V-30F Starfall needs a nerf

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Tr34, Sep 15, 2018.

  1. Tr34

    An invisible "ATV" one-shots an armored lightning tank and two shots a MBT. Is it really logical?
    Then why is this a faction-only weapon? It needs a damage nerf or make flashes uncloakable when you mount this weapon. It's beyond op at this point.
    • Up x 4
  2. raffa2

    Instead of nerfing the whole platform like in PTS, nerfing this weapon would be a better choice.
    Just look at the Flash Fury, none's complaining about it, yet they have similar DPS, and that's because that actually takes risk unlike the starfall that shoots a burst too quick to react to.
  3. NXR1

    Just remove the ability for cloaked flashes to have a weapon, its just such a bad design.
    • Up x 1
  4. Movoza

    Although I agree they're strong, I don't condone arguing on misinformation. It takes 4 salvos or a reload to kill a lightning, it takes 6 or 2 reloads to kill an MBT. (Maybe it was 7 for MBT, but you shoot so quick it's hard to notice).

    The nerfs are coming. Long delays before cloaking again and short but significant delays of firing after cloaking will make it much more dangerous to use it.

    It is just OP, but a glass cannon nonetheless. It is a 50 nanite cloakable gun that, without upgrades, is doing the damage of a nearly fully upgraded prowler AP gun, minus the barrage. That is a ******** of damage for a platform that can fire and cloak so quickly again.
  5. Demigan

    I think that the Flash cloak does need a nerf. But 10 seconds before cloaking again? Holy crap! Make it maybe 3 or 4 seconds, that's plenty!

    Also nerfing the entire Flash isn't going to solve the Starfalls ease of use compared to the Fury and other Flash weapons. It still needs some nerfs. And they really should change the Flash Wraith to some kind of "infantry enhancement module" or something. A Heavy would get a powerful overshield for himself and his Flash, Engi's could perhaps get an AOE repair field. LA's could make their Flash jump up and fly/glide short distances, Medics could perhaps get an ability that last a second or two and revives any friendlies in the AOE.
  6. Zak Preston

    funny how NC mains complain about Starfall but zelously defend their maxes in a separate thread =)
  7. Movoza

    Funny how people connect 2 unrelated topics and try to use it as arguments.
    • Up x 4
  8. adamts01

    That's not the heart of the problem with the Flash though. The entire problem is that a cloaked, nearly free vehicle can appear out of nowhere and kill a tank faster than a tank could kill another tank. The single best solution is removing guns when cloak is mounted, then leave the cloak mechanic alone.
  9. OldMaster80

    They stated they wanted to push the cloaking changes live quickly but they didn't. I think the poostorm that followed the pts patch notes convinced the team they were taking the wrong approach.
    Nevertheless if they are going to leave the Flash as it is then they should nerf the Renegade together with the Starfall. At the moment charging infantry with that is also low skill low risk vs high reward.

    I agree numbers were not correct, the Starfall problem is mainly when there is a HA on the rumble seat. I have a full maxed lightning and the effect is instakill, it's like being C4ed.
    The worst part is it's the HA to get the kill, so stats of the Starfall do not look exaggerately OP. In fact Wrel stated data show nothing wrong with that weapon...
  10. adamts01

    They absolutely took the wrong approach. If you have a tank and a quad in the field, it doesn't matter at all to the tank how long it takes the flash to turn invisible again after the tank is already dead. I still say the best solution is removing guns from cloaked flashes. The next best solution is a delay before firing after the cloak is disengaged.
  11. Demigan

    The Flash is so vulnerable that it's weapons are almost useless without cloak. It would need at minimum some kind of low-grade AEGIS shield up front to soak up some damage while attacking.

    As for the damage potential against vehicles being a problem... The solution would be to remove or reduce the damage potential, not remove all weapons entirely right? And simply having a cooldown before your weapons come online after decloaking can help tremendously in giving enemies a chance to engage, rather than the Flash having time to set up safely, decloak for a brutal assault then cloak again. Or against infantry practically run them over before decloaking and shooting. That way enemies can see and hear you coming as you have to decloak beforehand but you can cloak and scoot away after detection, giving the Flash enough weaknesses and skill to engage but not making it almost impossible to use.
  12. adamts01

    That's perfectly reasonable.

    This is similar to the Harasser problem. If you nerf the damage potential at all, then there's no point in taking the Flash as it simply can't loiter. I'm a fan of Harassers getting their teeth back in exchange for less health. All I want for the Flash is an opportunity for an aware tanker to react. If nothing else changes, maybe just giving them empire specific sounds and cranking up their volume would work. Just something besides instant death out of nowhere. And of course, the balance problem is compounded by having a Decimator on the back, similar to balancing a Valk with Engineers and Strikers. It's difficult.
  13. ArcKnight

    nerf options:
    1. a charge up mechanic where you have to wait for it to be fully charged to deal full damage.. 50% charge = 50% damage
    2. a straight up damage nerf
    3. increase the nanite cost if you equip it on a flash (it is too cheap for all that damage)
    4. after firing can't cloak for 4-5 sec and flash s slowed by 15%
    5. a weapons lock for 1.5-2 sec after decloaking

    this is all i could come up with
    • Up x 1
  14. Pacster3

    I got a solution too: Check how often they are used for a fight compared to other tanks or harassers. If they ain't pulled in higher numbers then you don't have a problem and don't need to change ANYTHING. The rule is still: If it's OP in the meta, people will use it...in large numbers. Forumside is biased.
  15. DatBoi

    Ah yes, and you and your infinite wisdom have absolutely no bias at all and would have no reason to possibly ever want to defend an overpowered weapon. :rolleyes:
  16. Sazukata

    Not always true. There are possible hidden variables that can keep usage rates looking normal such as skill requirement, how specialized the weapon is, how hyped by the community it is, etc. I highly recommend learning a lot about statistics, as it has so many applications (such as arguing about a video game :p).

    The burst carbines and assault rifles for example, are insanely effective in good hands. They have the mid-range headshot potential of NS rifles but without the DPS loss. Yet where is the widespread usage?
    • Up x 2
  17. iller

    They don't complain about it because not everything comes down to DPS. BURST is the #1 factor of any Weapon, Skill, or Spell that's minmaxxed in any MMO. And in the Starfall's case, it's straight up "Rogue-Broken" due to Attack-Interval followed by Cloaking while it reloads. That's its main difference between the Fury as you specifically hinted at. Every game since the beginning of RPG's has had this same issue with giving "invisible" players too much burst. ... but at the same time, not giving them enough Burst is also a problem b/c 99% of the time they're always Glass cannons.

    Video games could have solved this "issue" at the very beginning by making all Invisible classes be support Focused instead. Hence why Stalker cloak works and is balanced in this game. ...their main purpose is niche and not utilized often: to get to the backline quickly to spot the biggest threats and throw EMP nades which makes a huge difference in organized play. Ants are another example that doesn't break the game (yet)... invisibility on them is acceptable even though they can practically one-shot Ram a Harasser. ... oddly enough, that also makes them an ideal counter to Skyfall Flashes (you'd probably have to run Rival-3 which I don't have the patience or discipline to grind for)
  18. Pacster3

    Well, the Starfall can't be more hyped than it has been during the last couple of months. If you don't see it that often now then you never will. Due to bursts it definitely needs more skill than Fury...but you don't see Fury that much either. The Starfall is definitely strong in skilled hands...so is the Fury...non the less they are not the weapons that kill most vehicles...and that although they are so cheap. They are glass cannons. You spot them and they are dead. Their skill does not matter at that point(yours does tho. If you can't aim...well...).
    The question remains: If they are not being used...where is your problem? That you hit on one skilled one all few hours and get killed? You think that player wouldn't do the same to you in a Vanguard/Prowler or even a Magrider? A Harasser? A Lightning? He may have a harder time to sneak up behind you but once he does you definitely got no chance anymore....cause those vehicles can't be OHKed and they pack a similar punch with the right gun.
  19. adamts01

    After being frustrated by them, and then certing out a Flash and trying it before crying about it, I've absolutely convinced myself that the thing is OP. There are a couple solid reasons why they're not so popular.
    1. Everyone wants to play infantry.
    2. It's a substantial cert investment in a very grindy game.
    3. It requires a Decimator on back, plus communication and teamwork, both extremely lacking in this game.
    4. It's cheesy as ****, something frowned upon by many.
    • Up x 1
  20. Movoza

    You know, for someone who doesn't care about a gun because it isn't used much and it won't matter anyway, you're zealously defending this thing.

    In addition, if something isn't OP, it isn't a reason not to change it. It can be slight balances, or toning down potential too high effectiveness in certain applications, or just because the weapon is more fun in certain ways. I mean I think the Vanguard shield is barely keeping tge tank competitive. Is tgat a reason not to change it? Of course not! I would change the hell out of that thing. Many people feel cheated by the shield! A sure reason to chamge it.

    So saying it isn't OP and not used much are both pretty moot points.
    • Up x 1