Why do aircraft get to be anti-everything?

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Thpthpthp, May 19, 2014.

  1. TheBlazing

    > Grab Heavy Assault

    > Equip A2A launcher that can also be dumbfired

    > Equip versatile LMG

    > Equip secondary w/ darklight flashlight

    There you go, anti-everything.

    On a serious note though, lots of things can be anti-everything in this game, but when they are, they tend to be less powerfull overall.
  2. WarmasterRaptor

    Hmmm, resource cost? what cost? It's free like anything else. "Resources" only cost is time.
    "Merely" 10 seconds in which we cannot help to capture nor defend bases control nodes. Nor destroy enemies assets in a territory.
    "Merely" to be re-killed again under a few seconds.

    Lul wut? Lock-ons being useful?
    HERESY!!! :eek:

    Organized lock on teams are probably the most effective tool for eliminating all air threats from the ground, Libs in particular. Nothing makes me leave an area faster then volley fire of lock ons as they simply **** air even after their much needed nerfs. Kind of glad that the vast majority of infantry think like you and feel it's worthless, the day they figure it out and actually work together is the day your air problems disappear.
    • Up x 2
  4. Brenold

    a lib is esf prey IMO. proper positioning, good aim and a little patience at range and you can down any lib. the problem is, while you try to do so you will die from other sources. hovering and poking a lib makes you easy pickings for anyone else.. charging a lib can be a alternate strategy but is a lot riskier and definitely harder
  5. Sebastien

    Nobody wants to pull AA to deal with incurable ****ters. It's boring as **** watching the clouds drift across the sky just hoping for a Farmchariot to stray into their sights.
    Literally one of the most boring aspects of the game. It might be good if XP gain from it wasn't abysmal, but as soon as SOE sees fit to stop holding the dicks of A2G pilots, I doubt we'll see any changes.
    • Up x 3
  6. stalkish

    How dare you put owness of ones failures onto them, dont you know if you lose its because the opponent had an unfair advantage?
    Actualy recognising and responding to a threat, lol dont make me laugh, just cry nerf and prevent it from even possibly being a threat in the future......

    How hard is it to equip your factions primary G2A launcher and call targets for two minutes? Hell we have a blast when I play on the ground and decide enemy air has gotten to thick, kind of a contest on who's launcher will get the final blow on the poor bastard that got focused. All it takes is you and two other friends aiming at the same target with a grounder or its equivalent and you will one shot ESF and make a lib **** itself. Though I'm curious on when my Dick was being held, kind of be nice to know when that favor was handed out?
    • Up x 2
  8. skifton

    Actually, a tank can be anti-tank and anti air at the same time, by putting either a Ranger or a Walker on the top of it. Also, a main battle tank can use the stock cannon (multi-purpose) and put a walker on the top and be "anti-everything".

    Most aircraft *do* specialize against anti-air or anti-ground. An ESF with breaker pods *can* still kill air targets, but an ESF with A2A missiles, coyotes, or afterburners is *much* better at it. Just like a tank CAN kill infantry with an anti-tank loadout...but it's much better at killing infantry with an anti-infantry loadout.

    An ESF with afterburners or A2A missiles (or even coyotes) equipped is very poor at killing both tanks and infantry. Just like a tank equipped with AP main cannon and a halberd or enforcer is very poor at killing both infantry or air.

    Also, ESFs in Planetside 2 are very paper-like in their overall durability. It doesn't take much to kill an ESF, in all honesty, and the speed and firepower they have reflect that quality.

    EDIT: On a sidenote, infantry have to specialize because it's VERY easy for them to switch loadouts at will. Any infantry can equip a G2A launcher, or hop into a burster max and keep the skies clear. It is very easy for infantry to be "anti-everything", so long as they have a weapons terminal nearby. Air (and armor, for that matter) are not afforded the same luxury of being able to change loadouts at will. At least the tank can house a heavy inside with a lockon rocket launcher...
    • Up x 2
  9. Flag

    Oh surely you jest.
    As far as any specialized weapons go, the walker/ranger on the MBTs are the worst of the worst. They're not good at their role, and terrible at everything else.

    Conversely, your precious rocketpods.
    Why is it made to be a valid weapon against both vehicles and infantry? That it's A2G isn't the problem, but that "ground" is a single category is.
    If it was truly specialized it would be, say, only indirect damage AKA Anti Infantry, leaving you unable to do much to vehicles with them. Why would that be good? Because that's the kind of choice ground vehicles have to do. And the ESF has the advantage of having 2 weapons, so you can work around some of the new obstacles with the new system.
    And if you really want to go Anti Vehicle, you've got the option of hornets.

    Does this seem unfair to you? Because this is why people complain, this different balance standard for the air weapons.
    • Up x 3
  10. skifton

    Frankly, rocketpods aren't nearly as good as they used to be against MBTs (and especially lightnings). They're pretty good against locked-down prowlers, I'll admit. But a dumbfire rocket can only do so much. Hornets present an interesting tool against armor, but they have a mind-numbingly short range, and it still takes a lot of top-down hits to kill an MBT (I think 8ish?) ...from the rear it's 4, but that's tough to do because you're in-range of the main cannon fire when you're reloading and lining up that second shot.

    Yes, walkers and rangers aren't great at anything else, but I didn't say they were. I said they were the anti-air option. And quite frankly, walkers can deter ESFs pretty well. I have flown from BR9 to BR100 pretty much, and when an MBT is targeting me with a walker it's not at all easy to stick around. Even the ranger is like that (although frankly the ranger is a bit weak).

    Take into account the fact that aircraft have several counters and very little cover in the air as a whole. Burster maxes, A2A lockons, G2A lockons (of many varieties), skyguards, walkers, rangers, even basilisks will tear you up if you get relatively close. It's a high-risk, high-reward environment....and frankly it doesn't take much effort to deter aircraft, unless there's an absolute swarm of them. Even then a burster MAX can be pretty safe (and can even fire from *inside* spawn shields to hit air targets).

    Air weapons *are* powerful, no doubt. But to get that ordinance to the ground is not only a high risk to the pilot and his aircraft, but also takes considerable skill in general.

    Anti-armor MBTs can kill infantry with a halberd pretty readily, and it doesn't just do indirect damage...so I'm not sure where your argument is there. If you directly hit with a halberd/enforcer, you do much more damage to infantry.

    TL;DR - Air weapons are powerful, no lies. But:

    1. Flying isn't easy to learn, and it's hard to "master"

    2. Aircraft face no short list of threats: G2A missiles (of many kinds), burster maxes (you get one free btw), walkers, rangers, basilisks, enemy aircraft, liberator anti-tank weapons...even small arms! (Two heavies shooting an ESF with their LMGs can kill it in about 5 seconds, test it). Oh and dumbfire rockets, infantry LOVE to send you a "go to hell" message after hitting you with one of those. Basically everything except a knife can kill an ESF.

    3. Air-to-ground ordinance is (generally) pretty up-close and personal, especially when it comes to killing infantry.

    So no, I don't think it's terribly un-balanced. And if you think it is, I suggest you play it for awhile against some infantry with a brain in their skulls. They pull flak/lockons for 30 seconds and it's a no-fly zone, generally.
    • Up x 2
  11. PKfire

    • Up x 2
  12. Flag

    But now that there's hornets, why should you get a weapon that can deal with both vehicles and infantry?

    Here's a thought, why do Air have such strong weaponry? And what is the consequences of this?
    Well the obvious answer is that air dies fast when meeting resistance, especially the ESF.
    But when you think about it, they die fast because AA scales too well. And AA "has to" because Air Weapons are so strong.
    So why not nerf them both? This could help solving two problems we have currently, that Air is too good in small engagements, and can be too easily deterred in the big ones.

    Besides, why should the ESF be this capable at multi-role business?
    Part of the reason the Lib ended up in it's current state was because the ESF was so versatile already. And, for what it's worth, the fine gents over at Under the Radar do share parts of this sentiment of doing something to the ESF to make it less of a ground pounder.

    So I ask, why should single-seater ESFs be fully capable ground pounders like they are today?
    My answer is that no, it shouldn't be. It is a 1-man craft, and should be limited in versatility because of it.
    • Up x 3
  13. Slandebande

    Is that a reasoning for air weapons to be powerful?

    - So because air is hard to learn, it should have inherent advantages (which are unrelated to those obtained simply by being in an aircraft)? Doesn't make sense to me. Tanking also has a steep learning curve if you want to be an ace. I'd love to see someone not having spend hours upon hours in a tank trying to shoot on the move, while hitting his target and not impacting the driving performance. I'd say it ranks up with the hardest of the maneuvers.

    - Ground vehicles face even more threats than air vehicles, and have a harder time getting out of a bad situation. Sure, they can go behind cover, but that won't save them in quite a few situations, due to their much lower speed and maneuverability. Two HA's can kill an ESF with their LMG's if it is fairly close and doesn't move around too much yeah, but how often does that happen? :eek:

    I don't find the Lib weapons to be very up-close-and-personal, although they all slaughter infantry easily. If by "(generally)" you only mean some ESF weapons, then sure, I guess the coyotes and pods aren't best used at maximum render range, but still :rolleyes:

    I don't see many no-fly zones back when I used to gun for my friends Lib, nor do I see the aircraft pelting my ground vehicles in the large fights being exposed to large amounts of friendly AA fire.
    • Up x 2
  14. Fatal1o1

    If that's the case , then why is it that an ESF can run into a MAX and kill it without taking any damage??? This is absolutely ridiculous! If an ESF runs into a MAX they should blow up , period. Too many who fly are using this to their advantage. Now I'm not saying they shouldn't be able to kill the max , but they should also pay a price. It's only fair. They see you shooting at other ESF's and just fly right into you , kill you and fly away, which is B.S.
  15. \m/SLAYER\m/

    yes, one starting farming infantry, you will feel uncomfortable on the ground. Because you feeling like a god - no one can kill you, unless friendly aircraft suddenly facing you.
  16. Merlock

    If you let an ESF road kill you your aim is terrible, every ESF that tried to do that gets instagibbed by me anyway
  17. Takumi9

    why are you idiots still compaining about air...........you have a 3 man lib and only one person pulls aa........what do you think is gonna happen....
    3 op heavies with flak armor and 250 cert lockons can make a lib run( 30,000 cert lib)....makes total sense

    dalton got nerfed....go whine more....

    flak is op, turrets are op, airhammer is op, shredder is op
  18. Flag

    And you think this is about the 'versus infantry' side of things?

    It's not, but more with air compared to their ground "brethren" (although sometimes I wonder if some sky knights care for anything beyond their own craft) have some unbelievably absurd advantages.

    This is the vehicle sub, not general discussion.
  19. ake1

    Well, maybe not AI. But AP is as close as you can get (on the main cannon) to AA
  20. lothbrook

    Ohhh woah hey now man, when i put rocket pods on my ESF i'm only at a slight disadvantage against other ESFs because those guys i don't 1 clip i can't just swap to my secondary and finish them, i mean i have to actually reload bro. Its even worse in my lib, it takes 2 full mags to kill a tank unless i get him from behind, i mean what is this crap, i actually have to let my gunner kill them sometimes. Then on top of that BS they take like 1/5 of my health when they hit me when their main gun, do you know how inconvenient it is to get out and repair a lib, its BS man.
    • Up x 2