why should i play any other class? [HA Rant!]

No1 ever said it did.......
OP said, why should i play any other class. he didnt say, why should my squd bring more than 1 engineer.
Believe it or not, squad builds are important, you want to have a majority with the ability to kill, its the main object of the game, unless you want an MMORockPaperScissors game its going to involve killing the enemy.
Taking more of the main assault class is to be exected, you dont take 6 healers 2 ranged fighters and 0 tanks with you in an RPG, why should that be viable in an FPS?
Support classes are for supporting the main fighters, I seriously dont understand what the ******* problem is.

Yes considered, but honestly, do you use HA for this?
Not engineer for repairs or infil for cloak?
If you rely on other engineers for repairs, then its not really the HA doing it, its a combination of classes keeping it going.

Firstly what stalkish says... Secondly I actually wonder what would happen if games like Mario or Mega man were released now not years ago, when back then thing you call support almost didn't existed (no stupid forums just pricy telephone line usually supported in native language somewhere on the other side of the Ocean)... More than that everybody were adapting to game regulations and settings and were using them as advantage for example there was certain type of ammo you could pick up in Contra, that made you feel OP, did people cried then oh nerf it to the ground ! I can't finish the game while my pal can ! baaahh....

I use the flash to find out where enemies are coming from - especially useful in low density fights. Driving it as infiltrator makes no sense, since wraith and radar go in the same slot. Instead, I use the flash to charge to my enemies, unload rip Fury Renegade, and get off to finish the stragglers or dodgers (or if flash decide to make random 360s).

Sometimes I do it as medic too, for AoE healing (triage), quick transport to corpses and radar support on the backline.

In either case, I abandon the flash when it starts smoking. Usually I die before that point, so I don't really need engineers.

It all comes back to this really, there never should have been "main combat class" in the first place. All of the classes should of had a reasonably equal chance of killing each other, whilst being good at some things and bad at others. Having the Tank & the DPS in the same class to use your MMORPG example was a mistake and makes the other DPS & Healer/DPS classes less useful.

SoE made the choice to give one class a flat advantage in combat, so everyone plays this class as is evident by the HA usage numbers the further you go up the Battle Ranks with infiltrator & LA falling off.

In my experience it's not quite that simple all the time. Sure snipers are lethal and at long range. But as an infil and as an LA I hunt snipers. Very few use a suppressor, so they show on the minimap when they shoot. And even when they are suppressed, they fire tracer rounds like other classes. Some move after taking a shot but they rarely move very far. And when I find one he is dead (counter sniped or carbined to hell).

Stalking is fun, no argument there. If you get the drop on someone, say on his own, not moving or whatever then he gets pistol whipped. But getting close enough for effective pistol action when other enemie sare around or the target is alert and mobile is a different story. And if he doesn't go down in the first shot or two for any reason then he has a good chance of getting you instead - an automatic weapon and maybe an overshield as well beats a pistol every time.

TL;DR Infil gets the drop on you then you are dead. You see him first and he is very dead.

... played engy today (as it is my main anyways) and kicked a fair ammount of as s with my AI mana turret .. and AV mines ..
and honestly doing that and still being able to support squads and tanks/vehicles i had much more fun than purely fighting as HA ...
the problem i have with HA while it has the firepower neccesary to deal with most things its lower speed with shields and ADS over the other classes is what gets me killed most of the time especialy with the latency issues the game has .. so i rather sacrifice firepower and surviveability to being more versatile and retain some speed ...
i´m eyeballing with playing LA cause i like its mobility .. infil is just not my cup of tea because i´m too impatient with the stealthmechanics ... maxes require too much certs to be intresting/effective for early play ..

A large group is annoying, but the shield is definitely not overpowered. They have a specific role, and they're okay at it. Next people will go back to screaming LA with C4 is OP or Stalker Infil Pistol Knife combos, or whatever. It has a specific role it fills, yes it gets over played and that sucks at times, but they sacrifice mobility or revives or other abilities. Every class has an opportunity cost, even heavies who burn through ammo like a mofo and typically get shot at by everyone within 50m because they're big glowing targets (and that shield only blocks like 4 shots. Not 4 shots from 10 different people)

it often depents on were you are fighting like out in the open i can´t count how many times i get killed by snipers than eating rockets because how stationary i was ... while indoors ... realy i get killed by all sorts of things ... .. of course i can only speak for my own experience ..

so yea my personal nemesis are mostly sniperinfils ..

I know you think Infiltrators are greatly important for Recon Detection Device. So why haven't you played them and used Recon Detection Device?

Recon Detection Device does not have infinite Ammo. There is no "unlimited spam of radar blips". I've shot about 30,000 of them myself, and I did that mostly a long time ago.

Motion spotter covers 50 meters. Scout Flash 100. Scout ESF 200. Sitting on a parked Scout Radar ESF (Scout Radar Flash is good too) in the basement of a BioLab is much more effective... and I've done that a lot too.

It's a superior Radar platform that is available to non-Infiltrators.

So the standout value of an LA is putting a Beacon on the tip of an Antenna? Can't the player just then switch classes once it's in place? And this is also useless outside of 1 person's role in Squad play?

Oh, also: "organised spam cheese", boo.

Ammo Printer will follow you... everywhere. Engineer *maybe* drops an Ammo Pack, and they will do it in some giant mass of bodies at some trvial to get to location (like in the doorway inside a Warpgate). To get an Ammo Pack that follows you around, you are gonna need your own pet Engineer. That is not a reality for most players.

I *wish* I could agree with that. That these new Implants were some far off thing that would sit in the Dev minds or on Test Server for years and maybe never get implemented. But I think it's pretty clear that they intend to release them, and do it pretty soon. So unfortunately, that means we should consider them for discussion.

Look, I am saying it's just not that frequent a thing for the average player. It happens, just not often. It's more of a smaller group holding the Cap vs. a bigger force.

And again, we are looking at something that's mostly focused on Organized Hardcore Gameplay. And yes, that and many of their tactics are just "spam cheese" or otherwise stacking OP gimmicks/crutches. I don't blame them for that, I blame the Devs that don't give them more great ways to effectively play the game.

Focus and Vampire don't seem HA at all. Focus seems Infil Sniper sidegame fun, and Vampire seems Infil Stalker sidegame fun.

The rest (80%) seem all good for HA. And more than that, they seem all good for this closer range, head-to-head, follow-the-lattice, style of combat the HA is great at. In fact I personally think two big reason the HA is outperforming as a class, is that (1) lattice reduces flank play (trooper is coming from one general direction, enemy trooper knows they are coming from that direction), and (2) the lack of dominance/role of Infantry in spaces between bases (moving more Infantry fights to the close-medium range that HA excel at).

Then I guess all those people whining about how hard it was to get specific implants just have a different perspective. Or maybe you just got lucky in your Combines.

I looked at the old system of click grinding and random rewards. I found it horrible to try to get anything specific at the top tier, and I wasn't even a person who was fiending for any specific top tier Implant. I personally stopped using Implants a LONG time ago: annoying and give me an unreachable, unfair advantage over many others that I don't like.

I'm not an Implant guy. I'm not a Hardcore Organized Group guy. I guess I play Hard Mode.

Because it goes against the idea of teamwork and specialization? Why do you think tanks have to choose between AP and HE, and can't just randomly switch between the two with a stroke of the mousewheel?

An AT specialist should not be effective at all against infantry, and an AI-focused soldier should not be good against vehicles. This is an excellent balance strategy adopted by most RTS games to introduce balance. If the enemy deploys mass AT infantry, you counter with AI infantry. If the enemy sends in droves of AI infantry, you hit them with tanks.

In PS2 the problem is that a single unit is effective against both infantry and vehicles. That leads to a balance nightmare, where you really can't effectively counter that unit at all.

No it's just a no brain capacity compare to the "tactic" class and i think that's what irritate people the most with the HA, the class ruin their gameplay by just pressing a touch.
You see, when you play LA and get on a roof or infiltrator and use your cloack for getting behind someone, those tactics don't work by pressing a touch... You have to watch your map, know the base, avoid enemy on the way, make sure you have enough cloack left for attacking and choose the good place to be for a successful ambush.
Even if you manage to make that happen and attack the HA, you're not sure if your tactic is going to work because he can just press a single touch an absorb the damage of your advantage...
Of course you're still going to be able to kill lower skill HA than you by doing it but that doesn't mean the use of tactic is going to help you against same or higher skill player than you.
The only question left is to know if it's "fair" to be able to bypass tactic and also have more advantage when you have the upper hand by just pressing a touch?
I guess you need class like that in a game so even low skill players can make a few kills otherwise it's not fun for everyone.

This game isn't designed around 1v1s though, it's designed around at least a squad or so fighting, which means you're more than likely not the only person shooting at the Heavy. You're role goes from killing him, to harassing him and either getting the kill, or the assist. Once he activates that whopping ~450 damage bullet sponge (again like 4 bullets) he's a bullet magnet to almost always at least 3 people.

yes a LA or ENG could take out a ground vehicle faster the default heavy but there are some loadouts that let you take one out almost as fast and allow you to kill the driver or gunner who decides to hop out and fight you 1 on 1.

yes a infiltrator can use detect bolts to spot, they can scout ahead and snipe but so can a heavy. so can any class for that matter well maybe not snipe on a LA but Medic and ENG yep. does slugs on a shotgun count as sniping? i don't think so

can a heavy heal? nope. can it repair? nope. but lets face it anything you need to repair probably has auto repair on it anyways, and if you are getting shot at that much there is an implant that does the healing for you. that or use med-kits plus you could respawn at the nearest spawn in 5sec anyways...3....2....1... ok back to shooting, the point of this whole thread is to point out that there is no reason to switch classes, the negatives far out way the bonuses

sarcasm: "great i can heal" but as soon as i round that corner that heavy assault is going to kill me and compared to him i'm sub par due to the lack of BS shield. plus how many times have you walked up to revive an friendly and just have them respawn anyways or you end up chain reviving cause they are being camped

sarcasm: "yay i can repair things and put down mines" that the enemy then spots with ease or blocks cause heavy shield. and me like many other people have auto repair on every vehicle including max as friendly's are more then likely friendly fire you're ***, as most of them are heavy's anyway.

the shield is such a versatile ***** that every other class is worth nothing compared to it. it can block fall damage, reduce damage from small arms, reduce damage from explosives and prevent you from dying to a tank shell. joke: "but wait there is more it can open any can or bottle with ease and clean your whole house and pets with no effort required"

here is what i want you to go do. go play planetside 2 in the middle of the night off peak hours or play on Hossin using any other class then heavy and see how well you do. when you do come across a heavy one of 2 things will happen 1.you get a very bad player who you can easily kill no problem no matter what class your using or 2. you get a good if not extremely good player who will steam roll you, yes you may get one or 2 kills on them with a AP mine or other trap of that nature but they are going to learn and learn quick.


yes i get that the game is supposed to be 100+ players Versus 100+ players but it isnt like that all the time so. just do it for 30mins to see where i'm coming from and why i ******* hate this class.

Some people who are complaining do not want a game with 1 main class, and multiple support classes. They want a game where ALL classes are main, and ALL classes support each other.

Some people who are complaining just don't like 1 class to be so dominant in the core aspect of the game: FPS combat across most encounter types.

Some others want more Classes to have range AV/AA.

Some others DO want separate combat class vs. dedicated support classes, but they want for those support roles to be so (1) important, (2) needed, and (3) rewarded, such that equal numbers of all Classes show up on the battlefield. They want that classes can't just obsolete each other through Certing/Implants/MedKits/etc. And they want the best abilities to be sorted out to the differnt classes, not just all stockpiled on 1 "main" class. They want combined arms.

Oh yes, I´m always surrounded by my two bodyguards.

people using auto reopair doesn´t mean much .. that bit of heal that you get happens in a few seconds and is deactivated when you get shot .. and by that time either a medic or engi is your best friend .. .. also HOW many are those "many" people you speak of? i doubt it´s the majority ..

not long before i played all nonmaxclasses to get them to bronze/silver and realy it was just a matter of knowing how to play the class and it´s loadout .. and while i´m probably not a good shot i can say that i did fairly ok with most of them ..
you are right 1v1 you probably lose to a heavy 7 out of 10 times but then realy you may chose a different way to engage it
as it is meant to dish out firepower and and take it but at the cost of slower movement when he activates his shield ...

i could see HA having to chose between lmg and RL´s as primaries .. in that case he would have to supplemeant his firepower with it´s secondary for AI or grenades and c4 for antivehicle at the cost of range ...

I recently switched to LA rather than HA when I feel like purely fighting (I play all the other classes as well). LA is enormous fun for being able to get over obstacles and bypass choke points, leaping tall building etc.and the pop-up attack, like zooming up a wall, tossing 'nade or C4 over it or just bursting a few rounds, then dropping down again.

[One fun thing I did was get attacked all on my own in the open by an infil on his stealth flash with his Renegade bike shotty- I just lifted off and hosed that sucker off his mobility scooter while on the way up].

The thing I've learned though is that LA fighting in open ground loses those advantages because popping up into the air makes you an obvious target. If I fight in the hills and mountains and rocky outcrops and especially the bases I have a great time. (PS I also find carbines are my favourite primary so it was a natural step from Engie to LA).

I use the default jetpack and I find I can blip the throttle so as not to get too high when in forward motion, whilst still having the option to go up a height when I need to.

Unusually (I guess) I prefer fighting other infantry to C4ing vehicles. Although I will do that if an opportunity presents itself that isn't suicidal................or if a dumb tanker is just begging for it, like sitting on a hill all alone and spamming long range shots into a base.

Ive played more infiltrator than you have HA, so tell me.....if you think HA is so overpowered, why dont you play it?
I have placed 4173 motion spotters tho.
Of course its not infinite ammo, thats what your engi is for. A squad of all HAs (which was OPs question....remember 'why play anything else', the ******* thread title) would run out of detect bolts very quickly and wouldnt be able to reload them whilst defending a point room. Thought id made that pretty clear.

A flash is a flash m8, its not a HA, simple as that. Yes its superior, but you know what else? its also less able to get into tight spaces, cannot be shot to a height unreachable to enemies, cant be left in one place, i.e. an enemy spawn room, then you go somewhere else, i.e the point. Considering you've shot over 30,000 (well actualy its 27,668) surely you know how to use them properly.

Thats not the standout value, you're putting words in my mouth now. Its just one thing the LA can do that no1 else can. It can also drift over massive distances, even more with a jump pad, its the prime AV class of the game now because of this and the rocket rifle + c4 combo. No sundy is safe.
No other class can go toe to toe with an ESF in mid air and win (ive done this many times since the rocklet rifle, and against good, but overconfident pilots). It also has an ability to break chokepoints by attacking from unexpected angles.
LA is the rambo of PS2. Even if you just use it to place a spawn beacon and the switch, its still a reason to use another class, wich again was the question posed by the OP...

Did you just call me boo? Isnt that what people call their girlfriends in 'ghetto Merica'?

As someone who plays engineer a lot, provides ammo, places spitfires as alarms etc im confused, and find it almost offensive, that youd have that impression of engineers. I often get out my vehicle to place ammo for a lone sniper i pass, or hop out to repair / reload that AA max. Its almost never that i have to place one in a point room whilst we are attacking, theres always an engi.
Engineer is your second most played class aswel, you are blaming yourself for the 'problems' with engineers...

I find it quite oxymoronic that you seem to have a problem with a 'main fighting class' like HA, but then you call everything the other classes do 'organised spam cheese'.
Its like 'engineers placing crappy ammo', your just plucking these things out of thin air to support your point.

Ill give you something HA cannot do, and thats lower their own death counter by reviving other players, that alone will convince some players to play it.
Ill readily admit, i tend to play solo these days, or with very few other players, and im constantly getting revived, even as LA in weird positions (thanks rez nade), no idea why you think its only for organised players.

Lattice says which bases can be attacked next, it doesnt say 'park your sundy between your base than theirs and run like lemmings into the enemy chokepoint, again thats the players being stupid.
Its not because the other classes suck, its because the playerbase does. Hate to say it, but the average ps2 player is too dimwitted to even realise they can flank.
You've just showed a lack of foresight by saying the lattice forces us in one direction. Absolutely not, sure it can(but not always) dictate your next base of attack, but one of my fav pastimes is to hack a vehicle term behind enemy lines and attack their zerg from the rear, extremely fun and also very very effective, i use infiltrator and engi for this, not HA funnily enough. Problem is no1 else does it.
You blame HA, i blame the MLGleetmode mentality of 'HA LMG is the ultimate skill', its a cultural thing, everyone is trying to get that massive killstreak for a 'sik youtube vid'.


Implants
Sure the implants will work with HA, but equally with the other classes, anything HA can take advantage of the others can too.

I am looking forward to the new system tho, if only to stop all the whinning about the old, it is defo a better system tho, more understandable.
Right now im sitting on probably over 1000 level 1 implants, 100s of each of them.
Its not hard, just time consuming, to 'craft' the implants. I agree the system is ********, no1 wants random crap, but at least we could use lvl 3s to get a lvl 4, the levels at least wernt random.
But i disagree completely with the 'unobtainable advantage' they absolutely are obtainable by everyone.

It would be boring running around only as a Heavy.