Why are the devs trying their hardest to kill this game?

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by TrashMan, Jun 26, 2017.

  1. TrashMan

    YOUR enjoment. Critical point to consider. Tons of people loves PS1, which was a better game.

    The problem with HIVE's is that they are tacked on and ultimatively unrewarding, given how disconnected to everything else it is (and how bases don't matter in the long run).

    Also, attacking a properly built base SHOULD favor the defenders, that's the whole point of building defensive positions!
    • Up x 2
  2. TrashMan

    Extra credits?
    Thank you for taking your credibility - those pretentious ***** couldn't tie their own shoelaces. Between them they don't have a single game worth a damn and are all aboard the "art" and "story" and "politics" train
    • Up x 1
  3. Demigan

    The general enjoyment. There's always deviants who enjoy other stuff. But just because a few people enjoy things like SM doesn't mean we should cater everything to them does it? So that's the critical point to consider: The average person won't enjoy pursueing menial tasks in an FPS game while others are blowing stuff up for their enjoyment.

    Aaand my point exactly! Except you seem to think of the unrewarding part the other way around. HIVE's are mostly that menial task I talked about, but there's a small group of deviants who still enjoy that kind of gameplay. And what do you know! There's only 7 of these HIVE's available at any time so overall this small group can still have a massive effect on the game. As for the ultimately unrewarding, it's definitely unrewarding to attack HIVE bases.

    So basically you just disagreed with me because you wanted to disagree, but then you come up with the exact thing that proves I'm right.

    Attacking a properly build base should favor the defenders, but the attackers should be capable of creating their own favorable attacks. For example with siege equipment. And that's the thing: Currently it's an uphill battle from start to finish for the attackers, while the defenders basically get certs thrown at them for most fo the battle. There's no practical way for the attackers to slate it in their favor until the last moments of the base.

    So... You are blaming people for being pretentious by being pretentious about it? Hypocrite much?
    Also, how about you actually try and debunk what they've said, instead of trying to discredit them and hoping that makes it OK? For example your mini-rant about them being for art, story and politics in games... Did you ever realize they know those don't make a game? Did you realize that they showcase how successful games have pulled off the art, story and politics and draw parallels to other games that didn't to show their effects and power? Did you ever realize that regardless of their own successes, they have analyzed the successes of other games and put that into their video's?

    I mean let's face it: You probably don't even have a single shred of experience in game design outside of the view of the consumer. I would rather listen to someone who has build 50 failed games and has learned from that than listen to someone who has no idea what they are talking about.

    Look, you don't have to like me, but you shouldn't disagree simply because you dislike me. Make an argument, state your case, then we can have an actual discussion rather than you trying to do mudthrowing and discrediting.
    • Up x 2
  4. CutieG

    I didn't respond because I wanted to be more diplomatic. But then you kinda said what I wanted to say, just more like an *******.

    Still, thanks for speaking my mind.

    Extra Credit sometimes have decent advice, but they are stuck up their ******* to a degree that makes it impossible to know if a linked video is insightful or mental diarrhea. Even if they spout complete ********, people will still praise their videos and continue the **********.
    And you often link their videos, so I'm extra wary of how good you are at picking them objectively.

    Personally, I won't even watch their videos. I did once upon a time, but I really don't want to give them additional views.
    Linking to them is similar to linking randomly to TVtropes. No matter how related it may seem, don't do it. They are a step below Wikipedia in terms of reputability.

    I'm still looking for videogame channels that actually do proper research. There's many that are halfway there, like Downward Thrust, but then they dish out videos like the one on Assassin's Creed, where they completely failed to realize that the original game was structured in a very specific fashion. They also used it as a negative example for their video on quest markers, even though AC1 is the incarnation of a game that works entirely without quest markers and does it so well that it becomes tedious by just turning on the minimap.

    Sirlin had some nice articles, but he's stuck strongly in the Street Fighter niche and knows nothing else. As do most people in the videogame design discussion area, really.

    Where's the channel that takes a look at the Bioshock titles and analyzes their resource economy (i.e. Infinite becomes infinitely better if you give yourself infinite money, because the economy actively detracts from the gameplay) and gunplay?
    Where's the channel that takes a look at the Final Fantasy games, showcases their often flawed mechanics, and contemplates how to take those mechanics and make them fun? I'd really like to see how you'd un**** Final Fantasy 2, for example.
    I want to have a channel that, once a month, makes a video on flawed and unknown games with really unique mechanics. There's so many interesting solutions that have come up over the existence of the medium, which we'll never see in an actually successful game because there's barely any cross-polination in the field of game design.
    Or how about something about taking narrative-driven games where the actual gameplay and story damage each other, and showing solutions to the problems?
    Or what about a video that does a moment-by-moment criticism of Half-Life 2? I recently played the game for the first time and there's a ****load of glaring issues to have a discussion about.
    And yes, I specifically mention crowd favorites, because objective discussion about those games is the hardest thing to get online. Most people don't even seem to understand that you can criticize a part of a game without hating it.

    I'm designing a game and I'd love to find a properly unbiased and researched channel for these kinds of topics. Unfortunately, most of them are just a case of "I'll talk about the games that I played, but make it more generalized" and not even "I'll talk about the games that I know but make it more generalized". You often get a feeling that these people don't even know anything outside of their niche. A blatant example is the RTS genre, which is often either disregarded completely or very heavily misunderstood, as these people never went deep enough into the genre to have a grasp of these various games.
  5. MuNrOe

    Comparing this game to planet side 1 is insulting to the developers of planet side 1. It was ruined from the get go when they put a COD BF fan boi in charge of development and listened to zerg fits on how to make the game better.

    Meanwhile small groups of skilled outfits from PS1 that pretty much dominated game play towards the end of the game were largely ignored.

    Used to be the biggest fan of this game and it's potential. To see it now is saddening to say the least.
    • Up x 2
  6. CutieG

    And yet the gunplay is objectively better and playing solo can be fun at times. So there's that.
  7. OldMaster80

    Playing solo can be fun sure. I do it most of the time. The biggest difference with ps1 is in that game some (not all) things required a level of coordination only outfits had. Some guilds were famous because of their tactical superiority. Not just because of high br players and high kdr.

    In ps2 there are some features meant to make life easier to soloers. But these features, together with some design flaws, also greatly mitigate the effect of players cooperation. I mean redeploy, tons of respawn options, a stats and directive system around kills ignoring the other activities, resources having literally no value, undestroyable boring bases granting automatic VP.

    Zerg, redeploy, farm. This is ps2. Capturing a continent is merely optional as long as people get closer to their directive target.
  8. Demigan

    And basically the same to you. I don't just nod ahead with anyone. I do post Extra Credits video's, and I pick the one's that have reason and argument behind them. I heavily disagree with what you are doing, shouting foul on everything they say just because you disagree with things they've said. If they say the right thing, then you should listen to that regardless of them being wrong on other things. And this Social Difficulty curve seems pretty damn solid and I can see it back in gaming practice. So unless you come up with something actually concrete besides "well I don't like those guys so I'll disagree with that and think you are stupid if you do disagree with them", it's going to be the best thing so far.

    But at least you try to find other channels to see if they have it on the right of it. And you already hit the same problem I do when researching: You have to be selective, you have to take apart what they say and see if it holds up in practice. That doesn't mean discounting everything if you find a mistake, that means that even if you find a flaw, you look if you can fix the flaw and the result still holds up to practice.
  9. Yessme

    hmm i thought i wride " infantery (infiltrator) based game"
    dunno if you learned, how to use ( ), but you should go, and learn it again!
    You call it SMG, but you din`t look, how your SMG works.
    4 bullets in 1 Shot, hmm i dunno, but in the amry, we don`t call it MP.
  10. DirArtillerySupport

    Some nights on Auraxis while soloing the entire time was spent flying people and equipment to their gal drops. Zero reward...not even a polite thank you. It was just expected and built right into the fabric of the game. It was as if the map spoke to you. The escorts flying along side? Where did they come from? I didn't ask them but there they were...just in case. Everyone chit chatting kicking tunes monitoring changes on the map. I had never been busier performing a thankless menial task in a video game. All that erased by an accommodating developer with a target audience of Ritalin junkies. I know they are smarter than this. I know we are smarter than this....but here we sit consoling one another on how dumb we've all become.
  11. Ph42oN

    I dont understand why many here say performance is fine... ok most of time im getting over 60fps, but im using 144hz screen, and in really big battles it drops to 45-50. That is with i5 2500k overclocked to 5GHz. Year ago i was using this cpu at 4.8GHz and it never dropped below 60fps, most of time 80-100fps. Some patch made peformance worse.
  12. LordKrelas

    Thermals don't help in spotting infiltrators; The cloaked ones are not displayed by it.. at all.

    Small-machine-gun, New NS SMG is a shotgun-like SMG, other than that SMG, infiltrators haven't had any shotguns for literal months if not a year or two.
    In the case, you aren't up to date at all, on this game's weapons, and weapon options.

    As well, Infiltrators have the smallest hit points, lack explosive weapons outside of Anti-infantry land-mines, and are either CQC (close-quarters-combat) or ER (Extreme-Range) combatants due to having SMGs, standard sidearms, Scout & Sniper Rifles.
    All generally accuracy-dependent, to a lesser degree with the SMG.

    As well, still not a single weapon has free locks.
  13. OgreMarkX

    Do what the devs want you to do.

    Build hives behind your own lines, exploit terrain if possible, minecraft cortium, and gain VP's that can never be lost (you know, unlike like Territory based VP).

    They weren't successful in minecrafting the once venerated Everquest name (cough, Landmark) so, well, here they are in Planetside.

    Minecraft for da win.
    • Up x 2
  14. ridicOne

    Rendering Lag, Hit detection, Lag Wizards, Vehicle glitch's oh ya it runs like a well oiled machine...
    • Up x 1
  15. Pikachu

    Soon people will build cortium fueled minecraft style calculators.
    • Up x 1
  16. QuickLoad

    I don't come to forums that often, but I do check it for updates now and then - and then stick around for some of the discussions.

    I just wanted to say.. the grind really shouldn't be something to complain about. I now have 388 hours in PS2 and I remember many years ago I took a 3 year break from it. I had around 205 hours in and what made me sick to the stomach was the grind. 205 hours and had only accumulated 8,000 certs. Do you know how sad that is? 200+ hours and only 8k certs.

    It had something to do with my old rig running like crap, but still, that's a lot of time for very little, talk about a grind!
    Now, more than ever, have I enjoyed this game. Within 50 hours of beginning to replay it I had gotten 4k certs, that's 1/4th the time for 1/2th the amoutn of certs. The game was so much more enjoyable grind aside, which had something to do with my new rig.

    Anyways, they cut the grind by 50% last I checked, but it feels more like 60%.
    And BR 1-15 get 100 every level. I've never even been in Koltyr, and I never will because my rank is too high. I mean hell, back then there was not even a tutorial. They have made it so awesome for new players to join in, and that's why I've gotten 5 or so friends to play the game and keep playing it.

    When I first played this game, I just installed, created a character, and got sent via droppod to the frontline where I promptly died.
    Grind is not a problem anymore, def. feels a lot less than other mmorpgs.
    I love this game. However I can say...

    It'd probably be in the best interest of quite a lot of people to increase the graphics(so they can look better), and remove some of the dumb *** camoflauges like.. pink hearts, girafee, and the ******* fire masks. I mean really.. what the hell is up with those?
    • Up x 1
  17. Shadowomega

    While vehicle Night Vision and Thermals never showed infiltrators, the HS/NV optic for all infantry weapons did highlight infiltrators during beta and for a few months after release. Because of this NS/NV was nerfed into what it currently form, and only be really useful for mass smoke drops. But we all know that just turning things down reduces the effect greatly or darn well removes it.

    The biggest issue is they only took half of what was suggested and didn't take it as one whole piece as many items were interconnected to bring true meta level engagements to the field. When they showed the ant was in the works and a true resource system was going into place PS 1 vets cheered as it as looking to put that depth we wanted with Lattice system back in. However after month and months of waiting we find out that the system was totally scrapped and they started working on this construction system we have now.

    I don't know how many times I have put forward concepts to SOE and later DBG only for them to be shot down and much later a insanely distorted version of one of my concepts shows up in game and is completely garbage. After seeing it too many times I just gave up caring.

    Now of the not bashing part, taking the Battlefield style of shooting mechanics was actually a good choice as it was far better than PS1's shooting mechanics as well as CODs shooting mechanics. Only downside was they did a poor job of implementing it and even worse job trying to balance it.
    • Up x 3
  18. CutieG

    What's your GPU?
    My CPU is a Haswell i5 at 3.1GHz. Even with Intel's incremental performance improvements, it shouldn't be as powerful as a 5GHz CPU from two generations prior. Your bottleneck must be somewhere else.

    Also, no one is disputing that performance got worse. The devs had to switch tools to a newer version of Visual Studio, which is less optimized with some functionality that they are using. (Most likely a case of less performance for more stability/usability)
    What we are disputing is that the game is as hard to run as Supreme Commander of Dwarf Fortress.
    As I mentioned further up, I had this game on a Celeron and a Pentium and had almost playable performance on the former and okayish performance on the latter. Getting the i5 did make me noticeably more useful in combat, though. I'm sure a modern i3 or r5 would have no problem with the game.
  19. ridicOne

    So in year 2 of PS2 beta which was officially live, they spent that whole year trying to fix performance issues. The outcome was the engine has too many holes to fix all the issues. So they patch work what they can, but to say this game runs good in the aspects of what the games mechanics intentions are, kinda blows my mind. I've tested this game on multiple different computer and builds. This game doesn't utilize SLI or Crossfire, I think that basically says it all. The engine looked good on implementation but when you started added masses of people it has lots of issues.

    Now in saying that what they have created is still awe inspiring because they tried to go outside of the box. The problem is they never really found away earlier on to spread the fights out to combat the close quarter combat issues. Now far removed from the chance to fix the issues and change the game meta to make people think that it's sometimes better to fight in the smaller fights. Everyone that's left for the most part just wants massive fights, the people that wanted to do logistics have left, tactical small groups just farm, well everyone just farms really. They had the chance in the earlier years of the games life to make some large meta changes and they didn't. So almost 5 years into beta and the game is a farming simulator with wanna be COD death match mechanics and no long term thought out meta.

    P.S. Battlefield you can prone in...
    • Up x 2
  20. Kumaro

    Haha oh yes the Higby, T-ray days with Smedley ontop letting those two run rampant. It was like a sick experiment. Taking greatness and twisting it into the first 4 years of hell. I feel sorry for the guys having to clean up the mess these people must have left behind. Not to mention the suits pushing them.

    I just hope someone dares to try and make a similar game in the future. It's such an untapped market with many hungry souls and fat wallets.