This^ Is particularly frustrating. It even matches the design with three barrels on each cannon, much like the PS1 rotated between them, a player could select them. But of course all we got was entirely different variants -_-
I really liked the OP's point about the Butterfly effect; while all MAXes can lurk right beside doorways, the TR/VS don't have to (and frequently choose not to), whereas the NC MAX pretty much has to to be effective. My poor engi buddy dies so very often from splash damage, because I (and therefore he) have to be so close to corners/doorways/etc. to be/get in optimal range. I also liked the point that NC AI weapons pretty much encourage us to get in c4 range (or at least, stop reliably damaging enemy soldiers once you get beyond it).
On the other hand, my TTK is often too low to kill a C4 fairy coming from an unexpected direction before he detonates his C4.
NC AI MAX is absolutely fine. If you can't get results with it, you are doing it wrong. Like everything in PS2 you need to pick your spots!
NC AI MAX sucks cuz it's so goddamn inaccuate you cant hardly hit targets 5 feet in front of you, then it sometimes takes 3 and 4 volleys to bring a guy down. Hell, just now, I was aimed center mass at a VS MAX suit from like 5m away and hit him like once....the rest of the shots obviously deviated left and right of him...it was like what the holy hell is this ****!? Plus, the velocity on the shotguns is so damn bad you can literally strafe between them and never even get hit. Then, the mag sizes are so small you usually run out of ammo and are reloading either just before you kill a guy, or just before you get swarmed. One thing I really LOVE about the Dual Muti MAX....150 rounds in 2 guns...ATLEAST you can fire back with that thing....
Yep, and your spot in an AI MAX is sitting next to a door. That's it. Enjoy your thrilling gameplay of camping a door.
Sure, NC AI max is good as a doorway warrior, although its a rubbish 'tactic' because it just promotes camping and you act like a magnet for granades, C4s and dumbfire rockets. It's not really that surprising if by design you're supposed to predictable and sitting in choke points. If only shield did its job and prevented explosives but most of the time it doesn't (I do have it certed all the way up to 5). 'Pick your spots' is a silly advice in a game about mobility and advancing forward to capture points, if you play it as an objective game instead of farming that is. I've recently invested a tonne of certs into a NC max (which I wholeheartedly regret) and I agree that NC max is the most challenging out of all three. For having better DPS at a spitting distance you are sacrificing range and mobility (i.e. you are bound to favorable terrain) and the element of surprise (you're waiting for the enemy to get into your effective range, since you don't want to be caught in their effective range) which in a way means that you sacrifice EVERYTHING else. My advice for people being fed up by dying from explosives in doorways is to get mattocks for that extra bit of range (horrible cert investment, 2000 for both guns, 1000 for mandatory extra ammo, 300 if you want slugs). You have less starting damage (112x6 instead of the NC average 130x6), but still good at close range (assuming you shoot both weapons at the same time we're looking at around 1-3 bursts per infantry in your effective range, say up to 15 m?), and with the smallest pellet spread, least damage falloff and highest muzzle velocity you... still stuck outside of close range, but at least you can try to suppress your enemy as you're advancing (much better than being a shielded bullet sponge) and sometimes even drop somebody. From tests in the training area (where I can accurately measure distance) you can drop infantry at 30 m with mattock pellets with half to full (extended) magazine (pellets RNG is a huge factor), 2-3 shots (double barrel) if you want to invest in slugs. That's bad, yes, but at least you can dish out some meaningful damage as you suppress the enemy and approach to your effective range. At anything closer than 30 you're looking at more consistent kills with less shots. Slugs are also an option but personally I don't use them, they make you sub-par at close range for having a slightly better, but still bad, effectiveness at 30-40 m. My aim when I use shotguns on the MAX is to advance from cover to cover so I can get into close range where I excel. I only shoot outside of close range to return fire or suppress my approach when necessary. By taking slugs you give up on your close range strengths for the sake of not sucking hard at medium range (just very bad instead). To maintain consistent kills at this range you still need to be a) stationary, b) crouching and c) waiting for cone of fire reset after each shot, reducing your RoF, which on the whole makes you a perfect target. It's like being the doorway warrior all over again but without the door! I can see how slugs can sound like an interesting option (well I've certed them too). Being absolutely defenseless most of the time and a burden to your squad before you get to your perfect doorway is a very frustrating experience, thus slugs may sound like the perfect alternative. When I look at the pros and cons I would rather suck at something and excel at something, rather be poor across everything, but some people stand by slugs and if it works for them then I wish them happy fragging, such things are subjective after all and we all have our playstyles. However, if you do go for slugs use the mattocks, they have the best bullet velocity and range for slugs.
Variable chokes would be great for MAXes, but the canister really wouldn't benefit from that. It's already got surprisingly decent effective range (it just pales in comparison to the PPA's range, but you'll never get a 300m shotgun), and if you narrowed the spread, the low velocity would make it tougher to hit things at distances where the higher damage would be important. The Mag-scatter is actually great at 0m. It's the most consistent knife combo weapon in the game. You give up a lot for that combo, though.
Yeah the canister is finally ok, but for a long, long, long time whilst they tinkered badly with it and it was pure and unadulterated pants, a choked mode would have be a quick and easy way to sort it out. Even for purely that the Mag-scatter is barely better, and everywhere else slightly to a lot worse.
Well the most thing i hate about NC max (packed with dual shotguns and shields ) is that when i pop up in room with 3-5 enemies, , ill be dead right after ive done with 2-3 of them,. cose....gues what... reload and small amount of ammo. If ill do same thing using TR or VS max dual weaponed those 5 enemies will be dead wright before my second reload. So to my mind NC shotguns need much more shells per clip.
So you admit to never being on the receiving end of an NC AI MAX? So how is your opinion on balance valid in any way? One shot infantry with every AI gun. One shot infantry with your AV weapons, homing rockets that a vegetable could use. NC MAX AV weapons are better and complete upgrades in every way possible when compared to the other factions variants. MAX's are only useful for short range engagements anyway. Their weapons are useless outside of 30 meters on whatever faction you're playing on. No, just because you killed an average ****ter at that range doesn't mean that they are effective at that range. Any half decent player with the tiniest semblance of thought will have no troubles taking you out if you can't close the gap. If anything, NC MAX's need to be nerfed. Especially their extremely over powered AV weapons.
This last sentence especially. If you feel that you AI guns are inadaquate just switch to your Falcons or Ravens, its a 2 shot kill with those on infantry
2 shot, you have to hit with both. Ravens is 4 shots IE rockets from both arms hitting the player directly...maybe more, not entirely sure. That said aiming the falcons is like firing a sniper rifle from the hip. Though you have perfect accuracy, you have no zoom and you have to deal with travel time and drop and you have to reload after every shot. It's not exactly easy. Ravens debatably moreso but they still have travel time and you must remain in LoS of your target the entire time. Unlike falcons, pounders, etc which are fire and forget. Speaking of which, you are aware that pounders are the best Ai/AV weapons, correct? They have more drop, but don't have to reload after a single shot, and they have a larger AoE with faster RoF. Of course, the Comet is mediocre but the Lancer again has the advantage of a literally inescapable alpha strike. A damn near hitscan beam that can easily hit out of render range due to not having to deal with drop or travel time. Ravens require you to perfectly track the target or better yet, guide the rockets into them using the terrain. They are not homing, they are TOW launchers. Wanna see how "easy" it is? Use engie tow lancher for AI. Come back and post your experience. The Lancer is the closest thing we have to a hitscan AV weapon in the game.
Laughable. If you're getting hit by pounders, you're already too close and it's your own fault. If you're getting hit by fractures, you have a laugh, pop a beer and just turn around the corner. Get hit by ravens, you're ****** if there isn't some form of wall/rock to hide behind within 100m. Also, the engi TOW launcher is incredibly easy to use, falcons just as easy. Leading targets is so easy that I can do it without breaking a sweat. For your average ****ter, though, I guess not.
Holy **** I dont realy see all the trouble with the NC max, start using it the way its ment to be played! You got some problems with the shield? Pfff...Hahahaha! Dude, start using it in a -good- way, have to reload? Pop up the shield and go and reload, and to be honest, the shield covers alot, is saved me alot of times while falling back afther a rush. Got problems with the shotguns? You gotta be ******* kidding me.... I tried playing the VS max, lateron the TR max (more experience with the VS one) and they just feel like you're shooting shiny balls of nothing (vs) even if you're kinda far away it still doesnt feel like they're better then the NC shotguns, and who the **** even eqquips the standard AI guns when they're planning to have a distance fight? Then take the anti tank guns, eh? Ever though about that? If you got any problems with the NC max then learn to change your playstyle or go join a other faction, or! stop bothering with it and stop playing the NC max at all. Ooh and ye, stop complaining.. People have been complaining about the so called "****** shotguns" for ages now and nothing have changed.
If you're getting hit by a scattermax, you're already too close and it's your own fault. How does that logic sound to you? Getting hit by ravens and no cover? You done ****** up again son. An infiltrator will kill you far faster than ravens can. Tow launcher is easy to use against vehicles yes, but infantry? If it's so easy, how come there's never a "NERF TOW LAUNCHER!" spam of threads gracing the front page? Oh, because everyone has access to it and can tell precisely the strengths and weaknesses of it. unlike ravens and falcons. If you think Falcons are easy, why don't you try using nothing but rocket primary and let me know how that goes for you. Same concept, but no ADS, much larger target, C4/rocket magnet.
^ But that's true for most AV Max weapons. My comets travel slow and also have no ADS. Moreover, to kill infantry I need to hit them with 2 salvo's as opposed to Falcon's 1 salvo. Also, if you have Vortexes any decent infantry will wipe the floor with you. No need even for C4. When it comes to killing infantry I'd rank the AV weapons in this order: Pounders > Ravens (if distance) > Falcons > Comets > Fractures/Vortex.
