Upcoming Tank and Liberator Changes

Can you also do some tweaking to ESF Hornet/Coyote stats please? Hornet's main problem is velocity (ESFs need to guide it to the target, leaving them exposed, which doesn't really fit into the hit-and-run strike fighter role.) Coyote's problem is reload speed- it's so fast you can rely on them alone, rather than using them between nosegun reloads occasionally to increase DPS at the expense of manueverability. Aside from that I understand the Rocketpod nerf (even if, as a pilot, I'm not too happy) and tomcats are balanced, despite their other flaws.

You think it will be safer and appealing? I mean Most of the tank combats happens at long range because the space between the 2 tanks are filled by infantry. Making it silly to try to aproach the other tank.

I personally don't see how it will improve this situation enough to make me want to come close of the enemy tank.

No no, just no. 200m/s is way too low, you'd need to go dangerously low all the time to be able to reliably hit even stationary tanks, or completely stop to hover above the tanks, which will be suicide since the resistance changes are getting reverted. Flak also hurts a lot more when you give a stationary target for SGs and bursters which would again make libs not viable anywhere near medium sized fights.

Your kind of missing my point. What is likly to happen is that these changes will be a indirect nurf to the Magrider, and Due to past experences, we are expecting to have to fight tooth and nail, bar no one using the Magrider anymore, for the Dev's to even agnolage that it needs improvements.

Stabalized turrets, while annoying, are not a factor that prevents the other tanks from being useful, but was one of the traits of the Magrider, as it was designed around having to keep moving to survive. With stabalzation and Movement improvements to the other tanks, this will probibly make the Magrider less useful then a Lightning (AP lightning can out dps 1/2 magrider by the way).

It is quite valid to have concerns due to the glacial pace that indrect nurf issues are fixed, and with the VS populations on a rather steady decline on most servers ( hell VS prime time on conney we were what 25% world pop lastnight?) It is simply scary to think what could happen to the VS population with yet another Nurf to their equipment.

Quoting this entire post so hopefully it actually gets read.

AADADADDAADDDDAADADAADAADADAADjump is irritating trying to shoot infantry now you want to bring this obnoxious type of combat over to tanks?

Some say it's "skill", I call it turd gameplay.

Biggest nerf will be to Dump fire RL every tank will have easy time to evade it and farm infantry as there is no tomorrow.
Also phoenix will be now used for infantry sniping only cos hitting fast moving MBTs will be nearly impossible.

Finally solo players will be able to play without those libs ruin our day .I always hated libs and i was one of those guys that they didnt want it buff in the lib uptade.(it was already too strong)

Better remove those 10 people that playing all day with the lib than the rest of the players,good choice there.

As for tank changes,i dont like them at all.
-VS will have it hard(if not a buff is given to their MTB)
-TR ability will be useless,faster and closer distances for tanks?
-NC will have the advandage.

As for air hammer....seriously i didnt play with it yet and i died from it a lot,but its a risky gun to use as you need to be close.

Dam i would love the lib cries when the uptade comes haha.

Just look at the Magrider's past and you'll see:

So you're saying that one or two skyguards can hold off a lib or two and a few esf's?
Usually, when there are tanks, there are a ton of tanks. There are usually 10+ lightnings/mbts. That doesn't even include sunderers and harassers. If 2 of those guys go skyguard, there is no way to counter those tanks, especially if somebody has a walker on a sundy or a lock on.

If you put a anti tank gun on your lightning, you're committing yourself to anti infantry or anti armor. Therefore, by your logic, an anti armor gun should be crap against air and should completely decimate armor since that its its only forte.

However, I am not complaining about the skyguard or the new changes. Smart lib pilots don't maneuver themselves to a position where skyguards get multiple clips on them. When my outfit flies, we don't hang up insanely high and spam. I don't foresee a drastic change, only a few minor nuances.

Which can actually be a strength. It makes it easier to peak over a hill and hit another vehicle behind cover whilst exposing less of yourself compared to what the other tanks would have to

I was linked the post by several people right as it went up as they knew I'd be interested in reading it since I'm pretty much a full time Liberator pilot in PS2. I decided to let this thread get some traction before I posted in it. I really wanted to see what other people thought before I shared my opinion on the changes. I didn't want my opinions to influence anyone else. I'm glad my thoughts weren't far off from the consensus I see here.


Many of you have seen me play ingame, many just as a guy that posts here on the regular. For those that need some background...

• My main is on Mattherson VS, Dreadnaut. DreadnautNC & DreadnautTR are also on Mattherson (NC/TR), DreadnautCTR is on Connery
• 40k Certs spent on my main Lib
• 1500+ hours piloting the Lib (Tech Test, Beta, Live)
• 10k+ combined Tank Buster kills

It's really tough for me to accurately comment on the tank changes because I don't drive them much, but from what I know about fighting against tanks, here is what I think:

MBT's:

• Tank Reverse - Seems ok (This is an indirect nerf to the Tank Buster and other MBT main guns btw...)
• Stabilized Turrets - Seems ok
• Tank Effective Range - This seems really bad, and will only bring tanks closer to the fight and make it worse. DO NOT change projectile speed at ALL. Remove Lock-Down for the TR and give them an ability that doesn't suck. (Same for the TR MAX, get rid of lockdown)

Magrider is going to need a bit of a buff if you're giving the other MBT's the traits of the Magrider, right? Maybe just increase its strafe ability a bit? I'm curious what other tankers feel about that.


Now, on to the Liberator changes. My first thought was, "Wow...you can't be serious..."

Liberator:

• Belly Gun Range: TERRIBLE CHANGE. Already hard to hit anything that's moving, and this won't change a thing except make it near impossible for Dalton users to hit aircraft. The single hardest thing to do in the game will become near impossible. Stupid. Fix Anti-Air don't mess with projectile speeds. Buff the Decimator velocity and decrease gravity so you can hit hovering aircraft.
• Dalton - Anti-Vehicle weapon. Just reduce splash damage against Infantry. DO NOT reduce projectile speed. Leave it alone.
• Zepher - Sorta AI, Sorta AT. I'm ok with that. Want to change projectile speed? This is the weapon to do that with.
• Shredder - Just nerf it against Maxes, nothing more.
• Duster - No idea what to do with this, except remove it from the game. It's junk and the Zepher is better.
• Ammo Capacity - This change has been needed for a LONG time. It's easy to re-arm
• Bulldog - Leave it alone, it's fine
• Tank Buster - Don't nerf it because of equip rate. Stop nerfing based on data, buff the Spur and Vektor so they don't suck.
• Resist to Tank Rounds - I'm ok with this change, back to where it was. Never should have been buffed in the first place

ESF:

• Rocket Pods - Be careful with this, a gentle nerf would be ok, but not much at all
• Air Hammer - This is a good change. Air Hammer at launch was OP, then it got changed and was fine until PU02 resist changes. It just needs to be put back to its pre PU02 level

This is how I would approach this update:

• Liberator Sound (This is HUGE. This will now let tankers hear Libs coming. MAJOR buff for tankers)
• Tank Reverse Speed
• Tank Turret Stabilization
• Liberator Belly Gun Ammo Reduction
• Duster Improvements
• Air Hammer dmg vs Liberator reduction
• Revert tank round dmg vs aircraft
• Shredder Damage vs Max Suits
• Decrease Dalton Splash Damage vs infantry
• Decimator - Increase velocity and decrease gravity

^^ You do ONLY that, and you will have a really good update and then you can see how the game feels from there. After that, I doubt you'd even consider the other changes listed..


TL;DR - Too many changes at once, with a lot of changes that aren't necessary. Learn from your mistakes, make minor changes, not major Harasser changes.

I've now read this entire thread, sadly.

I see your name keep popping up in defense of Kevmo's post and that's fine, you're entitled to your own opinion. The issue here is that you're in the minority after reading all of these posts. There are only a handful of people supporting these changes and everyone else does not support it. That's not my opinion, that's just how the thread is going.

The thing about the Dalton that bothers me isn't that it's awesome for killing vehicles, or that it's awesome at killing infantry, or that it's awesome at killing aircraft...the problem is the combination. The Dalton's awesome at killing everything. As is the shredder.

Have you actually tried it since the lib update? Sure you can pick off some solo infantry or get even a few kills if you happen across an infantry cluster that doesn't notice you early enough or have AA ready, but it's absolutely not a good AI weapon. Which is perfectly fine.

And it's not "awesome" against aircraft either.

They want to make the dalton the premiere anti armor weapon yet the nerf it against armor with no noticeable effect against infantry.

I also don't quite understand the role of the photon pods. Are they supposed to be anti infantry now? Were they always this way? I thought that rocketpods in general were meant for armor.

The Hornets are undeniably meant for AV, so I think it makes sense for the rocket pods to be AI.

No, you need to give the magrider less gravity but have it lose damage over range, like the lancer. Give it like 2 or 3 gravity so if it hits a target at 150m is does full damage but if it hits a target at 300m it does less damage. Stop making tanks slightly different versions of each other.

So the prowler and vanguard get huge buffs out of this update and the magrider gets... nothing? Ok, so you need to give the magrider an increase in velocity because it cannot go head to head with a prowler or vanguard. The high dps of the prowler and the shield of the vanguard means the magrider has to keep it's distance.

The vanguard has the most damaging tank rounds which means it's heavier and should have slowest projectile speed of all the tanks.

You're going to need to revisit that.

I honestly don't know how you cannot see the magrider is getting the short end of the stick here. I haven't seen any mention of balancing it out with the prowler and vanguard buffs with the turret stabilization and reverse speed.

Dalton needs splash vs Infantry reduced
Shredder needs to be less effective vs Maxes

That solves most of those issues. Nerfing Dalton projectile speed is absurd.

(faceplam).


The people that don't support it are liberator users.

The liberator changes/Nerfs have been coming for a while now, Also the role of the aircraft when from a ground pounder to a KILL EVERYTHING THAT MOVES vehicle.

The tank changes and ESf changes are fine. The liberator changes are less nerfs more of a slight weapon reworks/balancing and such.

Liberators are not going to be bad or nonviable after these changes....... But people who abused liberators for farming etc will have to actually play better.

While people who use liberators for actual gunshipping/Ac-130ing will be rewarded for actually using the aircraft for its battlefield role.

So please sir, I know your farming simulator level is getting a increase in difficulty but clearly you would be able to kill people regardless of these changes, which GAMEPLAY WISE. will work out fine.

I'm looking forward to the changes coming on the test server.

Right, I forgot that the military has tanks that shoot archs instead of straight lines because it's 100x more accurate to lob projectiles...