Discussion in 'Heavy Assault' started by Pooliscool, Mar 24, 2015.
What they need to have is that if you damage someone when the medkit is regening the regen stops.
Idk why people are so stupid in knowing facts in this game, nerfing something brings another thing that the nerfed thing prevented.
Nerfing HA shield will give more a2g farmers, vehicle spam and more max crashed. Is that what you want (pointing at those that whine about the HA), ik the answer already.
There are plenty options to counter a HA, even if i play HA i get c4ed more often then im a max. There is a problem in the infantry part in this game but its not the HA.
If you gonna reply to this come with facts, no videos of you just being bad.
Anf if the good players wont affect from this and not the bad players then idk what is the problem, you die due to good players anyways. And if you die due to a bad player your bad as well.
Or you dont play your class correclty or you are just facing a assault as a support.
Imo to make the ha more in the game double increase the amount the shield absorbs and just remove anythig that gives the ha a self heal.
You're thinking of restoration kits which have their own problems, namely that they only heal you 85% of your health.
The problem with Medkits has to do with how the server reacts when you use one.
Basically when you use one it tells the server your health should be at full no matter what which means you are effectively invulnerable because they don't tell the server you're healed for X it tells the server you have full health which means any damage you take is totally negated. A fun trick is if you time it right you can actually use medkits to survive falls that should kill you if you use one a split second before you take damage from the fall. Hard to do but I've done it several times before.
Putting a 5 second delay before you can use one again makes it so it's just a quick refill and doesn't let you have 1-2 seconds of godmode which is what the problem is with them now.
Now if you want to actually make a distinction between restoration kits and medkits put a 5 second delay on both, medkits heal you to 100% health and restoration kits heal you 150% of your health over 6 seconds.
Now after you change medkits, if you're still finding HA shields to be too strong make it so they work like nanoweave in that headshots would through shields. Maybe make an exception to that with resist shields but that's about the only thing else I would ever think of changing.
Med-kits & regen kits give the same amount of HP.
Regen kits regen slower
Medkits regen faster.
Keep in mind that standard infantry have 500 HP(not counting the 500 shields or 400 shields if infiltrator).
Also, on the HA discussion, the issue is not the shields.
Theres a few other issues that can be fixed without causing balance ripples:
1) Removing 0.75 ADS off all LMG's that have it.
2) Removing SMG's & Common class pool shotguns off the class.
3) Removing the dumbfire ability from the ES G2G & G2A lock on RL's.
People target the shield because its the easiest thing to focus on, alot of people do not understand the balance ripples that would happen if the shield gets changed.
1) its simple & effective. 0.75 ADS mitigates the HA movement speed penalty when the HA ADS's with the shield on.
2) How would removing SMG's & common class pool shotguns make the class useless?
You would still have LMG's(which have CQC,mid & long range variants), RL's, grenades, the shields etc. The Class is very useful, people were playing the HA long before SMG's & common class pool shotguns were added to it & doing just fine.
3) Vehicle kills count towards kills for all medals ingame.
1) &2) Regardless of the potential backlash, these changes should/need to happen. People will rage about it, but in the end it will solve problems effectively.
3) Yeah, also Let me ask you 2 questions.
Why do people buy Lock on RL's in the first place?
Have you ever taken a look at the Fire modes for all the RL's?(not talking about the ES special RL's)
[/quote]Perhaps the only thing that can overcome them right now is out-ranging them with a Sniper Rifle, blasting them away with a Shotgun (which isn't a guaranteed counter to a HA.), going MAX or grabbing a vehicle.[/quote]
Or just choose your battles and try to aim as much on the head as possible.
The same happens to vehicles, any class with Med Kits, or any class with C4. Getting shot? Turn around and shoot back. Getting shot? Use Med Kit invincibility frames to avoid damage. Getting shot? Run around corner and place C4 and watch the fireworks.
The same can be said about Cloaks. Oh, someone found you? Cloak and run around a corner to bait the attacker then unload a clip into their face. Or, hey the entire squad just got destoyed by a MAX Crash, just sit on point with a Stalker Cloak and get those certs. If flanking by yourself isn't working why not try to coordinate with squad members? Don't have a squad? Wait for a zergling to gunned down and follow up to take the kill. Want to be a lone-wolf? Sure, War-Simulation Games are the perfect place for lone wolves, teamwork isn't how wars are won.
Define "best tools in game," last I checked Heavy shares weapons with Engineer and Medic, with the exception of his Class Specific Rocket Launcher, but if his Rocket Launcher is too strong then take away Engineer's Mana Turrets as well. They have a shield that protects the Engineer, provide cover, act as an obstacle, can mow down Infantry, and don't require ammo. Why not change his weapon too? Why is Heavy an exception?
Again, Engineers and MAXes for vehicles. Every class can damage Aircrafts. Can't damage a ground vehicle? Work with the people around you and mark/track it and kill the person repairing it. If it has no driver then it's just a hunk of Nanites correct?
Yes, because nothing can damage MAXes except for Rocket Launchers. I can't even count the amount of MAXes I've killed with sidearms, as an Infiltrator using default pistols no less. If you can not kill a MAX by yourself, don't approach it or deal as much damage as you can to it and let someone else follow up with the kill.
So can C4 and tank mines. MAX Crash or Zergrush? Place tank mines by the door like you would C4 and shoot it the second they come through, predamage it if you need to.
You can resupply everything in spawn, why would that be an issue?
Their role is used the way it's supposed to be used.
I keep seeing a lot of people suggest this, but then don't say anything about classes. You want a wind-up period for Heavy Assault? Okay, but why not a wind-up or hit-delay for LAT for their jetpacks? Why not a wind-up or hit-delay for Infiltrator's Cloak? There are a lot more times when I've seen an Infil, shoot them, and then they cloak behind cover and and end manuvering around the map without me being able to chase them even with a Flashlight. Do I have to get better at killing Infils before they Cloak or should there be a disadvantage added to Infils as well? Why not a wind-up or hit-delay for ammo packs and turrets? If I hit you can't use your ability to help your team, that's not fair, so they shouldn't be able to place a Mana Turret around the corner and then get in and kill me before I can kill them. Why not a wind-up or hit-delay for Medics placing Shield Heal? If I hit you you shouldn't be able to place a shield down to heal you and your team. You should have to wait. Why not a wind-up or hit-delay for MAXes? If I hit them they shouldn't be able to Charge around a corner to get repaired by an Engineer. If I hit them They shouldn't be able to activate Zealot Overdrive and then mow me down. Why not do the same for C4 and mines? It's not fair that someone can suicide into a horde of enemies and be able to place a mine or C4 down that then gets shot or triggered by a random bullet. That's not fair. That rewards suicide and makes for a worse player experience, knowing that you can be the better shot and still die from someone beyond the grave. That's not fair.
I know when I play War-Simulation Games I want things to be fair. Real war isn't "fair or balanced," so why would a simulation be any different? Shield Diffuse Sunderer isn't fair. It can charge through and allow everyone inside to kill the people in Tech Plants and AMP Stations without them taking care of generators, that's not fair. All the defensive measures taken place to secure the generators and keep them online are now ruined because we can be defeated from the inside-out. Smoke Screens aren't fair. If I take 2 seconds to lock-on to an enemy vehicle they shouldn't be able to use Smoke Screens because now my lock-on weapon is useless in the current situation. Quick Knife isn't fair. I play on a laptop and I don't have an M3. So that means that someone can have the advantage over me just because they have a better set-up than I do. Framerate isn't fair. It isn't fair that in 200+ battles my game drops to 20fps while other people can have 40fps. That gives them an advantage and allows them to see more information than I can. Spawn Beacons aren't fair. Someone can just go LAT or fly an ESF to a high point and put the beacon all the way up there. Now my EMP Grenades won't reach, so I can't destroy it. That means that enemy squads can rain down on me and I can't do anything about it except try to hold them off before I get farmed. Med Kits aren't fair. I can start unloading a clip into someone and they can just use a Med Kit and run away from my bullets. That lets them live, it coddles them and rewards them for poor performance, they shouldn't be able to use it and then run away or spin-to-win. But I should win because I started shooting first. If we nerf the Heavy Assault then it will only be a matter of time for people to cry for a buff. 1 week? 2 months? 6 months? 2 years? How long will it take for people to say that Heavy Assault needs a buff. But then people will argue that a buff would ruin the game and that people should just get better. Every action has a reaction that can be the same in principle. Now we argue Nerf vs Constant, how long after a nerf will we argue Buff vs constant?
Regen kits give you a total of 425 health (85% of max health) over 6 seconds, medkits instantly give you full health and because of server lag this can be used as a sort of god mode since using one tells the server you should be at full health no matter what.
Good players will learn to counter their problems by using their brain. Poor players will whine that the game needs to suit them instead of them suiting the game.
How do you know both do not give the same HP?
If you can't beat a Heavy when you have the jump on him, you are doing it wrong. If you constantly get ganked by Heavies but refuse to play as Heavy yourself to compensate, you are doing it wrong. There, simple.
LMGs are the best weapons in the game? No, they aren't, Assault Rifles are. A Heavy with an AR would be Godly.
OP isn't playing the game properly and wants a nerf because of it. It's not going to happen, give it up.
Because I actually understand the issue, both what both of those things do and how server lag effects things instead of just whining about ADS speed or dumb fire RL's or the like.
Get damaged to almost dead and then pop a resto kit. When it's done you won't be at full health. Get damaged to almost dead and then pop a medkit, you're fully healed.
Then restore kits definitely need a buff to be equal with medkits.
Also it would be great if if you shot a guy being healed by a medkit the Regening stopped,think like shields.
Also, I think a bigger issue is that infantry consumables are cheap.
No, medkits are too strong right now because of how they work with server lag. I've literally said this now 4 times.
Resto kits could absolutely be buffed to give 100% or even 150% health over 6 second (since it would be proactive healing) but both need a 5 second cooldown.
Once again, that's not how it works.
Again, if you pop a medkit it tells the server you are at 100% health. There is no regeneration, there is no "over time" it's strait up [health=100%]. Due to server lag this actually gives you a few tenths of a second of godmode because regardless of what's going on popping a medkit tells the server that your health=100%, and if you chain medkits it will give you about a second of godmode.
Nope, they're about right.
Server lag .
If this is true - you're bad as HA and doing it wrong.
Unless you're speaking of snipers. But that's just not appropriate to compare sniping to HA.
Which can be 100% fixed by having a cool down time between using med/resto kits.
Fix that issue and then talk about how OP HA's are.
I have never said heavies are OP.
Also how long of a cooldown would be good, considering battle pacing?
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