Last thread on this issue saw to my eyes half and half on the issue of whether the weapon needed better performance or if it was fine as it is. To me the weapon is a niche weapon that seems best used in a defensive posture and in areas that make best use of its splash damage. Out in the open, unless you have high ground, its not that great as you will often get sniped due to your position being revealed and the projectile's travel time and spread. So is it balanced as it is? I've been working with the Lasher for a while now and I like it, although sometimes I wish it did more punch on direct hits to reward your accuracy.
Matthew Higby @mhigby @TSCAndrey you should play with it a bit more. It's the most powerful of the three Empire specific HA weapons IMO. It's just very different. Matthew Higby @mhigby @Blitzkrieg277 we've been waiting for the VS to realize how good it is. Some have and dominate with it. I myself have been encountering it more and more, Some players destroy me with it, Other plays it is a laughable experience! You do not need rewarding for accuracy... the thing is insane even with hip fire. Don't aim for people utilize the splash and aim around them at the wall behind them etc.
I just want them to bring the flamethrower lasher back from beta. Has the same range as the jackhammer but kills quickly if you know the secret.
So what, the other Lasher is OP thread was multiple pages long and you were jelly and wanted in on that action, or you were just too good for the other thread? Congrats on making a new forum alt i guess. Woop Woop!
I caught Higby's tweet right as he said it, problem is it seems that the vanu who have gotten the weapon seem split on whether it is good as it is or not. Waiting for the rest of the Vanu to "discover" its power seems kinda silly to me as its been a few months since it was changed correct?
Forum alt? I didn't even participate in the beta? WTF? Well great now I'm going to have to change my passwords again...
Higby doesn't play VS and has no idea what he is talking about most of the time. He is heavily NC biased and frankly should be fired from his role as creative director of PS2. If he had any clue about the Lasher he would know VS ignore it largely because it can get you weapon locked in under 5 minutes. And in close range the thing SELF-INJURES THE USER. The last thing people want to do is run around with a weapon that seems to hurt friendlies more than enemies and also hurts the user in close range. Yes, it is actually a decent weapon under the ideal circumstances, but an ideal situation for the Lasher does not present itself very often.
this is the core of the issue right here. in cqb the thing is beast, but how often do you cqb outside a biolab?
Most of his tweet replies were to me. To a certain extent, Higby is correct, the fact the Lasher is indeed a lot better than a lot of people believe it to be, and i've had my squads use it very effectively. But, just because it's better than people make it out to be, doesn't make it an good weapon either. Now I might be sitting here barking up the nostalgia tree, but the Lasher was always suppressive fire weapon, however back in PS1 it wasn't a weapon to be laughed at either! (Apart from when it got nerfed several times before being rebuffed). Now enforce the Lasher is extremely effective, i've had my max crashes shut down by enemies, however when we returned with a large amount of Lashers the effect was devastating and 2 squads beat a 40+ in a biolab. Now for this to be done it required a lot of team work, playing very well and lets be honest the right environment, if this was an Amp station it wouldn't have worked. So we know it can be very effective but its uses are too limited! But let me remind you, any weapon enforce is very effective... So lets cut to the core problems with the Lasher as there are several ways of fixing this (this goes without saying about friendly fire grief/damage so lets ignore that and get to some real problems). Now Higby claimed it was a suppressive fire/area denial weapon, which this is very correct and I wouldn't disagree, however what stunned me was he said medium range. Now, I don't know about you guys but in my opinion its real optimal range is short to just going into medium range, this is due to its 100 projectile velocity, it's just not high enough to be a reliable medium ranged weapon. These are the problems I see with the Lasher are it's damage is too low both direct (150) and splash damage (75) in conjuction with a low rate of fire (300) and low projectile velocity (100) with all of these things together it brings it into a mediocre package! Now i'm not saying all these aspects should be buffed because that would make it overpowered. So either they make the Lasher more of a direct combat weapon which would need a Direct damage increase (not splash up to around 167-180) and a projectile velocity increase (to at least 250). However I don't think this is the route it should take. As I would rather keep it as a suppressive fire weapon than just another LMG. Personally this is what i'd prefer to see and I think would bring a new dynamic to the weapon. A decrease in direct damage (down to 143 or maybe lower) however an increase to splash damage (up to 100-120) and increase the projectile velocity (up to 250-300). The slash radius is actually fine. Now with the second option it becomes what they actually want the lasher to be, a real suppressive fire weapon. The low velocity corners you into short to CQB range and even higby said it's not meant for that type of fighting, since the weapon is way too unwieldy. With more splash damage and higher projectile velocity at the expense of direct damage (I think this is fair) this brings the Lasher to be able to survive at short to medium ranges as a real suppression weapon and area denial. The Lasher is a lot of fun, however its usage is far too limited and going into medium range it becomes too unpredictable to be effective. Now this is a last thing that needs to be implemented, and not just for the Lasher. The Lasher, Jackhammer and Mini-Chain Gun all need more attachments, now I'm sure not many will disagree with me but 3 attachments is a joke and do not help these weapons as they all under perform. They all need unique and personal things as well as bog standard things. Bog standard such as sights and advanced laser sights and grips! Now they could also do with either things like High Velocity or Soft Point ammo, or better yet since these would be the perfect weapons to bring them back on, either Anti-Shield or Anti-Armour rounds! These are just some of my thoughts and my views. Some might be too op or could be not enough, but trying to look at it with a balanced attitude.
Trialed the Lasher the other day. I may actually buy it with Certs or Station Cash. It supports my own supportive style of Heavy Assault play (if I want one-on-ones I rock a Ninjaneer with Pandora or SMG Infil). Was in a biolab, using the Lasher for the first time. Note, I play on lowest possible Render Quality, but High Graphics settings- means everything's rather blurry and indistinct- I'm also Red-Green Color Deficient (half colorblind) meaning I also can't really see the difference between TR Red, NC Blue, and Vanu Purple. I Lashed for the full 30 minute trial- did not get Weapon Locked. Got about 10 to 20 kills. The most self-damage I ever did to myself was 3%. It's possible to use it well, it just takes patience and a certain playstyle.
The Lasher would be much better if Flak Armor wasn't mandatory for infantry to survive more than 3 seconds outside the spawn building. Unfortunately, you can't increase it by 50% to compensate for Flak Armor without making it even more necessary, and that's a larger issue imo.
I am TR and i know it is not a close range weapon... The same way the MCG is not a medium to long range weapon...Its kind of like using a rocket launcher in close range and then complaining when it hurts you... After numerous encounters with the lasher i have had people who give me no chance and people who are laughable.. Some of them are able to get it just right and hit you even in cover, Others i have seen use the massive orbs to effectively block my line of sight to them making it harder to return fire... Those i encounter close range with it often died very quick they are free kills.. After Saving up 1000 Certs for the MCG that is a dissapointing weapon, Longer spin up time then most weapons have TTK, prefiring leaves you on the minimap constantly and it seems to do rather low damage. Much rather use the Carv S with extended mags =/
the Lasher is fine as it is, its best used in a distance 200-300+ meters and in an elevated position but works somewhat well in CQC in the right situations. Also as i noticed Lasher is more skill based weapon, first time you use it you will die alot without getting many kills but later as you learn how to use the weapon correctly you will be rewarded heavely, you can not hold down the fire button and shot at long ranges, you need to tap tap so the aim resets and you fire in a straight line, if you find a good position where you can aim at whole bunch of enemies comes from you can fire at the same spot for a long time and get alot of kills, aiming down the sight is a no no aswell you need to use hipfire and Laser point, And CQC will be alot easier when you have more experiance with the weapon, ADS works suprisingly well in CQC Lasher is also Max units worst nightmare, you will even win against a full health max unit in CQC if they dont use Hacksaw or AV weapons in confined locations. I can though agree with Higby that Lasher is really good, and abit underrated. if more people use the Lasher I can see that it would be easier for VS to capture locations, if lets say 5-10 Lasher is used in each battle the enemy will have alot of denied areas where they cant go to and it will be alot easier for Vanu soldiers to advance and get better fot hold. And if you dont get kills, you need not worry as the amount of assists you get will over shine the score you get from the kills as in the right battles it will come constantly Lasher is well worth the 1k certs you might be dissapointed at first but later on when you used it for several hours that felling of dissapointment is most likly not there anymore. you will though Laugh when you see enemy avoid the orbs for their life and the feeling of killing something at long range is very good Infintrators is easiest to kill as they stay stationary most of the time at same locations over and over when the VR room is up I think we will see more Lashers I hope, as I see so few use them.
Oddly enough, I actually had a better K/D ratio (just using it as an example- I could actually care less about it) when trialling the Lasher than I've ever had with another gun doing anything other than Ghost-capping. I think, for some people, it just fits them.
When used in the right circumstances, the Lasher shines. Oh, and at night. But I've found that I have no need of area denial if I could just outright kill will other weapons; The skill ceiling was pretty damn low in my opinion; Hard to learn, easy to master. With close to 700 kills, it's still my second or third best weapon, but also the only one I ever got a weapon lock with. I still hope one day we'll get a Lasher that actually lashes.
this is how I hope battles will be like in the future (lots of people useing it) Someone who found a very good spot and feed the Lasher with fresh kills
the problem with the lasher isn't really that players don't know how to use it, it's that players who aren't using it don't know how to react. The lasher's application as an area/doorway denial weapon are obvious; it's particularly great when you can point it at a spawn. It's great for defending tech plants and biolabs, keeping people off generators at amp stations and generally keeping people off control points from distance. The problem is that friendly players don't necessarily realize what to do with a 'denied' area and frequently run into it. In the half hour I spent with the trial lasher I got weapon locked twice and was almost constantly being given my 'final warning.'
