When infils finally manage to chase every other player off...

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Zhakathoom, Jun 11, 2021.

  1. JustGotSuspended

    Exactly. Amazingly it's things that were there before, and the whole class was kept in check. Everyone was happy back then. People didn't really care about infils, and infils were happy they got cloak and primary weapons (a buff), which wasn't a thing back in planetside 1.

    Then they made snipers 1hk by tweaking nanoweave, added stalker cloak (which why on earth would you add infinite cloak in a shooter??!?!) and then broke the decloak/fire/cloak with the implementation of DX11. Oh and the vehicle cloak which...smh

    Obviously now infils won't want to give up their overpowered toy but seriously just revert to how it was before.

    We're debating how to solve an issue that was created by removing the solution that existed in the first place!!
    • Up x 1
  2. MonnyMoony

    IMO - lots of players playing as Infil (especially stalker) is a symptom of wider problems in the game.

    For newer players or players lacking the twitch reflexes or knowledge of how to exploit the game mechanics like sweaty try hards, staying hidden may be the only way they can stay alive for any reasonable amount of time.

    This game has become much more difficult for newer players over time. The starting equipment new players get is pretty much the same as at launch and the investment in time and effort to get decent equipment is significant. Long term players and vets have access to much more equipment than was available even a few years after launch (ASP, Implants, War Assets, Auraxium weapons). There are so many more infantry farming tools available (Colossus, OS, Bastion, HESH) - and many more of them around too.

    The disparity between experienced and new (or even mid level) players has widened significantly since launch and often these players will last barely seconds in a fight before being pinged in the head or HESH spammed out of existence and sent back to spawn. Staying hidden is IMO a defence mechanism.

    Something needs to be done to help re-balance the game to account for all these later additions and make the game a bit more forgiving (as it was in the first few years).
    • Up x 4
  3. JustGotSuspended


    For sure.

    I feel most of these problems originated from bad updates, although of course there were a few from the start, it wasn't this bad.

    The emergence of overwhelming infil, MAX, vehicle users oriented towards "ez-kill" "salt" centric gameplay is testament to what the game's become. Ironically, I'm sure if we reverted to beta we'd have more valuable players come back then the ones that would leave due to changes to their low risk high reward gameplay.
    • Up x 1
  4. JibbaJabba



    Any crutch you give to a new player will be exploited by a veteran player.

    Also the game was way LESS forgiving when it first released. Vehicles were 0hk with splash and had thermal sights. Decimators would set a tanks rear on fire in 2 shots. A2G had thermals. Everything had more range. Maxes were more deadly, had charge... etch..
  5. JibbaJabba

    /Hand up. Let me stop you right there. Before you call something stupid try to understand it. Otherwise you'll look.... nevermind.

    Delay before decloak is not the same as a weapon switch delay for a few key reasons.
    1. The delay time varies between weapons. For a pistol you'll decloak and fire fast. For a heavier weapon like SMG / Bolt, you'll switch slower just like every other class and this will impact your decloak.
    2. As a Sniper or CQB Bolter you will not be able to pre-aim and pre-zoom your weapon then hit the magic decloak+fire button. If you wanna fish for targets through your zoomed scope, you're gonna have to do so while decloaked.

    Should not be necessary to also hit decloak. You can if you wish to preserve cloak energy. But if you intend to fire, just switch weapons. It will decloak when the cloak "weapon" is no longer equipped.

    Worked yourself up into a frenzy. Nobody said you don't get a cloak. Read.


    You're floundering bro.
    You know good and well the **** is busted. But any time your mind drifts to what it would take to actually make it fair to both sides you recoil from the idea. I see you waffle back and forth on it within a single paragraph sometimes.

    But for you...
    Good News: This is DBG. It took them 7 years to fix NC maxes. I think you're safe.
    The Bad news: This among a few other bad sore spots are truly killing the game. You can see it if you pay attention.
    • Up x 1
  6. Scroffel5

    First off, variables. Pass up the variable that dictates the switch time, if you care so much, to the cloak. Its not rocket science.

    Secondly, why would they do that? Thats stupid. All you should have to wait on is the decloak timer and the weapon bootup or whatever, not having to wait for the switch, the decloak, and the zoom in. It removes the whole use of the cloak from a sniper's perspective. The cloak allows us to peak from a corner without immediately dying to the person who is waiting to shoot us. It allows us to never truly have to be pinned down behind a wall. We get to look out. If someone is staring at us through a sniper scope and we have to cloak, peek out, switch and decloak, then aim, we lose the whole usage of the cloak in that regard. Thats dumb. Let us have our aiming, thank you very much.

    Ok, thank you.

    No, you read. I said IF its a new slot and we can use other types of tools in it that aren't a cloak and that is the point of the new slot OR IF we have the ability to dequip the cloak, THEN we need a new ABILITY to compensate, and IF that isn't what you are saying, THEN the cloak is still the ABILITY and you didn't change anything other than timing. Stop being a passive aggressive dirtbag. So once again, no, you read, and if you need to, ask questions as I have, so that you can understand what I am saying instead of jumping to conclusions.

    I don't know what you mean. I am providing ways to make it actually fair for both sides while still making it fun for both sides. A new challenge for the Infiltrator and a new solution for everyone else. What are you talking about?
  7. JustGotSuspended


    No. It removes part of the "crutch" aspect of the class. The infiltrator now uses the cloak to position/reposition himself, as the cloak was supposed to be.

    I'm sure you'll recall in planetside 1 snipers did not have cloak, and there's a reason for thatt, partly including what you mentioned.

    Jibba's idea is actually the best in regards to modifying the cloak I think.

    To add on to that we could even buff the cloak to last indefinitely (significantly longer) while the person is moving, but drain in about 10-12s of standing still.
    • Up x 1
  8. JibbaJabba


    For sure. If cloak is moved to a weapon slot I think that really fixes the broken aspect of it. There is a lot about it that is not broken and I wouldn't mind at all a buff.

    As a buff I would suggest:
    Leave running-while-cloaked invisibility as-is.
    Reduce walking cloak visibility to what standing still is now.
    Reduce standing still crouched visibility to pure zero.... The cloaker has no equipped weapon, is perfectly stationary. Make them outright invisible. Darklight or bump into, or exploratory shots should be only way to find them.

    And increase the length.

    And possibly controversial... remove the going-into-cloak sound. A guy sniping from a hilltop that detects enemies being sent for him should be able to drop into cloak silently. Leave decloak in place both as a warning sound for those in a 1v1, as well as general detection.
    • Up x 1
  9. xLluisett

    I have no problems with infiltrators,because i play stalker,the real threat are the overshielded heavy assaults who notice me around,my chances to survive are 50/50. Imagine if 3 heavy assaults around,i must do hit and run tàctics that not always works.

    You say that the infiltrators are the easy way,but in fact is an hard life.

    After years of playing the planetside 2 game,i managed to start killing in killing sprees with my stalker,but when the target is a heavy assault,i think It two times before attack him,three if he use a shotgun.

    Really do not judge the life of an infiltrator if you are not playing one.

    Also the work of the infiltrator is like a real life spy,kill human targets who are threats.

    Heavy assault is like the rambo guy,they are strong and armed till the teeth.

    The light assault is like the touxhing balls fly,flying around bothering you and you do not know from where It comes.

    The mèdic is like star trek red guys.

    The engineer is the posh guy who parents (dbg) give all the toys. Soon with the nsoverhaul,the engineers can ress ns operatives from death,so they can do everything.

    And maxes,are hulks that every light assault see them first magically,because the end is a C4 explosión.

    See? Every class have good and bad things,so please stop complaining about infiltrators.
  10. JustGotSuspended


    Again with the generic 'have have to play to understand argument?'. Come on. Thankfully I've already addressed it in another thread so I'll just copy/pasta. I'll of course expect you to do the same in return, just to show us you don't only play infil and have little bias here.

    If you need more chars to check let me know, these are just a few off the top of my head.

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=trspy007&show=statistics

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=totalyheroicoignion&show=statistics

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=onion&show=weapons

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=trspy009

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=lneedarlde&show=weapons

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=deycallhimmkbuthiswristgotarolly

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=verifiedtrspy007

    https://ps2.fisu.pw/player/?name=yoursecretadmirer

    It's extremely easy, that's why people turn to it and it is one of the most controversial classes in the game, even more than MAXes. I mean you're an invisible boi with great weapons in 'massive' fights. You get to spend as much time as you want deciding which vulnerable opponent you'll attack, in the comfort of your invisibility.

    The heavy gets 407 extra health along with a movement penalty and quick draining of the ability. Not to mention they light up as a bright beacon towards a free kill. Heavies don't get to pick an chose their engagements the way infils do, which means it's very possible they get cliensided before they can even turn on their shield.

    Stalker infils on the other hand avoid infinite bullets by remaining indefinitely cloaked until they can deliver the clienside. So unless you're very 'bad'/unlucky, as a stalker infil you always have the advantage. For a heavy, or any other non-MAX class, their advantage is not guaranteed by their ability.


    Please enough of this 'infils kill high priority targets' argument to make infils osund like team players, it's super cringe and we all know that's untrue. Sounds like a generic copy/pasta from the class description.

    No, infils are the only truly solo oriented class, which do little to nothing to help their faction. Most won't hack terminals or deploy recon darts unless it favors them. In fact, unless they're in a squad and ordered to do so, they'll ignore any request to share recon with allies, and instead just use it to cover their own position from flanks or whatever. The infil isn't built to sustainably kill, it's there to get a few cheap kills on people and disappear. And due to the *caliber* of players who use the class, most often these cheap kills are just players low on health, or simply still or near still, for whatever reason. In summary, they often aren't threats, or targets of any priority.
  11. Scroffel5

    I remember the post you are referring to. You either misread or misunderstood it. I wasn't saying that you need to play the class to be able to comment on it or anything like that. I was talking about countering it. When you play the Infiltrator enough and start to adopt a different mindset, you can understand how an Infiltrator plays and what they are looking to do. That way, you can counter them so you won't play into a trap as much. You start to understand what to watch out for, what you would do if you were the Infiltrator, hence why I said you should play the class to get to understand what to do.

    Even as you have played the class as much as you have, you can still try to not fall into a trap. If you are playing against a person who knows where you are and can dictate when an engagement starts and sometimes when it ends or pauses, then you are going to have to do more planning than against someone you can easily surprise.

    Stalker infils are doodoo poo poo. Let me at em. I want to balance them. Revolver Stalkers kill too fast, Repeater Infils are guaranteed to kill, and so are Pilot Infils.


    We can only speak for ourselves. This is how we play. We are infils. We kill high priority targets. Thats who we aim for. Thats who we prioritize. Thats who we go for. We help out our teams. We hack stuff. We tell people to spawn vehicles off the things we hack. We share our recon darts with our team.

    If we had actual scouting abilities, Infiltrators would be the go-to class for it. They'd help find vehicle convoys and air squadrons and tell people where they are. They'd help in that way. In fact, Infiltrators are usually the first person to find Sunderers because they know where to look and can get there, and I make it a habit to tell my team exactly where the Sunderer is. Sure, maybe not every Infiltrator is as helpful as we are, but its only a solo oriented class if you allow it to be. It simply isn't overtly buddy-buddy with other classes because of the tools it has. It has the full potential to be, but thats just the way the community has decided to be. In a squad, having an Infiltrator can be very useful, but it takes more work to make it that way - more communication. You have to tell people things. You have to alert them of dangers. You have to snipe high priority targets. You have to find Sunderers. You have to warn them of the dude who is camping the same spot and killing people over and over again. The simple fact is that when an Infiltrator deals with someone or something, you just wouldn't know. They wouldn't tell you. They'd just do it and it'd be done and no one would know about it. How would you know if they sniped a high priority target? How would you know how many Sunderers they have contributed to finding and destroying? You just wouldn't, hence why people think they aren't useful in a team.

    Also, let them have their cheap kills. Thats war. Thats the game. Match set. You are low? You are going to get double-teamed on regardless. You are standing still? You are going to get killed regardless. You are preoccupied? You are going to get trashed on regardless. Thats just how the game unfolds. Thats what Infiltrators are supposed to do. They are supposed to mop up people who are threats and barely threats. They clean up the playing field. They discard of the trash, put it in a bin, and it decides if it gets recycled into someone better or not. At times you can't react, and there should definitely be a fix to that, but at the end of the day, thats life and thats death.
  12. Blue_Lion

    My experience they do not look for high priory targets. They look for targets of opportunity. The sniper infiltrators typically are not the the ones hacking typically are the ones that choose close weapons that hack. Many snipers just hide in the hills or something and shoot any one they can get their cross hairs on.

    Saying they kill high priority targets to me sounds laudably false.
    The long range snipers out side the base are not team players. They are just padding their personal stats.
    • Up x 1
  13. Scroffel5

    Long range snipers outside the base, far away, aren't contributing to the battle. Why care if they raise their own stats? Their stats mean nothing, do they? You guys don't care about their stats if they are Infiltrators anyways, so why do you care if they aren't helping you? Anyone killed helps you. You are right, though, that sniper infiltrators don't get close enough to hack vehicle terminals (unless you are a silly goose like me, which you are not.) And while you or people you see may shoot anyone they see, anyone who uses the "we shoot priority targets" defense doesn't. They pick and choose who they shoot. They shoot whoever they need to shoot first and whoever they can get away with shooting second. So you have two types of Infiltrators, I guess, and its not necessarily the fault of the class for how the community uses it.
  14. Blue_Lion

    Typically means not always. So their may be acceptations, when I switch to infiltrator class it typically for the intent of hacking terminals because the 5 snipers have not done it.

    I do not care about any ones stats I care about taking a base. Padding your own stats while not helping take the base,(for your own bragging rights) means you are no use to the team. The sniper infiltrators are typically more concerned with themselves than the helping the team win.

    Your selective target description does not mean high anything.
    Who do you need to kill- the people that found you and are trying to kill you. If he is trying to kill you he is high priority to you but if he is chasing you in the hills he does not matter to the people capturing and holding points, so he is low priority to your team/faction. High priority is really a meaningless descriptor because it is to vague to be useful because it is to subjective to have real value.

    High value targets would be what real life snipers look for. Taking out command structure-can't do that in game. That would leave selectively hunting targets with high kill counts, or targets defending the points(typically not exposed to snipers). But typically sniper kills are people that just died and are heading back to the fight. So they are not high value targets, but targets of opportunity.


    Try to claim any BS you want but lets face it snipers in PS 2 are typically about targets of opportunity. Because the place that for winning the kills matter most are often not exposed to snipers.
    • Up x 1
  15. Scroffel5

    I never said always. I said what I do and anyone who uses the "we kill priority targets" defense does. Therefore, no. Secondly, snipers are snipers. They don't get close and hack unless you are a different breed of sniper. They snipe. Thats what they do. So another no. Third, a person who you need to kill is dependent on the situation, but more than not, its a person who is killing your teammates. If they are preoccupied with killing your team, literally in the act of shooting them and being shot back at, you need to end them. Its not about if they are a high priority target to YOU but in general, and this is what anyone who hunts a priority target would do. Priority targets are also determined by class. Medics need to die ASAP. So do Heavies, because they are killing machines. So do enemy Infiltrators, because they are sniping your team and one of the biggest threats to you. Other examples of priority targets are engineers in the act of repairing something, players who just exited their vehicle, and MAXs when you can get a clear shot of the head. So again, no.

    You are right though. We can't take out command structure because we don't know who that is, and its not necessarily like that'd matter because we know how low level the teamwork and communication is in this game. There should definitely be a way to identify squad leaders and be able to take them down, maybe giving an increased bonus for doing so. You are also right that TYPICALLY players don't play like this, but Infiltrators who do are more useful to their team and, imo, should be playing like this.
  16. DarkQuark


    You can dress up that pig with all the words you want but it's still just a pig.

    Infiltrator as it stands now is broken. Even if you personally play with all the tactical intent in the world I promise you 85% of the other infiltrators are not. All they are doing it looking for weird spots to get in and make use of ClientSide2 so they can fire without being seen to get that 1 shot kill. We all know rule number 1 in Clientside is never stop moving, well the whole reason you cannot ever stop moving when you play the game is because there are always large numbers of snipers just waiting to blow your head off. And it seems as of late even moving non-stop is not enough.
    • Up x 2
  17. Blue_Lion

    Shooting a platoon or squad leader has no affect on the command structure. They can still give orders while dead. It gives them time to read and mark the map. So there is no reason to give bonus exp for it. (If I am a squad leader scouting enemy spawns my death I mark the spawn with smoke tell my squad to blow up spawn at the smoke. All before I re spawn.) The game system does not allow you to break down the enemies command structure.

    The problem is not the infiltrators that play as part of the team, it is the solo stat farming ones. So your whole rant is irrelevant to the problem people are talking about.

    I do not see snipers as a threat to my team but something annoying. Max crash and tank zergs are a threat to my team. Because they drive us away from capturing points. Snipers at best slow down getting bodies on point.
    • Up x 2
  18. Demigan

    Shouldn't a 50/50 survival rate mean it's a fair fight?
    Worse, you expect to survive against 3 Heavies as any class in a pure direct engagement? What kind of balance are you after?
    • Up x 2
  19. JibbaJabba


    A group of infantry are crossing a field.

    The high priority target is that heavy that is doing a mad therum shuffle. He's dangerous as **** and as soon as he reaches cover on the far side he's gonna start wrecking people.

    Who gets shot?

    The noob running in a straight line right next to him.


    This whole portion of the discussion gets into something I find infiltrators doing a lot: patting themselves on the back for crap they aren't really doing.

    How many times have you guys seen a friendly infiltrator let friendlies die rather than revealing their location? :p Give me a break on the teamwork crap.
    • Up x 1
  20. Scatterblak

    Hang a sec - you left something out:

    action music
    Dodging a nade
    jumping this log
    Shooting you in the face
    HOO! HA! KNIFE!
    Ah! Nearly got me that medic there!
    Have a flashbang!
    PewPew!
    Rattattat!
    YAY! I survived!

    *I guess I'll stand here not moving for a bit, checking my map, etc...*

    DINK!

    I imagine we'll only chase off the players who keep standing still all the time...