Welp.. Skyguards are useless now...

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Rhapsody, Mar 26, 2014.

  1. lawn gnome

    it is a common fight. i can think of several occasions that match this description.
  2. IamnotAmazing

    because that would be hilariously op, perhaps you should remember this is a balance discussion not what "should make sense"
    • Up x 1
  3. Shockwave44

    Like I said, Libs don't have that problem. Even if they did, they have the firepower to take out those tanks.
  4. lawn gnome

    agreed. at least where the tank buster is concerned.
  5. Henry

    OP is right, but you can't buff the AA because then the air game is shutdown by 2 skyguards..

    The problem is with the AA stacking dynamics, combined with essentially 100% specialization in AA.
    + no real AA options asside from MAX and skyguard.

    A lone skyguard is just a deterent, 3 shutdown everything in the air..
    But they have nothing to do with no aircraft around..

    2 Libs farming the infantry..
    -> Pull 1 skyguard
    A -> Get bombed by Lib -> DEAD
    B -> Get bored shooting at Libs that just escape to repair every time -> Get C4'd while sleeping -> DEAD
    C -> Libs fly away.. -> You wasted the resources and cooldown -> Whelp. That sure is a nice skybox to stare at.

    2 Libs farming the infantry..
    -> Pull 4 skyguards. -> Every plane, everywhere, killed. At the same time -> Nobody bothers to spawn a plane.
    --> Whelp. That sure is a nice skybox to stare at.

    None of that is fun for the average player.

    Why would people bother paying 1k certs, burning 300 resources and a Lightning cooldown, just to stare at the skybox or to get blown up (by the only thing you can do damage to).

    IMO It's easy to fix..
    Create a new AA gun that costs ~200 certs and is somewhere between the skyguard and the normal Lightning weapon.
    (Just take the skyguard model, nerf AA, and make flak explode for decent damage against ground units..)

    When excessive air shows up, more people will pick AA since they can actually have fun with it..
    -> The total AA get's buffed as needed, without the entire airspace getting locked by 2 skyguards..
    • Up x 1
  6. Delta102

    Agreed, although I think it would just be better if vehicles could change their loadouts at special bays located at bases or specific bases, or even a sunderer/galaxy attachment.
    • Up x 1
  7. lawn gnome

    the skyguard cannon is also great for infantry suppression, and (at least on connery) there are always at least a few aircraft to chew on.
  8. Springjack

    I think the Skyguard COF needs help, maybe it should take a second to spin to full speed, allowing you to nullify the cone of fire if you were just burst firing it, able to hit infantry/ground vehicles somewhat fairly. I just want the first round to hit on target (at optimal range).
    • Up x 1
  9. lawn gnome

    i would be ok with that. give it a rapidly building recoil. making it accurate for the first few shots is unlikely to be a very big buff as far as AA capability because the first few shots are usually used (at least by me) to sight in and find proper lead on targets.
    • Up x 1
  10. Henry

    Being able to suppressing infantry is like detering the few aircraft you find, not very rewarding for the average player.
    Imo the skyguard is pretty much the worst anti-infantry weapon in the game.
    I get more infantry kills with a Halberd..

    I'd like to see something like this, but I'm worried that skyguards that can be grabbed on demand, combined with the current AA stacking, might screw up the air game..
  11. Bl4ckVoid

    Everything should have a counter. The Liberator does not have one - except other Libs or a zerg (which both are a counter to everything). Another case of Lib pilots defending their unbalanced, overpowered farming vehicle - which probably drives away more new players than anything else.
  12. Phrygen

    lets be honest here.

    There were probably less than 50 players using the skyguard out of enjoyment. The rest were pulling them out of spite.
    • Up x 2
  13. CNR4806

    Technically speaking, I should also be getting fully-stabilized turrets, air search radar, automated FCS, an effective range of 10km or so, and a rate of fire of 1320rpm. *

    * The current Skyguard is a quad-40mm mount with a combined RoF of 480rpm, which intentionally or not is the rate of fire if you wield four WWII vintage Bofors 40mm L/60 (120rpm each) together. The current updated L/70 model has an individual RoF of 330rpm, giving a combined RoF of 1320rpm using the same mounting. The statistics and features given above are basically a not-botched M247 Sergeant York with two more guns.

    It would not be fun.

    That said though, Libs aren't exactly afraid of lone Skyguards pre-patch, so I don't see why they have to buff it against flaks further.
    • Up x 2
  14. lawn gnome

    yes you do get more kills, but i said suppression not kills. the high rate of fire, large clip size, and somewhat unpredictable cone of fire makes it amazing for pushing groups of infantry into cover. those guys coating the roof of a building spamming rockets or bullets at anyone who approaches, the skyguard is very unlikely to kill them but sweep back and forth a few times with the trigger held down and watch all of them dive for cover.

    suppression fire and killing fire are two very different things. your halberd will fire a rocket and likely kill one or two out of a big group, but then they will turn to fire on you. my skyguard will deal light damage to the majority of players in the group, and will drive them all back because most of them are taking damage and the air around them is full of tracers, with no evidence of it stopping any time soon. this is also why the lasher works so well for suppression fire.

    when you are suppressing you want weapons that are big and flashy over an extended period of time, actual damage dealing ability is irrelevant as long as the weapon deals some minor damage it will work, and inaccuracy / unpredictability is better because people can't ever be completely sure they can dodge while in the line of fire. if we could get rocket pods from an ESF on some sort of ground vehicle, then that would be the best infantry suppression weapon in the game.
  15. Rhapsody

    Should i be able to kill him in 1 clip? No...

    But if i managed to start firering at him from a location he isnt aware off.. unload 2 full clips into him.. he should not be able to then pop 1 ability, turn around, fly THROUGH 1 more clip of ammo, and instantly kill me.

    I could see an argument about a Skyguard being killed by a 2-person tank being a weak argument. But the Skyguard is DESIGNED as an AA deterrent. Its sole purpose was to take down Liberators and SF's. Yet it dosnt 'deter' anything anymore.
  16. IamnotAmazing

    You have so little time in a skyguard, das anfall doesn't even count it, and you have less than 51 kills with it, you just don't know what you're talking about

    If it took "2 clips" to kill a lib,( and I'm gonna assume you're talking about fire suppression when you say this ability, because auto repair doesn't work while you're taking damage), you must've missed a crap ton of shots.
  17. warmachine1

    Replace reloads with heating, BF4 is right there. Reloads on mounted automatic weapons make no sense.
  18. Rhapsody

    Nope. Ive had Liberators literaly fly directly towards me.. soak up my entire first clip.. soon as they start smoking and my firering stops, they pop fire-supression, auto-heal themselves, and by the time i start firering again.. theyve already gotten me down to 1/4 hp between the nose-gun and the bomber gun.
  19. cruczi

    Correct. One clip, even if you hit all shots, will not kill a lib. With fire suppression, the second clip is not necessarily going to kill either, not sure.

    The point of Skyguard is not to excel in 1v1 versus liberators, but to pepper flak at them from a distance or angle they can't retaliate. Liberator is the counter to ground units as much as a Skyguard is the counter to air units, but Liberator's strength is in its sheer damage output so you don't want to challenge them when DPS is the only factor. Skyguard is supposed to be more flexible in terms of range; have better awareness of enemy location (it's several times easier to spot aircraft from the ground than to spot ground vehicles from the sky); and the damage output of Skyguard is more continuous than discrete, i.e. it's more reliable but not as high in potential; and Skyguard is doing its job when it denies an area and forces enemy aircraft to move away - killing is not always the objective (can't say the same for a liberator).
  20. IamnotAmazing

    You're one skyguard, pull several, and yet again

    YOU DON'T HAVE ANY EXPERIENCE, play the game some more