[Suggestion] Tool think tank.

Discussion in 'Light Assault' started by Wolfwood82, Jan 14, 2013.

  1. Minsc

    Hahaha, that would be awesome. And does it work with TKs? Kill a friendly sniper to take his rifle :D
  2. Unnoan

    what about a breaching tool but with very limited use. Like instead of blowing up a wall he could have some sort of portal through it but its ammo was very limited. Like 1 or 2 uses per life and not refillable even by a sundy or it costed resources to use. Anything else would be too powerful and make defending a base almost impossible.
  3. Minsc

    I don't think we need anything to make attacking a base any easier, to be honest. Cool idea though!
  4. Autarkis

    I wrote about this elsewhere and others have mentioned flavors of it here, but I'd love an airstrike beacon that shows up as a waypoint for any Liberators and that grants bonus XP for kills in a radius around it.

    Or, earlier I was behind enemy lines at their Tech Plant and would've loved to have had a mini radar that I could turn on to reveal the armor and enemies. It's powerful, so I think it has a battery that only lasts for 20 seconds and takes another 20 to recharge. You also can't shoot or move faster than a trot or it automatically turns off.
  5. Amarutu

    BTW are almost all light assault players Duke Nukem 3D fanboys like me? (steroids and jetpacks, lol)
    I too would like to see the Adrenaline Pump as an activated ability with the F key, with multiple ranks
    to increase the movement speed and duration (but level 3-5 of adrenaline doesn't do anything!)

    Another ability that has been suggested by another poster (can't remember his/her name) is giving infiltrators a lift up the roof of a building. Cutting our jump height and speed in half and really make the light assault and infiltrator the futuristic spotter/sniper team :D

    For the tool slot I envy the infiltrators ability to shoot recon darts. It seems like the only infiltrators using them have LA as their main.
    I hope SOE won't let us scavenge the main weapon of dead people, just to protect enemy infiltrators from an already overly zealous bunch of witch hunters.

    The tool I would suggest that compliments the light assaults team role are zooming, night vision or thermal binoculars.
    Usually I'm the one on top of the capping point keeping an eye out for enemy forces, like the crow's nest of ships.
    I already have a spawn beacon since every squad leader "should" be light assault. (correct me if I'm wrong)

    Although I like the idea of a SOFLAM, I'm pretty sure it will be underused even more then the radar gun already is.
    Most of the other suggestions I've read with all do respect are already covered by C4, smoke and flash grenades.
    My biggest fear for the next update is that Smedley will show us too much love, making the niche we fulfill a jack of all trades,
    and I will be sitting in the shower crying because half of the population runs light assault :eek: (the other half running engineer)

    To summarize: the direction I want our class to go is flanking, harassing and spotting.
    The binoculars will make infiltrators team up with us and their recon darts will serve us well in return.
    Finally we will have three dedicated ground teams instead of two teams and two lone wolves.
    HA and medic as an assault, MAX and engineer as a support and LA and infiltrator as a recon team.

    PS: you just made one cert point while reading this overly lengthy post so no harm no foul, right :p
  6. Wolfwood82

    Your picking up the wrong ques here Achmed.

    There is a system for scavenging ammo. We take ammo from enemy ammo boxes all the time. The system is easily implemented by simply snagging 1 magazine from dead bodies we walk over just as if they were ammo boxes.

    However there is no system for recovering weapons from corpses. Reviving a corpse is interaction but it isn't the same kind of interaction as looting would be. Popping up with a menu to select which weapon you want to use, and giving LA the ability to use any weapon they pick up from dead bodies. That's getting more and more complicated. The balance nightmare of LA with LMGs goes without saying, and then you have to factor in weapon customizations and so on and so fourth.
  7. Achmed20

    read between the lines my friend. it was supposed to mean that features which are not existent yet, can still be coded.
    there is also no system for scavenging ammo from dead bodys which doesnt mean you cant code it.
    Object based coding my friend! if a med can interact with them (by medic tool or rez grenades), then there IS a way to interact with bodies. please dont try to argue about coding with me. you will loose this fight.
    never said anything about a menu. if you take a look at the post and pseudo code i wrote, you'll se it will just grab the current equiped weapon. I also stated that it should not have more that one mag of bullets. the atachments are not a problem either. clone the weapon object (coding whise), problem solved. you got yourself a temporary gun with all atachments it had before. (again, coding topic, dont try to argue here)

    balance whise it may still be a bad idea, but SOE isnt exactly known for having great ideas either. then again, if scavenge ammo is going to make it live, then it may refill underslung grenades aswell (since ammo boxes do it on purpose) which would be OP too.

    i consider this thread as of the Brainstorming type which means that even the weirdest ideas may be posted without trying to bring any "logic" in it.
  8. Wolfwood82

    I'm not a programmer so all I can go by is precedence.

    There is precedence in the game for picking up ammo, so I'm not surprised that the DEVs are considering a form of ammo scavenging. They could just as easily have that ammo magically drop into our reserves every time we kill someone. I don't know but I know there is precedence in the game for that too (HA adrenaline shield recharges a little when you kill someone).

    I also know there is no precedence for interaction with a dead body except by shooting it with a gun. Even that is shaky and requires you to aim at a correct spot. You cannot push "E" to do anything with it, or hold E over it for anything. I imagine this would be fairly easy to put in, I'm just saying you were going off of the wrong ques by saying "scavenging ammo isn't implemented yet, and there is already a means of interacting with corpses".

    My concerns are why? What would LA gain with this ability and why couldn't any class use it. How does it affect our specific role in battle? What happens to your original weapon if you swap it for one on the corpse? Do you keep it stashed away and just hold the new one until it runs outta ammo? Could you potentially grab more ammo from it using ammo scavenging or ammo boxes? It becomes a very complicated mess very quickly and as it stands there is no real reason for us to have this ability. It really serves no purpose towards our one role, doesn't give us a new role, it's just another "hey this would be neat!" idea.

    I'm all for weird ideas when working with a blank slate. But we're not making a new game, we're thinking of things that could be put in to affect a small part of a game. And the initial intent for this thread was to brainstorm on what our role as LA ought to be, and potential ways we can expand on it.

    So far my conclusion is that we only have 1 role, and most ideas are basically expansions on roles that aren't related to ours but instead filled by other classes. The more I think about this the more I agree with Iridar that we don't really need anything else at all. Toys are fun but so far we kick enough *** as it is. Infiltrators need more work then LA at this point.
  9. Yalk

    Can I have their sensor dart then?

    Sure, I feel complete....with my 2 bricks of C4

    I'd like 400 certs back....I'm ok with them having a cost of 100/200
  10. Minsc

    Our role is to be the guy that can get into strange spots and flank/cause mayhem. Also known as killing enemies with maneuverability. So I was brainstorming off that assumption and not trying to give us a completely new role. Adding a new role would change the class significantly and probably be unbalanced. Most of us, I think, were simply trying to come up with ideas on how to improve our ability to do our existing role. Some stepped on the toes of infiltrators, medics and heavies. But all had a reasonable explanation as to why we should have those tools. Be it vantage points, joint survival or the fact we have the same role as heavies but move instead of tank.

    I am not seeing anything in this thread so far that isn't following the initial intent of your post. We are coming up with ideas for tools for the light assault class that fit within our role or expand on it slightly. Where, in your eyes, did we leave that?

    The idea of picking up enemy weapons and ditching your own would be an interesting way of keeping the light assault in the front, which is exactly what the scavenge ammo thing does. Instead of just resupplying our preferred gun with ammo, you have to use a weapon you are not familiar with and only have a limited amount of shots with it until you have to kill and pick up a new weapon.
  11. Wolfwood82

    Let's see, going back, we have...

    1. Implants, some of which might be doable but others veer into infiltrator territory. Thoroughly questionable balance wise.
    2. Binoculars, a word that I can't seem to spell correctly without spell check, and also veers into infiltrator territory.
    3. Rocket launchers capable of locking onto vehicles or aircraft.... -cough- damn sinus infection.
    4. Zip lines, also questionable balance wise
    5. Spotting improvements, more infiltrator toys.
    6. Medical ability to revive one person, medics would love us for stealing their exp I'm sure.
    7. Caltraps for area denial, something engineers would be better suited for.
    8. Spec-ops weapons like a grenade launcher which is basically a 6 shot UBGL... Yeah questionable.
    9. Looting weapons, doesn't really serve a purpose in any way shape or form except for that vague notion that it might help us stay behind enemy lines longer.
    10. Giving other classes a boost, falls into the zip line category but is much more limited.
    11. Target painting tools that allow for either hand held HA weapons or Liberators to have clear visuals on targets in an area or faster lock-ons or lock-ons that don't require direct LOS, which sounds pretty cool to me personally, and is my favorite so far.
    12. Breaching ability, not sure how this could be implemented given the apparently nuke proof terrain, fauna, and structures.
    13. Light flares, something I missed from page one and I'm sorry I did so. Lighting up areas at night and dark areas indoors.
    14. Grappling hooks
    15. Adrenaline pump expansion
    16. Flamethrower/cutting torch
    17. Wrist mounted rocket launcher
    18. Spawn beacons being made an LA specific item
    19. General improvements to LA weaponry, particularly carbines
    20. Can't forget the Jump Jet toggle ability
    21. Cheaper C4, which we could probably all agree on being an important change
    I think we can all agree that we want to be wanted by the squad. I get really irritated when an SL orders everyone to one particular class or another. Because you almost never hear "suit up in LA". This, I feel, is done largely in ignorance of what LA can and often do do for teams.

    A lot of these ideas I find to be questionable, yes even the ones I threw in there. Just because I argue for it online doesn't mean I don't argue against it in my own noodle. I also stopped commenting at number 14 because, well, I'm tired. I'll finish thinking about where I was going with this tomorrow.
    • Up x 2
  12. Mattressi

    That's a good sized list, Wolfwood - and a good thread too :)

    I wouldn't say a "toggle" exactly - as I and other posters have said, it's a secondary ability. You don't press F and then your JJs turn into DJs; you press F and you either quickly launch upward or forward for a short distance. To me, it's a big difference between a toggle, since it adds more variety and tactics.
  13. Minsc

    Wolf, yes a lot of them are not very good. But just look at the number of ideas we have generated! It's kinda cool to see all the ideas people have for our class.

    Having a squad of all LA would be a lot of fun, but it's hard to maintain that for any period of time. You really just need 2-3 clearing rooms and causing havoc to get the job done. I can just imagine what 12 swarming a base would be like.

    But, from what I understand, you are sick of talking about ideas for LAs to make them either better at what they do or turn them into a team player? Fair enough, just unfollow the thread so you don't get alerts on it anymore. I think it's great to see other ideas and talk about crazy silly things that will probably never get into the game.
  14. Corezer

    Teehee, Wolfwood said do do!

    He also likes my painting idea best, which makes me feel more sexually attractive.
  15. Minsc

    Hahaha, he can't spell one of my ideas. Though Binoculars combined with painting would be my favorite by far (especially if line-of-sight is no longer required to lock-on). With our powers combined, we are... we are... I got nothing :p
  16. Wolfwood82

    Not getting tired of the brainstorming, it's a lot of information to process and I tend to recede when I need to think.

    I suppose something I'd like to toss out there would be time bombs. Something with a 10-15 second fuse that can be shot and destroyed harmlessly. Once planted, it starts the timer and would be considerably more powerful then C4. Possibly strong enough to take out an MBT with a single charge.

    As I've said before, sticking to a strategic assault role makes coming up with things specifically geared towards that difficult. We have no vehicular counter parts to work with and, IMO, that would be the best choice for something like target painting. Toying with the idea of artillery weapons/abilities for Lightnings.

    None of the ideas so far are bad, most are just questionable balance wise, or have no real connection to the role of strategic assault. Also if I left anything out, feel free to yell at me and I'll add it to the list. Was too tired to remember everything and I've missed a few great ideas like the flares for lighting up areas at night. That idea is another favorite of mine TBH.

    The original concept was to allow for rapid change between DJ and JJ though, is why I write it as "toggle". Essentially you normally use JJs, you hold shift to activate DJ mode for horizontal control rather then vertical. Any way you slice it though, it is a major improvement on our most potent ability as it stands now. And maneuverability is a very difficult thing to balance, you'll notice that Scythe's aren't flying sideways at mach 2, the original design had them doing exactly that. Up, down, left, right, forward, backward, the original thought was that both Scythes and Magriders would be able to travel in all directions at full speed. This would provide very obvious advantages and thus was cut down drastically.
    • Up x 1
  17. Amarutu

    That would be more then perfect, that would be superb. Yes, give us two different kinds of explosives: time bombs and remote C4.
    I guess time bombs should have a bigger blast radius and a variable countdown. Shouldn't be able to stick to things though.
    Otherwise C4 would become obsolete. Best idea so far and easy to implement, two thumbs up :)
  18. Sevre

    After fully devoting my TR to LA for over a month, I have come to the conclusion this thread suffers from a confusion over quality vs. quantity. In other words, every class does not need an equal amount of tools and gadgets to make each class viable. Having been an avid engineer, I find that I have way more utility with my LA simply because I can fly. I am 100% satisfied with my LA. I've never racked up as many kills per death with any other class. The maneuverability of LA makes them godly on the battlefield.

    If SOE gives us an extra toy I'm fine with that. But I'd rather not sacrifice any of the current utility that the LA has (shorter flight times) in order to get a useless tool. Medics and engineers can keep their bells and whistles, and ill keep farming them.
  19. Wolfwood82

    No one ever mentioned sacrifices here. And as the OP I agree with your statement.

    However I'm just doing what I can to keep us on a course we actually want to stay on. Personally I see now value in us being singled out as the "lone wolf" class. If we were pinned with that "role" then SLs would start to constantly tell us to not roll as LA. They certainly have little use for us as it is now, and would have less use for us if that is the direction the DEVs drive us in.
  20. Corezer

    Not necessarily true. every MLG/ECG/ETC team in games that involve teams and killing others has positions for "slayers"

    Basically, support has to be supporting something amirite.

    Just like in the real world. You have the combat arms MoS' and the Support MoS'
    Not to say that no radio operator or wireman has ever shot anybody. but I havent seen many 03s doing embark, and ive never heard the commandant saying to get rid of the 03/08 field.

    sure ive heard SLs call for all HA, but that's for the rocket launcher, which while it is a tool officially, the thing kills things, and that call ostracizes every class, not just LA, as a matter of fact since LA w/C4 is the next best bet, they get hurt the least by that.

    I've never heard all medic or all infil, all max doesnt count, that isnt a real class.

    and ive heard calls for LA before, when under heavy sniper fire at a base.

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