You're not using either of those things. The argument isn't about msw-r with advanced laser being bad, it's about FOREGRIP SNIPER SCOPE msw-r being bad. Also i'm really laughing if you think anyone would ever see you just because of the laser dot. Surely, the slim chance that maybe someone will notice it at night is worth dropping 30% off your hipfire cone.
I don't need any additional hipfire accuracy for typical usage. It's a tradeoff, and the gun has plenty already. If I used the laser sight with a CQC weapon, I'd be useless outside of CQC. Enemies would spot me when I'm trying to flank or be sneaky, which I do MOST of the time with great success. The argument isn't about which attachment to use with the MSW-R, it's about the fact that MSW-R with Forward Grip beats the pants off CARV with Laser Sight, and I've already explained why. Use what you want, but I'm not interested in the SMG body spraying setup for anything but base defense. My setup makes the weapon versatile and useful at both short and midrange, more so than a similar CARV setup. Also, yes, that laser dot extends behind cover easily and gives away your position when you're trying to hide behind corners. As for the scope, it's not for sniping. It's for precision headshot control. Much better than a reflex sight, especially for managing recoil.
How is that relevant? You just said yourself you weren't using it anyways, and if you're not using it I just pointed out to you how what you're doing is nonsensical and suboptimal. You're using an objectively worse setup purely because you're worried people are going to see a laser that doesn't render for anyone playing on low to begin with. I've made no argument against msw-r at close range with attachments that actually make sense btw.
It's relevant because you're comparing the Laser Sighted CARV... if I wanted a laser sight, I'd use the advanced one. I don't want the laser sight and specifically said I didn't want the laser sight because it gives away your position easily. That makes the CARV setup objectively worse. Emotions and sentiment have nothing to do with this, it's pure fact that three-foot lasers tell people where you are when you don't want them knowing. You wouldn't fault someone who wanted a suppressor to reduce their imprint just because it reduces their damage, would you? I'm using a setup that encourages versatility. It's not going to be as efficient as a close attachment close range weapon is in close range, but that's the opposite of versatile.
But it doesn't. Your hipfire is worse. Your aimed fire still has horizontal recoil. You have a smaller mag. The dps is the same assuming you control the horizontal recoil perfectly and no one will do this 100% of the time. You're trading this for the visibility of a laser. I don't think a laser has ever rendered for me on anyone's weapon past 10 meters, so this sounds incredibly silly.
All of that is countered by access to Soft Point Ammo, which I find invaluable to offset the CQC nature of TR weapons. The CARV has no comparison. It performs better at long range and slightly better at short with default ammo. But I'm already using a beast of a CQC weapon, having the midrange damage is worth the trade. You need a better computer. I'm wary of lasers because I do have the Advanced Laser Sight on my CQC defense setup and I have found it to result in deaths that could have been avoided. Furthermore, I see TONS of people, friendly and enemy, running around with lasers that make them stick out like sore thumbs even at 75m ranges. What I see is what my enemy sees, and I don't want to advertise my position that way.
Orion is best, after 2,5k kills as playing HA..that's my conclusion. Yeah I buyed few weapons aswell. Orions clip size is small.. but it's the best u got, just aim well and as someone said u can take 2-3 guys out depending on your aim/luck/positioning. Trying pulsar these days.. bigger clip but feels way worse.
As far as I know soft point ammo is -x%dmg at close +15% dmg at medium and -x%dmg at long range The msw-r does 143 dmg per shot. It takes 7 shots to kill someone. The msw-r with soft point does 164.45 dmg per shot at its optimal range and less at others (allegedly, anyways). It still takes 7 shots to kill someone. At most, soft point changes the threshold of shots to kill by one on targets with nanoweave in medium range. Again, I've made no argument against the msw-r at close range if you're using the adv laser. What I'm saying is that using a foregrip on the msw-r instead of laser on the carv is sub optimal. Msw-r with foregrip is worse in both close and long range when compared to carv + laser. The only thing you're gaining (and this is honestly debatable, seeing as I'm sure 90% of the community plays on low settings like me) is a marginal degree of stealth by not having a laser.
That's for people with bad aim, not people who can headshot. Your theoretical data doesn't match up to actual experience because of headshots, which are vital to scoring a kill at both close and midrange when skilled players are involved. Your definition of optimal is a fallacy. Optimal does not mean min-maxed, not when attachments vary according to taste. Lasers are a poor choice, not because of a marginal degree of stealth, but because in CQC you will often find yourself in spitting distance of enemies. Having a 3-foot laser added to your visual profile means cover is useless at a range where enemies can kill you in half a second. I've had countless enemies walk right past me when I wielded a forward grip because of that "marginal stealth". You have no inkling of just how valuable stealth is and how effectively I make use of it, that is why you are incapable of understanding my perspective. This comes in before even considering the value of short reloads with small clips vs long reloads with large clips. The game defaults to Medium, few people actually modify their video settings without tech savvy guidance. When 90% of the community posts their game specs, you'll have a case. In the meantime, your claim has all the relevance of giant robots to this argument. You're putting so much effort into arguing a point that boils down to your personal preference when the difference is miniscule between your setup and my own. Some players use suppressors on their weapons despite the damage loss, are their setups suboptimal? All they gain is a "marginal stealth" upgrade. If you feel stealth is worthless, then YOU can use a CARV with a laser sight. I do not agree with your assessment.
That's pretty much all I got out of that entire post. If we're going to go that route here you go : http://www.planetside-universe.com/player_stats.php?character=casual Stats are currently higher than that, but whatever. lol Also we're getting rather off topic, so back to my original point ; the carv and msw-r are both extremely similar to the orion but the orion is marginally better than both weapons. This is due to things like strafing faster in ads that neither the msw-r and carv have and significantly less recoil than the msw-r with nearly all other stats being equal to the msw-r barring only having a standard laser.
