We need to have a hard look at the balance of the AI-MAXs.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Dreez, May 1, 2015.

  1. Dreez

    Currently everyone's ******** about the NC MAX being OP, but what they're not looking at is the overall
    performance with its AI-weapon compared to the other 2 . An NC-MAX will empty its mags in roughly 2 seconds
    with a 4 second reload, which makes it useless twice the amount of time.

    An NC-MAX can dodge into a room and MAYBE kill 2-3 people before it needs to bail and reload for
    4 seconds, all while its completely at the mercy of the enemy. The TR and VS MAX with their FAR superior
    performance in AI, can run into a room and completely nuke everything in it, and have ammo to spare in
    its much larger clips.

    And this is what needs looking into. Everyone ******** about the ScatterMAX, but the other 2 have a much
    higher performance and ability to kill over time with much less downtime for reloads. An NC MAX has to
    stop for reload every 2-3 seconds.

    And after last changes to the game, i find NC-MAXs losing close-engagements with other MAXs out of
    lack of firepower. I've seen Zealots demolish NC-MAX's with Comets..
    • Up x 7
  2. cyb_

    • Up x 7
  3. TheMercator

    VS Maxes have to much range. They are the only ones, that are usefull at AI when outside of a biolab or other close-quarter bases.

    I don't give a crap about your bloody statistics. What matters to me is having fun, and getting literally instagibbed by walking tanks ain't no fun. That is probably where the majority of complaints stem from. That's not to say that shotgun gorillas need changing. Just trying to make clear what actually matters in a video game.
    • Up x 11
  5. prodo123

    If you empty your entire mags in 2 seconds at anything other than a MAX and have trouble surviving whatever that's left behind, the problem isn't the game...
    • Up x 2
  6. DramaticExit

    Equally, it isn't all that much fun getting shot up by a Vanu MAX at genuinely surprising ranges, standing in the doorway of a point room, not allowing anyone to get to the range where an NC MAX would be able to instagib something. Pounders being spammy and splashy is pretty damned irritating too.

    The problem is not any one faction's MAX... All three are extremely tedious and un-fun to fight against - Especially when someone holds Hossin and gets them half price.
    • Up x 10
  7. Lord_Avatar

    Make MAX units non-revivable. /complaints
    • Up x 3
  8. HadesR

    Makes you wonder why the combat designer didn't want them in the game ;)

    But Higby

    Also Discussion here http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/...needs_to_be_done_about_maxs/cqsx1hp?context=1

    From which I can gather by Radar's responses that the Dev's are maybe looking into changing them in someway or t'other
  9. Ballto21

    >Fastest maxVmax ttk
    >slug mattocks
    >fastest outright ttk

    u WOT m8?
    • Up x 3
  10. Dreez

    The differense is that while an NC-MAX can jump into a room and kill 2-3 people before it has to run out to
    reload, the TR and VS MAX's can just go into a room full of infantry and clean house because of their much
    larger clip-sizes and effectiveness over time.

    When the NC-MAX walks into a room, all you do is take cover for a few seconds until it has to reload,
    meanwhile you got infantry taking out rockets and killing it when it reloads and is unable to defend itself for 4 seconds.
    The VS and TR MAX's will just continue to fire and nothing will be alive by the time it's time to reload.
    • Up x 2
  11. Mxiter

    well..; if in 16-20 shotguns pellet you can only kill 2-3 guys, TR & VS would be able to kill 5 guys at max with them magazines :D

    Also complaining about substainability?

    Empty alternatively right & lesft weapons 1 by 1, you'll still have better DPS than TR/VS maxes and can fire without downtimes (reloading while the other gun is firing).
    Aww you will certainly lose your instakill ability, but 0.3 sec is the same according NC max defenders.
    • Up x 2
  12. FateJH

    That "effectiveness over time" is generally a double-edged sword because it gives the target and its allies reaction time.

    In theory, the NC MAX should survive longer because it can do its thing quickly (kill things) and then back into a position of cover (while reloading). The TR and VS MAX has to commit much more to a room to net the same kills, allowing more varied responses other than "bwuh--ded" from not only the targets but the targets' allies who are not being shot at. If the targets fall back under cover, whoever's MAX it is has to venture further into the room if it wishes to pursue, and that can be dangerous. The fatal alpha damage of the NC MAX is useful because it lowers this chance to flee, especially with latency taken into account as the MAX who just walked through the door will have clientside on their side for the duration of the encounter (aggressor).

    That's what people complain about with NC MAXes generally - being gibbed without being able to react, because nearly every room falls within ideal weapon range.
    • Up x 4
  13. maxkeiser

    AI maxes are fine as they are. They should be very powerful.

    The devs just need to bring back the timer on pulling one and possible up the resource requirement a small amount.
  14. Schizomatic

    For 450 nanites, you can really farm the hell out of infantry and vehicles with an MBT over the slow and vulnerable MAX with its limited range, but it seems to me that people don't complain about getting farmed by a Magrider, yet if they die in an infantry fight, suddenly it's deeply personal.
    • Up x 13
  15. Littleman

    MAXes are pretty much the only effective answer versus the other sore spot, HA. And said HA can drop a MAX in 2-3 rockets or one magazine from an LMG.

    If they're going to to hurt MAXes in some way, they really need an answer for HA. I don't pull anything else because I'm tired of 7/10 enemies being an HA, and unless they're bad shots and I'm robot-good at head shots, they're going to win. At least with a MAX, I can opt to run like hell because they lack range capability and even hear them coming when they get close. I can also expect that when I damage them, it won't be recovered in an instant.
    • Up x 2
  16. Goretzu

    You aren't comparing like for like though.

    Look at CQB Carbines averaging 20-25 KPH....... then look at PA Shotguns (closest thing to NC AI MAX weapons) averaging out at ~35 KPH..... which is pretty much the same gap between TR/VS AI MAX weapons and NC AI MAX weapons, :eek:

    So do PA Shotguns need a nerf?

    Or are they different weapons used in different ways?
    • Up x 1
  17. xMaxdamage

    Oh please.
  18. Littleman

    Keep telling yourself HA are fine, but MAXes are a problem.
    • Up x 1
  19. quatin

    You're sort of correct. The weapon systems define the method you can use each factions MAX. The problem is NC MAX excel in the 2 areas where MAX units are most useful. Rush points. Destroy vehicles

    Nothing beats a NC MAX rush to capture a point inside a room. OP whines about "only killing 2-3 people per rush", but a NC MAX rush insta-gibs the entire room. Scatters beat all other AI weapons on MAX vs MAX up close, so there nothing that you can't kill. (OP supports this by observing that it takes a VS max with Comets, an AV weapon, to take him down. )TR/VS MAX rushes are a bit more vulnerable, because their TTK is higher. The defenders have more time to shoot rockets, nades and C4 so there's more risk of the rush failing. OP is exaggerating the ability of TR/VS maxes. Popping in and out of a full room with a MAX unit and still killing enemies is a luxury only NC gets. Everyone else will eat a decimator by the time they kill someone.

    As for vehicle killing, ravens are probably the best AV weapon in the game.

    If you play for Alerts. NC MAX beats everyone else. If you want to farm infantry from mid-range. TR/VS MAX would be better.
    • Up x 2
  20. Badname82

    Uh wut. Of all the problems with Max AI, it has nothing to do with NC Maxes having an issue against other Max units.

    Step 1: Equip Hacksaws
    Step 2: Equip Charge
    Step 3: ....
    Step 4: Dance on the corpses of dead enemy max units

    There's no way a VS Max beats you unless you are trying to fight them from outside 8-10m. Nothing stops a VS or TR max crash in a bio dome like a handful of Hacksaw Max units. If anything, I'm coming around to see that the dedicated AI weapons on TR might need a bit of a bump up. They shouldn't have to use pounders to fix NC maxes, and I'm someone who thinks pounders are OP as AI right now. They should be able to use something else for that.

    Yeah, it sucks about having to have a long reload after gibbing 3-4 infantry while other Max units keep on trucking. But despite that NC Max are fine, every imaginable stat proves that. The fact that NC can trump other max units in enclosed areas compensates for the 4 second reloading.
    • Up x 2