Why is Vanu Significantly Underpop?

Is it perception?

Player choice?

Overall feeling of the best faction?

The faction that's received the most nerfs?

Once upon a time VS was the overpop faction by a large margin. The teamwork combined with alert victories made forumside turn into the mess we have today with nerf this and that. Since the consensus is that most faction are fairly equal now, why is the disparity in population not so equal?

http://www.therebelscum.net/world-p...&zoom=4&daterange=1484512500000,1487190900000
http://www.therebelscum.net/world-p...&zoom=4&daterange=1484512500000,1487190900000
http://www.therebelscum.net/world-p...&zoom=4&daterange=1484512500000,1487190900000
http://www.therebelscum.net/world-p...&zoom=4&daterange=1484512500000,1487190900000

P.S. Wheres the guy that said server merges would be a forsure thing before 2017? here we are and I don't see it...
P.S.S. I didn't want them due to lag wizards from post long ago.

Numbers don't lie, so frankly I'm not sure of the answer but since the game hasn't made meta really matter and the zerg is still a major thing. Is everything perfectly fine? or is it just my imagination?

They still win alerts, so they must be doing something right.

Myself, I play all 3 factions.

My guess its the MBT and weapons. The Magrider is not easy to master and harder to handle than the other 2. For weapons VS pays alot for the no bullet drop, even in situations where it doesnt make a difference. NC simply has a higher damage model and TR has higher RoF and mag size.

http://imgur.com/a/OIWD3

Considering what whiny people the VS community was before the VS was hit hard with nerfs, I wouldn't surprise me if they quit the game or started playing other factions.

I still remember the horror that was WDS on Mattherson, Vanu would absolutely obliterate everyone like it was nothing, no one could touch the VS on Mattherson, and for a short time on Emerald.

Then they nerfed the faster ADS movement speed the VS had, then rebalanced alot of weapons.

Suddenly what was a faction running around with 40% of the pop nonstop, dropped to around 28% for us on Emerald.

So basically VS is no longer game breakingly OP, and so people left what used to be the easy mode faction.

I'm not on here to say buff the VS because in the past I've basically said to remove them due to they don't really have any sort of faction trait anymore. They are bland, speed was there weapon and it's gone now.

The only thing I find interesting you stated is its ok for other factions to have OP pop but it wasn't ok for VS. I just find that to be an odd statement.

For me it's the aesthetics. Vanilla VS look ugly, their weapons sound wimpy and have no 'oomph' whatsoever (except for the Saron). In comparison, the TR and the NC feel way more powerful and have a distinct sleek militaristic / rugged appeal.

This game is almost entirely about burst damage. Getting good at infantry combat is about taking advantage of the severe latency you experience in this game. It's about doing as much burst damage as possible, and possibly killing your target before anything even renders on their side. It sucks. So about TR and their mag size and fire rate, it doesn't matter in 90% of situations, as VS typically have higher burst dps, and NC unarguably have the highest. Missed shots are the most forgiving to TR, but that doesn't mean much when considering skilled players.

Just be grateful that VS can still have almost 30% pop now in non-peak hours when they have continent bonuses through ghost-capping empty continents. It's only a matter of time that they drop below 20% for all times and never get back up again... (the Asian servers' nightmare will come eventually)

As a veteran player who plays across faction sometimes with most things unlocked, I will tell you that the game is all about the numbers such as burst damage and Damage-Per-Second, and a competitive player who can aim well or doesn't care about factions' lore will move away from VS once they figure out:

1. Main Battle Tank - TR has the best DPS tank with the "lockdown" ability to boost its DPS further; NC has the best burst damage tank with the added bonus of "winning shield" to absorb incoming damage, while VS has the slowest tank with the weakest cannons and armor... (mobility don't matter in-game where decisive battles always happen in close quarters)

2. Empire Specific Fighter - TR has the fastest ESF with the slimmest profile to dodge bullets and almost no downside; NC has the best burst damage & DPS guns but bulky shape, whereas VS has the flattest ESF that is weak to ambush/ganking as well as an anti-ground cannon that cannot be used for self-defense, unlike its TR/NC counterparts.

3. Heavy chaingun & Max - TR has a mini-chaingun that is superior in DPS to all LMG in capable hands, and a Max with the "lockdown" ability to boost DPS; NC has a shotgun that is effective outdoor with a triple-shot burst mode, whose damage potential is only supassed by NC's own exclusive shotgun maxes that also have a frontal shield ability; VS has an orb-shooting chaingun that can hurt people in a small area without the necessary DPS to effectively suppress or kill anyone, which rocket and grenade launchers can do, and a Max with a self-nerf ability to walk slightly faster and boost close-range DPS by 10% at the cost of a 20% increase in damage taken as well as a reduction in damage output over distance.

Just you wait, with the influx of Asian players after their servers got shutdown, this trend of decline in VS player percentage will come much sooner than you might think. Oh, did I mention those Asian servers had NC and TR pops each over 40% most of the time before getting shutdown?

Where did I say that? That it's okay for others to have OP pop? Especially since I've decided to come back to the VS. See the reason I mained TR was because the TR was unforgivably underpowered. It was a complete joke, and I hated VS players so much for denying any problems that I mained TR out of just pure hatred just to spite them if I ever got good enough. Now that the TR isn't the one being crapped on, I've decided to main VS since they fit me perfectly.

The VS trait is adaptability. TR use consistent firepower and speed, the NC use brute force and armor, and the VS use adaptibility and manueverability. And honestly adaptibility for me at least is the best. Because you're free to quickly change tactics and adapt to whatever you have to deal with.

So for example, the Lasher is my absolute favorite weapon in the game, I consider it to be THE best infantry weapon in the game. I can get past cover, I can hit them very hard when I hit dead on, in duels I can easily beat the average player because I constantly hit them thanks to the explosion, or directly, and can do it hip firing, then if a Max comes along I can break them with hard hits directly, and if it's an NC Max, I can get past his shield by shooting around him.

That's an example of VS adaptability, I can change to whatever situation very easily with their gear. You can't do that with the other two factions. If you use the Jackhammer for example, since we're on heavy weapons, you have to play it like a shotgun, and you have to fight like you normally do, you can't go head to head with a Max like you could with a Lasher, you have to outrun him and try to flank him, or peck him to death, if you use the MCG, you can't duel much because of the spinup, nor can you ads much because of the inaccuracy, but you can fire on them nonstop and easily kill one person after the other because of the very high damage while you're hip firing.

So maybe while the VS don't have stuff like mind numbing firepower, or powerful armor, they do have adaptability which while isn't as in your face, is still a fairly strong trait, if not strongest, depends on the player.

Personally I started out with vanu because I go for the most hilarious faction/race or whatever in any game and after a year an a half or so I still have to shed a tear when I see other vanu with default spandex and the taunts feel and sound so wrong it gives me the giggles every time still.
I did make me a TR toon eventually just to see if there's a big difference.
that being said, a lot of vanu infantry weapons feel like bb guns to me but there are exceptions. The ghost, nyx, serpent I feel are very solid weapons. I Don't know about the TR or NC scout rifle variants but the ghost feels very, very strong to use but I've grown bored wwith playing infiltrator. Due to underpop however, a lot of times I feel forced to resort to playing infiltrator again and again.
Playing any other class I will often times get absolutely ripped by enemy infiltrators but still I try and play medic as much as I can of late. The medic assault rifles feel pretty solid to use, both corvus and CME and I even started using a deimos which turned out to be great fun.
Also magryders will run you over lol.

Thats right, but not everyone is a skilled player and not everyone is equally good with different weapons.

I only play infantry and I go for high RoF weapons or, failing that, high dmg per bullet weapons with lower RoF. You might think this means TR or NC but I have an equal number of VS avatars...........I just had to cert into some higher RoF weapons for them that come as default for the other factions (Serpent, or VX6-7 and HV45).

So for infantry play (also recognising the number of clone weapons like RLs, BASR, shotties) I don't see an obvious reason in the weapons category for difference in faction pop. IDK what percentage of VS pop is made up of Maggie, Max or Scythe users, or if this is big enough to skew the overall population - even if real or imagined weaknesses in these things is actually a factor (I see plenty of all three in play on the EU servers).

And don't forget statistical laws - percentage population differences look bigger when measuring smaller populations. Plus populations probably vary at different times of day and we don't know which people are most likely to play at certain times or what their preferred faction might be - or do we?

Given the number of unknown variables I would suggest that it is just as valid to hypothesise that people don't play Vanu because the uniform is a fashion crime or because Papa Vanu's pompous voice is immensely irritating....................until we have more data.

[NB it is a common pitfall in discussions like this to subconciously transfer your personal viewpoint or experience of gameplay onto a whole population of players].

TL;DR They're just different from us and that is reason enough to hate them

This is why I love NC so much. Their entire arsenal of weapon is so diverse I can pick the right tool for the task. I enjoy TR for the same reason other than, just like VS, they have a rather dull LMG selection(and I usually stick to the good old CARV because dakka is live, dakka is love). Adaptability for me is not having one weapon to use all over the place(since I can just respawn and change loadout).

Still play VS though today. On Miller being VS is different to most servers because we've dealt with population issues which makes today's number pale in comparison. For a long time TR had a ridiculous 50% pop, VS teetered around 17%. This was mainly during the time when TR abused their Prowlers to the point that leaving your spawn was a death sentence, the time when LOLpods where LOLpods, and when the Magrider got its mobility nerfed hard. In a way, you could easily blame TR for the HE/HEAT nerf because holy c*** did TR enjoy that farm. Not that I blame TR, VS and NC are no different. Case in point, pre-nerf ZOE.

Overall, I'm a proud 4th factioner moving from underpop to underpop and have characters around BR50-90 on all factions. I don't see any faction's players as inherently worse or better than the others. I find people simply use what works the best and sometimes that best thing will turn the other factions sour.

4th Faction has decided that NC is the Flavor of the Month due to the recent Buff/Nerf cycle.

Lets see.

For Emerald it might just be that way the existing outfits treat people?
When fighting gets thick for Emerald NC I typically see lots of "hit here" and "need people there" orders along with plenty of platoons that invite people regardless of K/D, outfit, etc. Emerald (and Connrey) VS one might think command chat doesn't exist if not for certain people cursing out "the zerg" and that squads are non-existent.

Of course I find the whole bit ironic. Given that Emerald VS has a number of VS outfits that came from PS1 Emerald server, which was the server (and side in my opinion) that treated its "zerg" with the most respect, I would have expected them to remember those lessons. Instead the scumbags first reaction to adversity is to cut deals with TR outfits to double-team the NC.

Sorry no pity. Emerald VS want more people they need to A) treat the ones they have with some respect and B) get their heads out of their ***** to see that the TR are just as much as threat as the NC.

Those Asian vet players are super loyal to their faction and outfit though, which could be why VS nowadays are underpop. e.g. the Chinese server had the pre-nerf ZOE for a very long time (years maybe) till shutdown, and yet the VS pop was still around 5%. I guess their 4th factioners actually did the math and realized that ZOE wasn't actually OP.

You know - I think there's at least a degree of truth in that statement. Witness the TR Gatekeeper population balloon. With the most recent cycles, who would have thought that the Mjolnir would turn out pretty good (caught me by surprise that one - I was expecting PPA levels of dreadfulness forever more).

VS are just lacking some notably fun / effective stuff right now. I play all three factions - the thing I enjoy most about VS is the teamwork and squad play (i'm BR96 and I see very few low BR VS players). I love the TR arsenal but then Zerg Russ took over the server.

NC squad play has improved immensely over the past 6 months so that combined with a broad range of fun / effective weapons means it's now my first choice faction.


VS just don't have the fun stuff like Phoenix or the brutal stuff like Vulcan - it's all a bit middling, or needs dedicated squads to be effective (Lancer being a perfect example).

Pre-ZOE nerf when you turned on ZOE you still nerfed yourself because you took more damage. I saw good NC max scatts zergs still take out the ZOE max zergs in those days especially in bio labs. The only weapon imo that was super OP was the Saron because the other factions didn't have a counter and it worked well against air, tanks, inf. The splash was ridiculous on it as well against infantry.

That was the way I interpreted what you said, since I was talking about population and your original reply didn't specify any toys.

The Vanu is not speed my mistake but mobility and thus what's really mobile anymore for them? The Maggie I guess but that's only certain parts of the maps when they can use the terrain as an advantage. While the zerg isn't fighting on those parts because the zerg usually turns the mobility advantage into nothing. ESF's I don't really complain about because I personally feel they are somewhat the most equal ES units some disadvantages and advantages for all. ESF's are really not newb friendly though and the physics of flying and the way most flying units fly is broken imo. The VS infantry has no mobility anymore...

Adaptability I think with all the NS weapons added in general there's only few specifics that could maybe be said to be unique at this point. The Lasher is fun to play with for awhile but you hardly see them used compared to Jackhammers or even now with the changes Chainguns. Lashers your not going to be pulling in small fights compared to said other factions options. You can get kills with MCG and the Jackhammer and I'd go pull the stats because I bet the with the changes I'd almost guarantee what would be on the bottom.

The nerfs need to stop DBG I'm even going to say the Gatekeeper nerf was over the top, well because it was... People are going to always complain about something. This game needs to have more ES differences and stop with the NS stuff making the game bland. With ES differences there will be complaints lots of complaints but there will be diversity. IMO the Vanu at launch wasn't as OP as people tend to believe because they worked as a team far greater than the other factions cared to realise.

I'm now a lonewolf 4 factioner, but I see issues and I'm not going to give the whole love hate to VS because they were once perceived to be ungodly OP. Population balance is a big thing because any new player joining VS at this point in time will more than likely be joining another faction or quitting the game after playing them. Not due to the toys just due to the pop.