The ugly truth: Fighting Air is Boring.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Bortasz, May 11, 2014.

  1. Ronin Oni

    Wait a second... you solo lib with Shredder? How well does that work out (apparently really well for you o_O )

    I thought that Dalton was the solo lib weapon of choice... I just started messing with it actually (piloted a fair bit for gunners, but recently started flying solo just for TankBuster runs at enemy Libs/Gals and figured it'd be good to practice seat swapping finally) and been using Dalton because that's what I've seen the most of.
  2. Ronin Oni


    The problem is you do that with skyguard, and you're sitting on a hunk of junk now.

    Pulling HA and MAX AA doesn't hurt because you can change out. Tank based AA however costs you dearly.

    If we could change vehicle loadouts, Tanks would all run and grab AA. Air dies or flees. They change back. They won't complain nearly as much.
    • Up x 3
  3. MostlyClueless

    I can make good XP with an AV Turret, this doesn't mean no one ever pulls a tank. This is ridiculous.
    • Up x 1
  4. Badname707

    That's because you can pull an AV turret whenever you want it. It's an infantry weapon. It's also useful against basically everything, provided you're in a protected spot. You can also get a good XP out of AA lock ons for the same reason; they are versatile.

    For the record, tomcats don't get a very high SPM either. They're good at what they do, they're just not as versatile as other weapons.
    • Up x 1
  5. MostlyClueless


    Yeah because you can shoot infantry with them. The XP for using a lock on as AA is pretty poor, bar shooting down the dumb ESF pilot.

    The AV turret is good XP because it can kill blow up MBT's and Sunderers for delicious XP. It's pretty bad vs Infantry and MAXs. An AV turret being effective against MBT's doesn't make MBT's useless. AA being effective shouldn't either.
    • Up x 1
  6. D3GGEY

    Skyknight "useful" = being able to kill enemies and be "deterred" by enemy action instead of killed. Effective AA renders their craft useless.
  7. Badname707

    AA is effective against air though. There are just far fewer aircraft visible at any one time as there are ground vehicles, MAX's, and infantry. Air is also far more likely to escape.
  8. MostlyClueless

    Yes it does. Like how effective AV renders tanks useless or effective guns render other people useless by killing them dead.

    Tankers survive in a world where their tanks blow up to a single infantry man, I'm sure Pilots will too.
    • Up x 2
  9. Badname707

    ... Or how effective AA kills pilots too. 1 person can kill a tank, but only with the right equipment, in the right situations. The same is true for ESF's, the only difference being that ESF's are much more difficult to reach with C4 and far less likely to stay in the same place.
    • Up x 1
  10. MostlyClueless

    We're complaining about Liberators not ESF's and even if we were, saying that someone can kill an ESF with C4 is a bit silly.
    • Up x 2
  11. Badname707

    Same for liberators too. If a liberator decides he wants to 1v1 AA, he's not guaranteed a win. A single skyguard, if the driver is on good terrain and knows how to drive evasively can definitely kill a lib, if it gets too cocky. A single burster MAX, though at a pretty serious disadvantage with its slow movement, can use spawn shields and other terrain to his advantage, as well as be repaired while engaged, or revived if killed. It's not unlikely that a lone heavy will die several times, locking on to a lib, but though his KD gets hurt, he should be able to kill a lib, for free, if it won't disengage.

    And about the C4, that's the point. There's a reason that there are fewer options for G2A than there are for G2G.
    • Up x 1
  12. MostlyClueless

    Boy that's a lot of qualifiers you've got there.
    • Up x 3
  13. Badname707

    In most cases, the lib will be forced to run away. The corollary to the above is that a lib can kill a skyguard and escape, if it manages to get behind one unseen by it and other AA, or if the driver doesn't move at all during the engagement. Otherwise, the lib will always have to run away, or die from it.

    The advantage of the skyguard, is that it gets to stay in the area of operation, staying useful to the battle, while the lib has to find a safe spot to repair, removing himself and his crew from combat.
    • Up x 1
  14. MostlyClueless

    And as we all know repairing takes ages. Sometimes you're out of the battle for nearly thirty seconds!
    • Up x 2
  15. Silkensmooth

    The only thing that kills tanks is air. Unless the tanker is bad. Av turrets got nerfed.

    From your tone, you clearly have no experience in the air.

    Get some, then come talk about balance.

    All you have to do to chase away ESF and even libs is get a lock-on launcher. you can lock onto planes that can't even see you to retaliate. you can shoot them down, and if there isnt a plane to shoot, you can switch to your lmg and kill everyone on the ground.

    Whats not to like?
    • Up x 1
  16. Badname707

    Depends entirely on the environment. If you're attacking an isolated base, all you need to do is find some ground with broken LoS from the AA. However, a landed liberator is lunch for air, so unless it has cover, it will usually pull back behind where air might bother it, or near friendly AA. With fire suppression and auto repair, you can run away and come back to the fight in about 45 seconds to a minute from flaming, provided you're landing almost directly behind the base and your gunner is also an engineer. If you have a 3/3 lib, then it is possible to get 30 seconds, but again, you'd have to stay very close to the base. The less of the above you have, the longer it takes, upwards of several minutes. If the AA is bad enough, it won't come back.

    The nice thing about always being in battle, is that you will constantly be able to provide AA when its needed, not just when it's convenient for you. Air support doesn't really work unless it attacks with enough force to make a gap for the ground (swarming), or by sustaining fire (farming). Escaping and repairing is a constant part of the farm cycle for air. As an aircraft, you WILL be hunted. The only way to deal any damage at all is to evade the hunters for long enough to make a difference, and then to get out. Whereas ground vehicles can stick near to cover, just barely popping its gun out, aircraft can't do this and keep their damage output. They also are limited to their life pool; they can't effectively be repaired unless they are out of combat. An MBT can be repaired by engineers, by sunderers, can be reloaded on the field, keeping a consistent presence, unless it is overwhelmed.

    If G2A can 1v1 air, then there will be no air. Air doesn't swarm as easily as ground does. Air can't stick around as long and still be effective. If a lib can't tank some damage before leaving, then what is the point of the liberator?
    • Up x 1
  17. Bortasz

    O really? all that tons of tanks that I blew up with my tank mines and C4.... O god. They where not real? O Higby me.
    • Up x 2
  18. MostlyClueless

    It will still be able to take damage, it just won't be able to face tank AA and kill it. Maybe it'll have to do bombing runs! Like an actual bomber!
    • Up x 1
  19. MostlyClueless

    And you clearly have no experience of AV turrets because I still get plenty of kills with them. 450 meters is actually a pretty frigging long distance and often stretches between one base and the next. More than enough range to snipe tanks.
    • Up x 3
  20. Badname707

    Because then you have to make the bombs OP, or it won't be used. Bombs will have to clear a wide area, and will have to be available on 1v1 libs. Look at the duster. There's a reason why dumb bombs aren't currently in the game, though they've had versions up on test.
    • Up x 1