[Suggestion] We need a constant objective

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by adamts01, Aug 4, 2019.

  1. adamts01

    When there's no alert, no one cares about anything. How about a small trickle of certs or ISO while you hold the most territory? Maybe let that rate increase the more balanced the other two factions' territory is, to discourage double teaming.
  2. FateJH

    You do have a constant objective - conquer your enemy's territory, with the frequent subtask of defending your own territory. The effort of accomplishing these tasks produces cert gain activities.
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  3. Demigan

    On the constant objective topic, I think that offering too much of a reward for holding the most would encourage too much zerging and also make the losing factions feel punished for not performing as well. So you'd be rewarding 1/3rd of the playerbase who feel good and 2/3rd would feel bad.
    I'm not sure what else to do, we already had the system where players could work to activate alerts by holding enough, and this also caused massive zerging strategies.
    The key of such a constant objective would be to encourage players to play the game the way they want to without ruining other player's gameplay. If you are losing that objective you should still have fun, but I have not alternative to give atm.

    As for why you think we need another objective, I think it's a case of needing more variety.
    No one cares because you've done it all before, and even if I enter a brand new base now I still have to do the exact same thing as I've done at any other base. You can see the Sunderer garage or likely safe spots on the map, you can see the enemy spawnpoint. You can hazard a guess where the point is and know where it is when you get there. Most bases you can then just take the paths the base designer left you to fight to the point, clear it out, capture it, hold it and then you've won.

    If each base offers a more varied and unique way to fight and capture it that changes with each continent lock you can keep the interest. I've talked about them before already:

    Several variations of CTF. The most entertaining in PS2 would be one where you capture a flag and bring it to a deployed Sunderer, where it counts as holding the point(s).

    VIP modes, such as points that are only capturable by picking them up and keeping them inside the no-construction zone of that base (and outside of painfields). As long as you hold it the timer runs.

    Another VIP mode would be that points are only capturable when you carry a resource-costing module in your utility or grenade slot. place/throw it at the point for a capture. Players carrying such a device would be auto-spotted on the radar for a certain distance to encourage players not to carry one all the time and make capturing the point with a device a dangerous task.

    Attrition modes. Best used as an additional game mode on top of an existing one to balance out overpops. When you kill someone a certain amount of seconds is added (defender kills an attacker) or subtracted (attacker kills a defender). This allows the defenders when outpopped to keep up the timer even when they don't hold the point, but only if they are agressive enough to score enough kills without dying too much. The more outpopped you are the more seconds you earn.

    Time bomb: Combines VIP and King of the Hill game modes. You have to transport and place a time bomb at a specific spot (for convenience let's just say at the point). Unfortunately the time bomb already starts ticking the moment you pull one at the Sunderer and when you die it drops for someone else to pick up and use... Naturally you are visible on the radar for enemies and allies and it would also show how much time is left so players won't be surprised or griefed by an "ally" who follows them with a time bomb.

    Point construction. Rather than the points being active there are a few consoles scattered throughout the base. Players have to access one to receive a portion of the code to activate it, then move to the point and access the point to make it active. Similar to how shield generators show stripes to indicate which one is active or not the point would show what code it's received and what not.
    If the attackers have activated the point, the defenders can deactivate it by simply accessing it. However this does not flip the point to them and allow the timer to count down, it only makes the point neutral. So the defenders would need to gather code from consoles and bring it to the point to activate it to force the timer to count back down again. This creates a larger focus on protecting parts of the base, as the attackers and defenders can prevent the opposition from clearing their tasks by holding a console.
  4. adamts01

    It's PvP. If there's a winner, there has to be a loser. That's just the way it is. This game has plenty of participation awards. These mini-alerts are great, but the fact is there aren't any beneficial goals when a fresh continent unlocks, and during all the time between alerts. We could have nonstop mini alerts, but I think rewarding continent control is a quick and easy goal to shoot for. Plus, from a platoon leading perspective, having a consistent goal is nice. I bounce around like crazy during alerts, playing redeployside, but it's wearing on a platoon, in which the majority of members are casuals. I'm worried that too many mini-games would exasperate the situation.

    Having the most territory is most often the worst thing you can do before the main alert starts. The best place to be is a close 3rd place. And that's just wrong.
  5. Demigan

    It's PvP, but in normal PvP it's a relatively short lived affair. You fight on a map, someone wins, then the game is reset with players rebalanced across the factions and the battle begins anew.

    But in PS2 you don't have that. Battle goes bad? You don't get to reset it after a loss nope you've got to stick it out for half an hour or more until either enough reinforcements arrive, you leave the fight yourself or they reach the warpgate and can't push any further.

    Also the things I proposed wouldn't be mini-alerts, they would be normal capture mechanics just like the current king-of-the-hill capture points. They would simply switch out after each continent capture to keep it fresh. For example one day you attack Mani Tower and you have to do a CTF, the next time the continent has cycled you might have our current capture mechanic and the next day you have to do a VIP type capture mechanic or it stuck at the current capture mechanic or who knows because it's randomly selected after each continent capture!
  6. adamts01

    In that case, rewards are just consolation prizes for having a bad time. A bandaid . Discouraging double teaming is the real solution.

    Those new capture mechanics could be fun. I'm all about changes to keep the game from getting stale. But we still need something more productive for platoons to do when there's no alert.
  7. chamks

    i have an idea: make a benefit mechanics from bases like teach plants and bio labs, but from more bases and with more verity of perks. like if your faction doesnt have 5 bases you cant load bolt action snipers, 7 bases for non-default rocket launchers, and specific bases with specific bonuses. imagine how much people will start play the objective to capture bases instead of playing dummies and just wanna increase k\d.
  8. AllRoundGoodGuy

    Just spit balling here,what if each faction got a mini alert to capture a base in say 20 minutes, and to defend from an opposing factions target base. Something kinda like this.

    EDIT: I should have pointed this out, but that I'm assuming the TR are upper right, VS are lower left, and NC lower right
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  9. Demigan

    what's with the green arrows and red points?

    Also what if the base is already taken by the opposition? What do you gain from winning the mini-alert?

    Wouldn't it be easier to simply add a random mini-alert at a base to draw a crowd? In the case of small bases you could make the alert pop up at several to spread out population. The mini-alerts could be anything, from a momentary deathmatch to only people who haven't died since they entered the area/the alert started being able to capture points to a giant game of tag or whatever.
  10. AllRoundGoodGuy

    I was lazy and used some google image. Honestly, until you pointed them out I didn't realize they were there.

    My idea was more targeted for platoon leaders to give them something to do. The attack base alert would ideally target bases that are not currently being capped. As for rewards, idk, 50 certs to the winner and 20 to the loser? Idk.

    EDIT: I have nothing against said mini-alerts, I am not sure how well they would do as a platoon target, "Hey everybody, let's play tag!" could be fun, maybe.
  11. adamts01

    That's basically what we already have. Think "capture all amp stations/bio labs/tech plants". My only issue with more mini-alerts is it keeps shifting focus from here to there. Think about how quickly a platoon burns out when you play redeployside. There needs to be a stable objective, that doesn't punish you like holding the most territory when a main alert starts.
  12. Demigan

    I think they are the worst type of mini-alert we can have. It doesn't really change anything except sometimes more focus is put into capturing one.

    Also what's all this about "platoons need something to do"? What about everyone else? I never understood why people try to make content just for squads and platoons. We need content for everyone. The only content for squads and platoons should be geared towards helping them stay together as a group and perform together. But any content that could just as well apply to groups of randoms should not be withheld from those randoms for the sake of "squad/platoon teamplay". That would just be detrimental for no reason.
  13. adamts01

    Individuals absolutely benefit from winning alerts... Individuals can fight towards those goals too.

    As for purely individual goals, there are directives, ribbons, stats.... FUN! There's plenty to do.
  14. TR5L4Y3R

    except most of the stuff you get by simply playing the game there isn´t exactly a push to go for these ..
    once you got the directives that goal is done, so it´s not constant .. ribbons come in every now and then .. nothing to actively go after ...

    and i agree with fate .. you do already have a constant mission, in capturing and defending bases weither as a lonewolf or teamplayer, that´s the coreobjective of the game ... ... in that case any and all content needs to be directed torwards that coreobjective in some way ..

    people do not care bout the mainobjective you say?
    ok then why is that?
    KD pandering as a sniper? don´t make K/D the corestat to look at, reward the simple action of being in a engagement by dealing damage to the enemy or actively be on the capturearea, kills should be a minor extrabonus ..
    sniper still hanging back cause thats what they have fun with? well can´t force everyone to be on the front ..

    people go off gathering cortium than being part of the fight?
    then add silos to laticebases for the option to fortify/upgrade basedefenses slightly when no pmb is build (or rather pmbs being made for offense), maybe add a module for emergency-gateshield-generation when the baseshieldgenerators have been taken down and defenders need some extratime, the closer the silo is to the frontline the better the XP/certgain so cortium harvesters are motivated to get to the bases that are actualy fought over ...

    vehicles and aircraft are a bit tough but in general their job is either to cut off/siege or defend spawnoptions when it comes to laticebasefights ... if ballance between infantry vs vehicles would be better (were as infantry get effective AV options) the devs could think about oppening bases up for vehicles to be more involved (and infantry in openareabattles) ..
  15. adamts01

    Let me put it this way. I agree that capturing and holding territory should be the goal. Right now, the WORST thing you can do preparing for the main alert is capturing and holding territory. The last place you want to be when an alert starts is the faction with the most territory. This punishment for holding the most territory is what should change. Even if it's still the worst way to start an alert, there should be some reward for having that territory as the continent progresses.
  16. FateJH

    The risk for managing any level of territory is an on-the-ground strategic concern and should not be considered in this argument as either a positive or a negative. Let's ignore continent Alerts entirely and focus on something standalone.

    Back when territory gave resources, the aspect of the game where people chose to fight specific bases to maximize specific perks of the base was arguably underplayed. Some people probably tried to use it as intended (and, for them, applause) but the actual result of the perks never seemed to translate to being uniquely worthwhile. While saying going after one base or another for resource allocation might have seemed useful, I wouldn't say the motivation of that carrot was strong enough to steer the cart down the path of specifically "mech" or specifically "infantry" for most. If there's going to be benefits, those benefits should not come in trickles. Under the artifice of the lattice, such a system wouldn't be exceptionally viable without an ability to guide the direction of the park directly.
  17. OldMaster80

    In my experience no one cares about anything even during alerts. It's all about directives, kdr farming, kph.

    No one gives a damn about territory control and global domination. Imho this is where this game totally failed: it's nothing more than a big team deathmatch, there is absolutely no common goal convincing players to cooperate.

    Just look at how bad is the cohesion of the open squads, just look at people redeploying when they cannot save their kdr, just look at Reddit discussions about how fast they auraxium guns and no questions about how to attack / defend effectively.

    And in all of this outfits role has just been downsized so that it's no longer central at all.
  18. DarkStarAnubis

    Unfortunately it is true.

    The emphasis in PS2 is toward killing (aka farming) as many enemies as possible because that would unlock prized weapons.

    Winning alarms and locking continents provide only short-term rewards (certs and iso).

    You can see immediately where the focus has been placed by the designers

    Just think about the "don't kill the Sunderer so we can farm more" pattern that derives from it...
  19. TR5L4Y3R

    this is why i am of the opinion that directives and ribbons need a rework ...
    even though to a number of people that might not change their behavior of going for kpm/kph or kdr
    but the general actions that go more torwards the supposed coreobjective should be more rewarded ..

    or lets stay in the biolab forever ...

    ... heck i wouldn´t mind a selfdestructoption for the sunderer to nuke the farmers when attackers or defenders realise that they get farmed :p ...
  20. JibbaJabba

    You do have a constant objective unless you turned it off in options.

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