The Vanu and how they are killing the game

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Ianneman, Jul 18, 2015.

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  1. Chewy102

    Not even indoors will you find many areas that can be controlled by shotguns. SMGs yes, but not shotguns.

    Old video but still true. Shows a bio-lab with render distance set to 15m. CQC maybe goes that far in PS2. Notice how often you have ranges that go well beyond 15m even in a bio-lab and how little cover there is for CQC ranges. This is what a CQC map looks like.

    Hard, half, and soft cover EVERYWHERE! At 3:07 you see an overview of a part of the map with just past that him running to the point area. So much cover, so many plants to block LOS, and everything can be used to force CQC fights. And the other half of the map for point A has even more cover. That is a CQC map.

    PS2 combat is not CQC. A few areas are CQC but once you let the enemy to those areas then you already lost the base. PS2 combat is controlled by the courtyards, fields, and holding the walls of a base. The idea is to not let them inside your base if at all possible and to push them out of it if they get in. Fail to do that and you wont win fights. VS gear lets them hold those areas better than TR/NC. Starter weapons that are made just for those areas, AOE weapons to control bottlenecks, and a MAX that is by far the best for those areas in not just AI weapons (who are the most accurate) but the MAX with the smallest frame to make it harder to get return fire.
    • Up x 1
  2. Shatteredstar

    I'd personally disagree, overall the factions are pretty close in the game as a whole. Some excel at different places (I'd argue that vanu has the longer/mid range, with NC holding onto the trophy of CQC gods with ALL THE SHOTGUNS EVER), TR are kinda in the middle somewhere, I think they are the most 'balanced' in the sense that nothing really stands out. They are decent/good in many areas but nothing screams "ROCKIN OMG!" other than they can throw all the bullets, but as far as controlling a specific role all the bullets doesn't really lock in on anything.

    The other reason that I disagree is planetside kind of is a weird thing to try to balance around. You never really know what fight scale you're going to encounter. Small 1-12 fights, 20+? 30+? What about over 100 on each side? Now what about 30+ with 3 groups fighting eachother instead of just two? Now add in the fact this can be long range, short range, medium range, with closing or widening distances as the battle flows.

    Finally add in the fact you may or may not have ANY coordination within this gaggle of players. So even having a high skill ceiling on everything could just unbalance things by making a few players ridiculously powerful if they are good, or having too high of a skill floor just makes everyone 'good' and it is hard to feel like your skill matters.

    This is why most of these balance threads fall flat, because people (like most humans) are horribly narrow minded and look at one aspect or one faction and proclaim OP right away, even having alts they often are going into those alts with the bias of "This still is all OP" and every time they get a kill that confirms it, even if the kill was luck.

    Vanu nor NC nor TR are OP or broken or unfun, but each one has little quirks or benefits you have to learn to play around.

    NC? Be ready for shotguns, awareness and/or distance can help some. They will likely require a greater population advantage or different weapons (bring out the AV) if you expect max units will break a cap for example.

    Vanu? Being caught out in the open plays to many of the weapon strengths because of the generally better accuracy and (at least from the feel of alot of guns) easier to manage recoil, but they often lack mag size in many guns too. Limit mobility, and the fact that things like the Magrider are generally more fragile, put damage on it with whatever you can to force it to run away.

    TR? Range seems to be the best way to manage the TR generally, VS does this well, and thanks to Ravens and Phoenix the NC can keep them decently at bay too by exploiting some range advantages without exposing themselves as much as TR need to to unload their magazines.

    These are generalities I've seen, by no means is it perfect, but by no means is it game breaking what any of them do, since so much of the game ALSO hinges on teamwork and getting a gaggle of people together to accomplish many goals.

    As far as if the playerbase is your issue, rather than approaching it as "FACTION BAD!" then I don't know what to tell you, make some friends with them and often times if you joke around or just talk in even /yell most aren't too big of problems even if a group supposedly has a bad rep.

    Well ramble ramble for me.
  3. Ximaster

    I give u reason,Vanu = plague. On every server. Just i make a thread discussing this,some trolls appearing telling about my K/D ratio,but all are the same shet. Vanu its the easy way,their weapons are the easy way,their tanks and planes are the easy way. Please DBG,make a restriction to join Vanu on Vanu overpooped servers.

    PD: FocusLight congrats,i see ur signature,i like the fact of "i have chaingun,ur argument is invalid". I have chaingun in my TR HA too,and people tend to tell me that is a bad choice. I didnt see the bad choice of that weapon, T7 MCG = GOD.

    Btw,my thread:
  4. ShineOut

    Oh **** forum side is on fire. [Pops Popcorn]
    I don't find a problem when ever I fight vanu on my NC alt.
    • Up x 1
  5. GaveYouHermes

    Yeah... sorry OP, but honestly, only thing I've noticed consistently is that NC is just horribly inept when it comes to organization. In my experiences TR and VS are just better at being more interested in taking the points no matter what, instead of just trying to get kills. VS has GOKU, TR has AOD, but there's never any major outfits I encounter against NC though.

    Number wise VS has the advantage if I remember correctly overall, but you may just be on a bad time for your faction, for example, TR is usually good in late night and early mornings, but afternoon and evening on my server is pretty low pop for us. I don't know, in general it seems pretty balanced to me.
  6. GaveYouHermes

    What's this about AOD stuff? I haven't played in a few months due to a crap PC, so I didn't know anything was happening with that.
  7. ALTRego

    Balance is killing the game. Not weapon balance or class or any other type. Population balance to be more specific. I usually set my marker around 40%. If your playing the faction in that range you end up with guys team killing you and you them. If your playing against this number you can't succeed anywhere. The third faction in question has to play along to the pop number to force a medium for alerts to even be close. In some cases even help the other factions.
  8. soeguud

    high spec requirements are killing the game - dota,tf2,cs are all accessible by potatos and subsequently have a significantly larger market reach. PS2 has historically run like **** even on a good day deterring more people from bothering to try it.
  9. Nregroepis

    Ok, that's enough. Here's what it all comes down to:

    New Conglomerate: Squares

    Vanu Sovereignty: Triangles

    Terran Republic: Circles
  10. Data_Drone

    just tell the devs to fix the stupid game is all...
  11. Data_Drone

    or ask for you money back that might get their attention...
  12. Data_Drone

    I used to like this game but yeah I have seen an NC victory for a long, long time. I don't understand why they do this I can only guess that membership stats based on an algorithm makes the decisions to power up factions at certain times...
  13. NXR1

    Yes VS is easy mode its always been like that its because their trait is accuracy, dont like fighting them join them. But i for one live for the republic, and die for the republic!
  14. iller

    Nice Cherry Picking. Try looking at the other 16 hours of the day on a main server


    They literally had to drive a wedge between our Factions just to get any "Aggro" though actually a worse thing happened each time they did....

    Here is some more of it



    Now you're probably wondering... why do they have so much pop still, they've been nerfed to s*** right? The rest of the TR and NC are on another Cont and it's really late at night perhaps?. ...well #2 it was 9:30, and #1 there was an ALERT going on elsewhere but just look at it:


    Yeah they're ghost capping an alert on the entire NA / West server and literally causing people to Log out rather than fight them.

    They also succeeded in cutting directly into the fight between the NC & TR here as you can see just like the first picture and have been doing it more and more b/c they just run out of ppl willing to fight them.

    ...which only caused more non-VS to leave

    Now I'm not saying this is a design Imbalance issue. I'm not even saying anything. I'm just curious as hell what's causing this to still be happening after so many supposed nerfs happened? Is it possible that maybe all of the VS armies are just

    Really give that some thought for a minute maybe. That maybe it's like any FPS or RTS game in history where the community starts to shrink leaving only a bunch of Tryhards who ALL PLAY TOGETHER in a position of constantly bullying everyone else who just wanted to "win some lose some" but once it turns into: "lose all of them all of the time". ...there's not as many reasons to keep trying to play as the game itself does NOT incentivize through direct rewards any kind of teaming-up against the bigger threat

    There's a limit to "Skill" for a lot of people in this world of video gaming and there is no "GET BETTER". They're as good as they're ever going to get and therefore the burden is on the TryHards to decouple themselves from their clique and unstack the teams so that you don't have 300 tryhards all on the same faction every night. When they fail to do that, they set themselves up to be at the mercy of Datamining and that invites unwarranted Nerfs that could hurt actual Newbies trying to play VS for the first time
    • Up x 2
  15. Shatteredstar

    Actually whats great about the fact you have screenshots too is that it shows it does go back and forth or is just related to population, which means IT IS NOT FACTION SPECIFIC but what people are playing when.

    And there already are some mechanics in place to encourage people to play the lower pop faction, the xp bonuses and such which given that many people want to grind certs, theres opportunities there, also the fact you may or may not have people coming in and out or shifting conts based on alerts, overall it is more or less a 'meh'

    The only way you could fix populations would be straight up locking pop on continents based off numbers with a sliding scale, which while we have an upper limit moving it around gets into making things basically like having separate servers for any FPS. Does it suck to get outpoped, sure? Ive had it done plenty on every faction, been in a rolling zerg on all three too.

    I was rolling with AODR most of the day for example and we seemed to consistently be a bit lower on cont pop almost all day, still had some fun fights, and zerged over others. Nature of the beast, it happened in PS1 at times as well

    Populations aren't a dev fix, its a community fix, we shouldn't want the devs to impose forced limits on what we can play faction wise, because that is arguably LESS fun than having the overpop, what we keep seeing though aren't fixes or a discussion within the community on how to maybe mix things up, we instead see "VANU ARE HORRIBLE! NERF THIS OR THAT OR THEY ARE BAD GET RID OF THEM" and so on.

    Heres an example I'll even be the first to say something useful in that I guess! What draws a lot of vanu is the fact you have DaPP, GOKU, SSGO (Not sure how active theyve been?), and V all fairly active and semi organized groups running about, want to get people off vanu? Form cohesive squads, use the orders channel well, and get some name recognition from the other outfits besides maybe AODR (since honestly I think I only know of 382 on TR as another and not sure how prevelent they are?) and I can't even tell you who's a big name on NC (as an enemy or a friend).

    Get the organization and they will come.
  16. SamReye

    Wait, are we trying to prove VS is "OP" or VS pop is "OP"? because population fluctuates a bunch. I've had weeks where a different faction was just roflstomping the underpopped continent. Were those screenshots depicting every continent active at the time, or were they just, as you've described it before, cherry picked to better support an opinion?

    I have a hard time believing VS had over 40% pop on EVERY continent, for every day you've played in the past week. I doubt we'd see anything different than a similar spike from the other 2 factions, as well; it could even be related to time of day.

    However, if you can prove to me that VS has this majority on both continents noticeably more frequently than the other factions, I'll reconsider. I'm even tempted to start recording my own findings once my new computer stuff arrives.

    Edit: I should rephrase this, it's really convoluted.
    You were talking about how VS was stomping the underpopped continent; but you seem to be referring to something that every faction does. I haven't personally encountered a time where VS was the sole faction responsible for causing the inevitable zerg to the non-alert continent. In fact, NC was usually what I saw whenever Hossin was open (because MAXes, I guess).
  17. Campagne

    I have to agree, fighting VS is just a chore sometimes.

    Aside from their stupidly good infantry weapons and other equipment, I think the real issue is the mentality of the player base.

    When fighting VS it's nothing but scythes, liberators, magriders, lightnings, wraith-fury-flashes, MAXes, auto shotguns, SMG infiltrators, wall-jumping and other exploits, et cetera, all within a battle no less 49-51 or greater in the VS's favour, half of which in a plane or tank hanging around the spawnroom.

    There are just too many annoying and/or unfair things that come with fighting the VS that makes fighting them not fun, whereas the TR is pretty fair in terms of numbers, vehicles and equipment (usually) and often produces the best battles.
    • Up x 1
  18. Shatteredstar

    That...doesn't make sense...are you saying that factions shouldn't use ESFs, libs, MBTs, lightnings, wraith/fury flashes, maxes, auto shotguns, smgs on infiltrators, jump over walls or anything? Every faction uses all of the above...literally not an hour ago NC broke a push by sending a gaggle of vanguards and reavers. You just described the game in general of people using the actual things provided!

    Earlier today on TR we were literally using prowlers and pounders to slam the spawn room constantly to prevent anyone from getting out on a VS base...your arguments literally boil down to "It is ok if others do it but not VS" basically.

    I don't even know quite how that even makes sense.
  19. Campagne

    You're right, my wording is a little misleading.

    I mean that they use them exclusively, with a small squad as actual infantry (using said MAXes, auto shotguns, and SMG infiltrators) to defend the point/camp the spawn. Some vehicles in an infantry fight is more than fine, but when it's literally almost nothing but, it just ruins the game. The TR & NC at least do so in moderation, usually on Miller anyway.

    By "wall-jumping" I mean jumping up and down on a wall and "climbing" it, allowing non-LAs to get to places where they couldn't previously. It doesn't count as "exploiting" though, so you can't be banned for it. If you don't find it cheesy and unfair, I believe Wrel has a video on how to do it on YouTube.
  20. iller


    uhhh no, you didn't read at all what I said. Overpop is the SYMPTOM. NC & TR lose them constantly with overpop b/c they get 2v1'd REAL fast...there must be a bigger SOCIAL system / psychosomatic Cause at work?
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