or talk to a few outfit leaders before posting a one size fits all brush stroke to solve every factions problems, the TR leaders on Woodman put a lot of effort into working together and building up relationships for the future of TR on Woodman.

Secondly a positive approach is what we need, we should all open our platoons during alerts and actively encourage more TR to take part. This will help us to move the right amount of players to where they are needed.

But most importantly TR remember we DO WIN Alerts, it can be done if we ALL participate for our faction.

Stacy the problem lies in your last statement, "If all TR participate for OUR Faction". You mean well, but clearly this would fall on deaf ears even if 80% of the players actually did browse the Forums. KOTV is established more than any other 'Fit on Woodz and that's not changing- Sheep will be sheep. I don't mind a 2:1, or the occasional 3:1 but having to fight off 5 or 6 to 1 of usis frustrating. Ever played "Jenga"? The moment some of the TR decide for any reason that we're losing the Alert, jumping on their VS, we crumble, because the rest follow soon after. If what you say is right how come we're still in the same situation? All this talk about gathering, organizing, countering, striving? Where's the result of that then? Ever since I first met you, dropping you at that Tower in Amerish in the 1st ever Galaxy I had pulled, things only got worse and there's no sign of improvement. You don't have to answer for TR's failures so I shouldn't be directing my questions to you; I'm waiting for SOE's move on this and not just on our Server... There are others were the TR are the local "KOTV", none of us should have to take this lightly. It IS having an impact on PS2, new players joining or not.

Well, it wouldn't be that hard - to be honest - to just set up a

• Coordinator channel (Teamspeak)
  -> Coordinator
  -> Platoon Leaders
• Channel for Squad-Leaders
  -> Platoon Leaders have Whisper rights for Squad Leader's Channel
• Squad leaders give orders / information to their squads through IG-Voice.

We did that pretty often, when I was playing with my NC alt.

Simply NO. I didn't say random players aren't effective. I always said, the more random players, the more effective they are, since they take a huge influence.

No, I do not state that "everyone will leave". I just say, that people which get demotivated are even more encourage to start playing on a different alt for a different faction.

There is no big science behind Planetside 2. If you show someone what to do, assign a certain role to him, he'll try to follow it. But since in real life, things aren't simply like 2+2 = 4. Situations on a battlefield have their own dynamics, that for people will just follow orders. It's like it has been for thousands of years, based on real life experience. If you just show them the basic paradigms, they'll follow them the best they can - period. If something goes wrong, there is a specific interaction required from the leader, because otherwise you'll just throw them again and again. People end up with arguments like: "Why the **** am I doing this?".

At this point you seem to have figured out what the post is about.

That's simply not true. There are many players with a high battle rank, also leaders, which clearly state that there is "soooo much OPness". Please, don't try to say something else - just speak for yourself in this case.

Oh, I did my research yesterday night pretty well. Yet, to be honest, compared to the times about 6-7 months ago, they've been several steps going into the wrong direction. Otherwise we wouldn't have got to the current status.

Bingo.

I mean, honestly. At GODS best times, while co-leading the entire outfit, seriously... We were table rockers. We got the same **** thrown at our heads like KOTV, CORE and ELME. Yet GODS has about 6.300 members, but it lacks of active platoon leaders. Guess that problem is also what CORE and ELME got. We used to have to entire platoons full of GODS elite + 3 random squads, which were also part of GODS. Worked great. And for the times we managed to do coop with other outfits, seriously. VS POP -> 9% was the record on Woodman. TR POP -> always hovering around > 15%. So, no one should please tell me that it couldn't be done on a fair good way.

By the way Stacy, it's great you get everyday new members - How many you got yet?

Well since the thread is pretty much about getting TR/NC outfits to combine and work together, i dont see the downside. I'm pretty sure both NC/TR do this tho. What i also dislike about your post is that you try to make claims that VS are barely holding their own due to weak weapons and whatnot. This isn't true, i've played all 3 factions for a decent amount of time and i find it pretty balanced (now more than ever).

The issue i see is that KoTV show up to a 50/50 fight then just throw lots of people in the base. This is rather unfun for the receiving end because you pretty much ruined the fight.

In the end of the day tho, KoTV are better and whether its due to numbers or tactics is irrelevant. TR/NC outfits need to get together


Tl;dr
I agree. Ignore my strange rambling

Kunavi I totally agree with your previous statement that players should not be able to switch characters during Alerts, its SOE's fault anyways for letting people have multiple characters on the same server. But the TR do win alerts even against the might of KOTV. We only do this when everyone is working together and supporting each other, its difficult to stay positive I know. I'm not aiming to reach all Woodman TR on these forums, it has to be done in game.
But we have to keep a positive angle on things so we can make them better, my statement was a counter to the OP and an attempt to shine a light for TR.

I can only hope that less people will flip over during an alert, but as you say not all players have the same dedication to their faction as us. But ill keep slugging away with those that have .

That for, you'll have to get more members or people interested into participating on alerts constantly. I mean, let's take a look on your outfit, just as an example.

You've 120 guys. I definitely have my doubts, when it comes to get more than 25 guys together. After reviewing the stats through the PS2-API, you aren't even able to fill up a whole platoon at the same time - only with your guys, yet. I do NOT say, that you aren't going to be able to do this, but at the moment, it's simply a true fact.

Same problem happens for many other outfits.

So, to fill up a whole platoon you basically need two outfits, meeting your current standards. There is no need to say clearly that it's not enough, aye? If you've won the alerts, then it was because of the lack of numbers on the field, which made the fight fairer. I mean, KOTV couldn't be there 24/7 - even when they're currently trying.

Definitely. But tell me - how much times during the last week did we've won alerts? Let me help you with that. 8 times. How many alerts show up per day? There you get your feedback.

There is actually nothing to counter my post, honestly. Guess you've missed the point, where people aren't willing to admit the way it currently is. But it is exactly this way.

I like the idea of setting up outfits. But seriously, in the end we'll have about 1000 outfits with lesser than 50 active members per day. Hurray hurray. There is nothing negative in my post, just try to figure out what I mean with this last sentence.

NC spotted

IamDH ...lol I've got TR written through me like a stick of rock...............not got any alt characters.

Yeah we do have 120 players, but can field 2 platoons and that's because other players trust me to lead them and give them an enjoyable gaming experience (you can still kick **** even if you lose the alert overall). As you can see we have 13x BR 100 players in the outfit that are great SL's.
Players join my platoon because they know I can run a tight ship, and as soon as I put it on the board there are plenty of TR willing to take part.

Yes the other factions are under the weight of the VS and have been for a while sprintfox I'm not saying otherwise, I agree with you that the small outfits should merge into some of the bigger ones on the server to help with the problem. I'm all for this or at a the start of an alert those outfits with only squads form into platoons with other outfits.

This has been suggested before.........and I for one would be willing to take on some smaller outfits.

Here's the KOTV formula:
Step A: Get a handful of decent/active PL's and SL's.
Step B: Run pub platoons consistently every night. Spam invites.
Step C: Encourage people to join on TS and become leaders. Train them.
Step D: Repeat step B and C.

Step C is what people usually forget.
Each platoon requires 5 people. So 5 platoons is 25 people + coordinators. Not that many really. You can even run with pub SL's in a pinch.

The reason you see KOTV everywhere is because they mass spam invites to EVERYBODY.
So yeah, when some random zerg shoots you, it says KOTV...because so many randoms are in KOTV, but they're not necessarely playing with KOTV.

They play VS, they go where they are told by KOTV, so they are necessarily playing with KOTV. What were you trying to say?