Waterson Has Become a Nightmare As "Emerald"

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by AFK1, Oct 18, 2014.

  1. Juunro

    "VS is just better" is what your post comes down to. Which is clearly not the case in the aggregate. You guys have more top tier outfits then the other two, which is the key to winning Alerts in the end. The average VS are zerglings; the average VS is DaPP. Are you telling me that DaPP has inherently better strategic insight then PHX or AoD? I mean, really?

    VS has more above average players; they can swing equally sized fights very effectively; I've personally seen a half dozen AC members stop four times their number of NC or TR. Having at least three outfits capable of this to the NC and TR's what, one apiece? This swings alerts. Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.

    "Takes more brain cells then the typical TR or NC can use, it looks like."

    Brought up SPM and KDR because, ignoring top tier outfits, those are the best indicators of individual battle effectiveness, and on that front? The VS is average. You guys have more high tier outfits, you guys have more organization. That wins Alerts, sure, but that doesn't mean every VS is better inherently by dint of being VS, which is almost always the response in these threads to NC and TR whining about VS.
    • Up x 3
  2. Imij

    You want TR and NC to start winning more often? Get AC and DA to swap empires. It's as simple as that.

    Why are you arguing against yourself? If you're saying that Yuuki says VS has more skilled players and then specifically point to how VS has more skilled players that can swing fights in their favor... wtf are you even talking about?

    You understand the problem, you understand what's happening, you understand AC/DAs affect on the fights, and yet you're still arguing. Where is the logic?

    People aren't saying all VS are better. People are saying something to the effect of "if you lined up 500 VS/TR/NC you'd have like 10% good TR/NC players and 30% VS." On top of that those 30% VS players can take on the other 90% of the TR/NC without much problem giving the other 70% VS more freedom to do whatever, hence making VS look OP and/or better as a whole.
  3. Coolitic

    What are you talking about, the game is pretty equal on that server.
  4. Juunro

    The reason I brought it up is that in most of these threads where people whine about VS for one reason or another, almost universally the argument winds up being from VS players that it's because the VS is just inherently better as a faction. Which it is clearly not in the aggregate. The average VS player is the same as the average NC or average TR player. The VS has more top tier players, but they are not representative of the faction as a whole.

    Think of it like this: New York and Baltimore city both have professional baseball teams. Does the fact that the Yankees are generally better then the Orioles mean then that people in New York are inherently better at Baseball? Does it mean that bush league and little league teams from New York are inherently superior to those same kinds of teams from Baltimore?

    Because that is the logic that is usually espoused in these forums.
    • Up x 1
  5. DorianOmega

    The problem is that the VS have smarter more organized players, thats just a fact.
  6. Falcon 197

  7. AFK1

    Try reading the thread, instead of posting nonsense

    This isn't an issue of skill, it's an issue of faction/population imbalance
  8. Yuukikun

    In case you didn't know, i'm in both DA and AC. You say that VS have more ''top tier'' players right? You also know that if you have alot of top tier players it also increases the whole faction's average.

    (2+2+2+2+2)/ 5 = 2 and (2+2+2+4+5) / 5 = 3
    So yes that means the VS is on average better. Did i say DaPP is better than AOD? Firstly i don't care and secondly I never said that.

    I also never said that every VS is better than every NC/TR, again you're making things up.

    What my first comment was about is the fact that the OP is asking for the whole VS faction to be punished for having more organization and more skillful plays on average than the other factions, which is a completely absurd way of thinking.

    However, if you want to talk about the ''zergle'', while playing VS i see ammo packs along the way during a push, i see engies repairing maxes, i see waves of people attacking a location at the same time. I have also played TR and NC alot recently as i don't have any infantry gun left to auraxium on my vs, and i know of 2 major problems with NC and TR.

    NC's problem: people only play for themselves. You will rarely see any engineer in even 48+ fights, medics that only revive squadmates are a majority too. You will see a stream of people going 1 by 1 trying to cap a point, without waiting to do a group push.

    TR's problem: i might get alot of hate for this one but i think it's caused by the military culture of this part of the community. TR players are actually the ones who talk the most about tactics and war and realism, yet they are the one who also play the most of the ''i don't want to die'' realistic part of war. You will see over half of TR's population in a spawn room, unless they completely outnumber the ennemy forces then they might leave the safety room. During attacks, they will try to camp the ennemy spawn before even thinking of going to the point, or they will find a comfortable spot and stay there for dozens of minutes just shooting in front instead of risking their life to make the forces advance. It's still hard for me to understand how TR behaves as it is completely against my playstyle (hyperagressive and rushing objectives). TL;DR about TR, they are the ones who play the objective the least by far of the 3 factions (on Emerald).
    • Up x 1
  9. Juunro

    You did not; I also didn't call you specifically out on it. What I said was that usually in threads like this, you get waves of VS people talking about how superior they are. Which is really only true of a fairly small percentage. And yes, every time I have played my VS alt I have seen waves of idiots getting mowed down and then ******** about medics and ammo. When I have played my NC I have seen plenty of engineers doing the ammo spam / repair thing. I have seen plenty of Medics doing the revive thing. I have seen support people doing the 'I only play for myself' thing in equal amounts on all three factions. My main point was that, getting away from the absolute best of the best, which again, I never said the VS didn't have more of, the factions are generally equal. I would also suggest that amongst the absolute top tier outfits, the players are probably very close to equal.

    And yes, I know what outfits you are in. I shot you to death the other night at a Tech plant with my Warden while you were jump jetting around, then you caught up to me a few minutes later and ended my life. :p
  10. Yuukikun

    So while the actual server population might show itself as being "even", the effective battle population always favors the Vanu

    those are your own words

    how can you contradict your own self when trying to call me out on non-sense (my post makes a lot more sense than yours)
  11. Yuukikun

    There are no outfits on NC or TR that even come close to AC or DA, unless it's our altfits. I'm not even sure if there's an equivalent of zPod. Maybe TIW.
  12. FireclawX

    Even VS second tier outfits are pretty much on par with some of the best that TR/NC have to offer.
    Think V, GOKU etc.
  13. Yuukikun

    you mean the ones who hide behind DA and AC and then spam yell chat thinking they're good?

    The truth is that having amazing players in a faction makes a lot of people just follow them for free wins. This makes them below the average of the enemy factions. So many times i see GOKU, GOTR and V not even being able to defend a base with 50/50 pops. Trust me they sure don't spam the yell chat during these ones. But then suddenly a few DA or AC arrive, push the ennemy back and then the yell spam starts. It's so cute how the dogs who barks the most bite the least.
  14. Juunro

    You know Yuuki, this is something I think I agree with you on. I know for a fact I can't take one of you DA/AC guys one on one unless I get lucky or pull a complete ambush, though Engineer is already at something of a disadvantage against a fully kitted out HA, even with maximum Nanoweave. Not that its an excuse, it'd be the same if I went HA.

    Honestly, personally? I've never actually had a problem with DA/AC/ZAPS in the sense of like "These guys are jerks, boo", but it always amuses me when guys in GOKU or DaPP start yelling about how superior VS is when you guys pull their butts out of the fire. Which does get back to my point about the average players in all factions being about equal.

    I will say this, fighting DA tends to make me twitchier and very much helped me get better at flanking; can't take em from the front, try and take em by surprise an all that.

    Of the skill gaps that absolutely infuriates me the most though? And this happens on my characters on all three factions, mind. Why does nobody but me seem to ever shoot those stupid Infil motion tracker deployables? I've seen dozens of people stare at them for a moment and just walk by. Its goddamn irritating. o_O
  15. Negator

    youre so full of **** Yuuk. Never been to V/GOKU/GOTR outfit ops, no idea what we do. The truth is, having outfits that dont mind leading pleatoons makes alot of people just follow the zerg for free wins. Please though, show me those streams of you doing anything but redeploy hopping.
    • Up x 4
  16. gibstorm

    Goku makes TR win when they switch to our side. So they most be doing something right.
    • Up x 1
  17. Frostiken

    Your average player is going to perform better with rational, sane leadership. Leadership trickles down. In the military, it goes from the senior officers to the junior officers to the senior NCOs to the junior NCOs to the grunts. Having good leadership in platoons will teach other people how to run quality platoons, who will in turn run their own.

    If your platoons are run by mostly ********* and clowns and the biggest example of 'strategy' your faction can find is AOD smashing the 'U' key every thirty seconds to deploy all four squads to a single meaningless base to 'rescue' it against a force of like fifteen dudes, what's that teaching the rest of your players?
    • Up x 2
  18. Posse

    GOKU or V on par with TIW? Let's not exaggerate please

    (on the other hand, that might be true if you compare with TR)
  19. Yuukikun

    I fought all these outfits many times. I actually reached br 57 on my NC fighting them (that's only 1 of my alts) and i have yet to see them take a base with less than 60% pop and a huge amount of cheese spam without DA or AC names being in the frey.

    You obviously haven't watched my streams though as i am most of the times the first one entering a building or going through a choke point to make people want to follow and then make the push progress forward.

    And since you're crying about redeploy, so many times i've seen a 12-24 V squad taking an empty base and leaving as soon as NC reach 40% pop because we pushed you out and it's not an easy cap anymore.

    What makes me laugh the most is that you think all i do is redeploy, when i stay at a base until the fight is over, or until it becomse a mindless cheese spam (having GOKU or VCO completely zerg out a 50/50 pop fight)

    It makes me sad that you can't understand that leading with actions is better than screaming on yell chat that you're a leader. There is no point in having a ''leader'' (not talking about beacons and such benefits) on live because the people need to be lead on the ground, not on the map. Any kindergarden child can read the PS2 map. What i do is go first and make people follow me on the ground. I don't need a little star over my name to do so. And i have seen streams and videos of outfit leads. It's more of a loss of time to wait for orders or to give orders to people. I have the habit of thinking everyone is as good as me and understands the game as much as me, and because i believe this, i don't believe giving them orders will help in any way.

    I joined DA and AC because i wanted to try playing with good players, to see if it's fun or not. A good outfit/squad is one that doesn't need to have a leader, because everyone is a leader. If you look at the best LoL teams or Starcraft teams, they don't need a leader to tell them what to do at every step, they all know what to do and only call out important information.

    I do know that some people like to be told what to do, i have nothing against them, but these are not the people i want to be with, and that's why i don't need to be leading or in an ''outfit op'' to play with the people i like, because i have a good synergy with them even if we're not in the same squad.

    But you know, i'm open minded, and if you really think that your outfit and your way of leading is pristine, then i'm ready to play with V for a while and see it for myself. But you know, you might not want considering the only thing you can say is ''you're so full of *****''.
  20. Frostiken

    So why don't you just go switch to NC permanently and hang out with WisdomCube if you have this much contempt for everyone else on your side. Your massively elitist attitude would fit in well over there with all the other drama.

    Your outfit is the best, your dick is longer than ours, you have more hair on your head and make more money than us. Did I miss anything? Why are you even still here?

    Seriously though, do you even read this drivel after you write it? People like you are why I quit playing competitive games.

    GROW UP.
    • Up x 1