VS LMG rework

Discussion in 'Heavy Assault' started by Auzor, Jun 4, 2015.

  1. Auzor

    So, the Vs are losing the 0.75 ads. GOOD, good, let the hatred flooow through you. :)

    Problem: the rest of the LMG's are.. kinda baaaad.

    Some reworks are in order.
    Now, if the Orion can't get SPA, it is, IMO, inferior to the MSW-R.

    Proposed Orion:
    698 rpm, 50 bullets magazine.
    Short reload: 2.8s. (current: 3.28)
    long reload: 3.3 (3.655)
    muzzle velocity buffed to 620 m/s.
    Horizontal recoil -> 0.2

    ADS moving accuracy:
    crouched: 0.2
    standing: 0.3.

    This is a "Vanu" weapon, see the higher initial accuracy of the Pulsar & the Solstice.
    Fast reload, lowest damage/mag of all the starter weapons,..

    Proposed SVA-88:
    This one gets the SPA, and 750 rpm.
    Now of course, this means the VS CQC LMG has more bullets than the TR version. oh well.
    The SVA-88 therefore gets the (updated) Orion's horizontal recoil,
    and the hipfire changes.

    More rounds/mag, longer reload.

    Another route:
    make the Orion have 75 rounds, the SVA-88 50;

    Proposed Flare:
    Why does this have 75 rounds again? Just like.. the TMG-50, the Gauss Saw S,...
    The Flare is "derpy": only 167 dmg LMG with 0.2 horizontal recoil, also the highest first shot recoil, great, where do I sign up?
    Make it 40 rounds, faster reload.
    We buff rpm to 600, but give no SPA, don't improve the hipfire.
    We do however, give it 0.182 horizontal recoil. (currently: Ursa)

    this is the VS "EM6";
    much less bullets/mag, but faster reload.

    Compared to the NC Anchor: much worse hipfire, worse ADS moving accuracy, less bullets/mag, no SPA.

    Proposed Ursa:
    The Ursa gets 0.175 horizontal recoil.. just like the TR & NC 167 dmg LMG's.
    The Ursa's moving ADS accuracy is buffed to 0.35.

    should at least be interesting with the changes. (full damage out to 20m)
    Now, the EM1 & the Rhino both get access to extended mag.. what do we give the Polaris?
    I think it should also get access to HVA.
    I think it should get the option of an advanced forward grip.

    Pulsar LSW:
    Now at least somewhat different from the "other" VS 698 rpm LMG: the mag size is different for starters.
    I say give it SPA, HVA, the option of a compensator, reduce the first shot recoil multiplier to 2.25 .
  2. Keldred

    I think they are going to keep the gun mostly the same and work on balancing accuracy and COF. I think completely re-working the guns would be a bad decision. Each LMG has its own role to play SVA-88 is Supposed to be slower RPM than the Orion but give the larger battery. The Ursa and the Flare and support weapons that hold a large amount of ammo and are meant to be used for suppressing fire. The Polaris is meant for this as well but its high ADS and hip accuracy put it in the Head hunter role much like TRs T32-Bull. As for the changes with Orion it looks like they are taking baby steps with reducing its recoil. if they do it to much it will be the most powerful weapon in the game. I am personally very happy they are removing the .75 ads movement speed. VS got way to many downsides for this minor advantage.
  3. Auzor

    Flare: support & suppressing fire: why does it get SPA then?

    Do you really need 3 "support fire" LMG's?
    Shouldn't support fire be accurate, in return for the dps loss?

    Also, Flare= "Large amount of ammo":
    same nr of shots as the SVA-88, the TMG-50, the Gauss Saw S, The Pulsar, the Ursa.

    How many LMG's have more shots:
    Carv, Carv-S, Rhino, (Butcher);
    EM1, EM6, Gauss Saw, (GodSaw),

    75 rounds is not a large amount of ammo in the context of LMG's anyway.
    If we are talking about ammo pool: the amount of ammo carried goes 250, 300 (-> Flare), 400.
    400> 300.
  4. AlterEgo

    Effectively, you made the Flare worthless. GG.
  5. Gutseen

    Filthy VS peasants cry for buffs?

    daum dat 0.75 ads removal started up some infernal buttrage [IMG]
    • Up x 1
  6. Keldred

    The Flare is the medium range version of the Ursa. it gets SPA to extend its 167 dmg range to 15 meters instead of 10.

    Yes you do because each fits a role Flare: Short to medium, Ursa: Medium to long, And the Polaris: is the jack of all trades also my favorite of the three for all of the situations it can handle.

    Flare can get extended mag or forward grip depending on your play style. i prefer the extended mag and due to the COF on the flare making it not worth the forward grip. No compensator either, this increases you hip COF making you less effective in CQC.

    Polaris has more shots if the Flare dose not have extended mags. it also is in a lower damage tier negating that benefit unless you are specifically head hunting. Also Other faction LMG should not be a issue They all fit different roles within their factions we each should not get a clone of the other factions gun. And as it stands extended mags brings the Flare to 150, which puts it in line with all those other guns in clip size and since its a support weapon you should be with engi's anyway.
  7. Auzor

    My highest level char is NC.
    Yes, objectively speaking, the removal of 0.75 ads is a NERF.
    I WANT the 0.75 ads to be removed.

    As NC:
    The Anchor gets a hipfire buff (well.. thank you),
    The VS LMG's lose 0.75 ADS, in return for hipfire and, tbh minor buffs..

    Notice "VS LMG's, because those are the most important ones anyway.
    Now, you just want Orion & SVA-88 to be nerfed?
    Orion without SPA would be "viable" and all that, even if the MSW-R is "better" if we are going to be honest.

    In that case, BUFF the other VS LMG's.
    Flare vs Gauss Saw S (not considered a "top" NC LMG):
    Gauss Saw S has +30 m/s muzzle velocity.
    Gauss Saw S has access to HVA (not many use it, but still)
    Gaus Saw S has less horizontal recoil.
    Gaus Saw S has slightly faster long reload.
    Gaus Saw S has better tolerance.
    Gaus Saw S has lower First Shot recoil.

    Flare has slightly less sustained vertical recoil.
    Flare has a 3-fire burst mode.
    Flare has no bullet drop.

    Flare vs TMG-50:
    Mostly same stuff;
    although TMG-50 does not get SPA,
    nor extended mag.

    By the way: my NC wouldn't mind getting a Bolter.
    • Up x 1
  8. Auzor

    It would pretty much be an accurate AR, with 10 bonus rounds. On a heavy.
    It is more accurate (less horizontal recoil: from 0.2->0.182) and shoots faster.
    It would still have extended mags, granting you a max mag size of 80.
    For reload speed, with such a small mag, I'd be thinking of the proposed Orion stats: 2.8s, with long reload taking something like 3.5 seconds. Currently: 4.24 & 5.225s. Short reload time decreases by 1.44 seconds, about a third.
    Making it faster than the Anchor, still balanced: 10 less rounds, no SPA, worse hipfire and moving ADS accuracy.

    Maybe I made the Flare worthless to you.
    From my POV, for VS, the 167 dmg weaponry should be ranged weapons, so no SPA/ good hipfire/..

    If you would change the Flare, what would you give it?
  9. AlterEgo

    OH, where to start! The Flare is the first weapon I ever Auraxiamed (one of my favorite VS weapons of all time). If there are things I could improve about it, it would the way the gun works. So, the following:
    During the day, velocity is increased by 25% and recoil is reduced by 18%. During the night, damage is reduced by 15%, but RoF is increased to 677 and the CoF becomes smaller the longer you fire. Basically, daytime becomes the Flare's "no weakness" period, with night taking away a noticeable amount of damage in return for better results at CQC. Of course, you'd have to add a solar panel on the thing, but I can see it working.
  10. miraculousmouse

    Funny thing is, the salty people who got rekt by the prorion and the battlegoose before nerf will still get their ***** handed to them after the nerf. If you ****ties learned to aim in the first place then none of this would be a problem.
    • Up x 1
  11. Keldred

    I agree. When i pop my over-shield i cant adad spam anyway. Plus when i play TR i do just as well with the carv and T32-Bull as i do with the Betelgeuse. Looking forward to having it be more accurate.
  12. Akashar

    I'd rather take a simple nerf, once and for all, than all this ********. VS don't need .75 ADS speed, this stat was always overrated, and honestly, it's not needed. People complained for all these years because of that, I say, remove it, let all the TR and NC see that they don't fare better, and let them cry bitter tears. That's all we need, if they cry so much, make endless spreadshiiits showing how this affect gameplay, let's just take them by their word, remove the 0.75 ads speed, and end with this already.
    • Up x 1
  13. Imp C Bravo

    I am new to PS2. So maybe I don't know what I'm talking about. But from what I have been led to understand:

    TR has avg damage, avg accuracy, and high rate of fire/large number of bullets to fire.
    NC has av accuracy, high damage, and avg rate of fire
    VS has high accuracy, avg damage, and avg fire rate.

    So each faction has one area they excel in and pretty much even areas everywhere else.

    Except I don't see the high accuracy on Vanu on the LMGs. They seems about the same as the other factions. I am non plussed. The carbines seems to work like that relatively though.

    Am I missing something?
  14. cobaltlightning

    The VS Tend to have higher mobility in comparison to the TR and the NC.

    A Magrider could easily side-strafe outa the way of that mini-nuke that is the directive Rocket Launcher and fire a shell of its own, and that Scythe do a front-flip right in the middle of it's path and chase down your mosquito/reaver. This mobility advantage in it's vehicles also applies to their infantry, in a sense, as VS Did have the most non-shotgun .75x ADS Movement speed, even by appearance; The VS MAX Looks more humanoid than big bulging armor that is the TR and NC, leading to a movement pattern that is more recognizable and easier to mimic to your average human.

    I understand that the Vanu LMGs are indeed overperforming quite a bit, but I don't believe a nerf to them would do justice, especially in the movement speed of at least the Orion. Instead, I would think a buff to other factions' LMGs would better circumvent the performance, allowing Vanu to keep their movement traits while others have a harder counter against them.
  15. ATRA_Wampa-One

    My advice is to just start playing LA/Engineer since after this nerf our LMG's will be crap, our AR's have always been crap, but at least on LA/Engineer have the VX6-7 and Pulsar until they inevitably get nerfed by whining NC/TR as well.
  16. Imp C Bravo

    I am honestly quite surprised to hear that. I found the TR LMGs to be about equally effective as the VS LMGs and the NC LMGs to be a fair bit better with solid fire discipline.
  17. ATRA_Wampa-One

    I've found this to be the case as well, especially with the Anchor.

    It's a shame that the NC players on Emerald are horrible because NC weapons are amazing.

    I like the Orion changes but realistically that should be the new SVA-88 while the Orion gets the SVA-88 changes you proposed. Also, all VS LMG's should absolutely get 0.35 ADS move accuracy because if we aren't the ROF faction, and we aren't the high damage faction, and they don't want us to be the mobile faction then accuracy is all that's left.

    How can I put this nicely... hell no. While I agree the Flare could use a buff since it's an inferior EM6/TMG-50, a mall one to it's moving ADS accuracy would probably be enough.

    Further buff it's moving ADS accuracy to 0.3 and this looks solid.

    HVA is useless on basically every weapon except for carbines, and even then only on a select few.

    Giving it access to an adv. grip however would be a good step since the VS has zero LMG's with that option.

    The LSW is a horrible weapon that really needs a total redesign. Maybe make it interesting and give it some of the characteristics of a 200 damage LMG, so a 0.4 moving ADS stat, a perfect first shot placement, and very high velocity.