The Air Disparity

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by BetaGuru, Jul 6, 2013.

  1. BetaGuru

    I play Mattherson VS.

    One thing I have noticed as a purely ground-based player is that we never, ever have air superiority in any sort of even conflict. NC and ESPECIALLY TR libs and ESFs don't seem to have any problem at all just farming VS infantry at will.

    I know the reverse is not true especially in the case of the TR because they have the not-even-slightly-balanced-with-its-counterparts Striker, but does the Scythe suck too, or something? It's very frustrating, because I try to do what I can with a lancer and AA turrets and such, but it hardly seems to make a dent. I can't fly worth a damn and I don't like MAXes so there's only so much I can do, with the lancer being a JOKE against air and AA turrets being fragile coffins.

    Oh, and devs? Getting farmed from the air was not fun in PS1, and grats on learning nothing because it's about as much not-fun in PS2. I was excited for PS2 when it was hinted that air wouldn't be able to just hover, and would have to focus on strafing runs or the like, but if there's a difference between the relentless air farming in this game versus the predecessor, I havn't seen it. Looking at some of the top killers and k/d players in this game, is anyone surprised air cave tends to show up more often than not?

    Just frustrating. Very frustrating.
  2. Dingus148

    Uhhh, because Mattherson VS, by all accounts, consists of a majority of 4th Faction Scrubs? Could this have something to do with it? Seeing as you have a massive pop advantage, you have no excuses
    • Up x 4
  3. Bolticus

    The ESF balance is perfect as it is. The only factor in winning a dogfight is the skill of the 2 pilots. But the TR on the other hand get the Striker. 1 clip of that and you're already nearly dead. The Mattherson NC also have air superiority as they have the best pilots and best co-ordination. I respect that. :D

    But none of of this matters. What value does air superiority have when a few skyguards make it worthless? :p
    • Up x 1
  4. FateJH

    Base AA turrets are the same no matter who owns them. Ignoring MAX differences such as Lockdown (TR) and ZOE (VS), Bursters are the same. I don't believe there are any major differences between the common Vehicle-based AA emplacements, especially not with the SkyGuard. If you don't believe the Lancer is good against Air, whether or not you are correct from a hard numbers perspective, the best solution for you is to stop trying to use the Lancer against Air. The VS do have an Empire-specific Air lock-on and access to the common pool lock-on.

    If none of this offers you any assistance or protection against nefarious Air, there are only two final considerations. You either do not understand how to deal with attacking Air and need to l2p, or you just aren't very good at against Air, even though you know the basics of how to fight it, and it's more of a "someone better than I with have to handle it (but I can still help them)." I've only used the Striker against Air a handful of times when trialing and the only launcher I do own currently besides the default is a SKEP (ground lock-on). If I need to help anti-Air, I get into a base turret, one that I spent quite a while learning the compensating lead required for different Aircraft, or a throw that Burster onto my MAX's right arm. The latter doesn't work as well as it used to but, in its competence zone, it works really fine.

    Moreover, as a Ground, your goal is not to destroy Air. If you do, then it's a happy accident, either based on the incompetence of the pilot, the abundance of friendly AA in the area, or the stars just being right, and that XP is as much mana from heaven as is the wreckage falling to the ground. As ground-based AA, your primary goal is to make life for Air so miserable that they decide your hex just isn't worth it. You can try to assist friendly Aircraft in dealing with enemy Air but I recommend a good aim before trying that: there's not enough "I'm sorry"s for knocking an ally out of the sky by accident.
    • Up x 1
  5. Madcat9

    I would not recommend you starting out your post with being Matterson VS on a topic about balance since it will take away sympathy by drawing people's attention away from your complaints. Like now I find it funny about not liking maxs when in my case I have not been able to afford to even pull a max because I am sinking what little infantry resources I have into my consumables. Also have you tried the skyguard?
  6. ZeroFighter

    No one to blame but the large outfits.

    I personally do not see this, but I am in the skies and can easily go from facility fight to facility fight in mere secounds, so I see a lot more air.

    I know my outfit matches the N outfit and the QRY outfit, and can blow past the more abundant top average tier outfits such as AACE/SMG/BWC/etc with ease. We run ops frequently and cover larger outfits that don't have dedicated air wings.

    IF you are getting smashed by enemy air it is situational, not a common thing, or the outfits attacking wherever you are need to get people in the air. Aircraft is even, even with the differences between planes player skill is the deciding factor. It is just organizational.
  7. notyourbuddy

    Don't worry SOE is adding bubble wrap to all bases so soon you won't have to worry about air ever again. Its already on the Test Server so expect it to arrive on Live in less than a month.

    Hopefully SOE gives all pilots a proper send off. Maybe a "Thanks for Flying, but we've decided to take the game in another direction" with a video of the Scythe, Reaver, Mosquito, and Liberator being lowered into a hole into the ground as Military Taps plays in the background.
    • Up x 4
  8. BetaGuru

    Welp. Seven replies to date, and two of them by somewhat-less-than-helpful "VS are overpop" whiners. Speaking as someone who joined VS at launch in BOTH games, that's hardly my fault so please take your QQ about pops to other threads.

    Also, the learn2play response isn't appreciated. I'm not complaining about my own personal inability to fend off air. I'm speaking in more macro terms. It seems my empire faces this issue, and it seems to stem from our lack of a coordinate air response, just in case the thrust of the original post escaped you.

    I'd be happy to try out the skyguard, though I'm not sure about pouring certs or smedbucks into the AA launcher because it just seems like a lancer, for all it's uselessness against air, is at least more versatile. I'm more asking why there aren't more scythes, and I'm mostly asking people who use them.
  9. starlinvf

    You know, its funny. Because Pilots from all 3 factions on Waterson have trouble with AA on a regular basis.... even more so on the NC and VS with how many TR roll strikers there.
  10. Noodle!

    The skyguard was the first thing I put certs into and it eats up air. Aside from the bug where you do no air damage at all (frequent, but a bug so let's ignore it) it's extremely good at denying air, especially ESF.

    Of course they're also singularly vulnerable to harassers and other tanks and weak if they get targeted by a skilled liberator. But even then they're going to inflict a lot of damage on the liberator, and against medium skilled liberators you'll win.

    As soon as you learn to lead good against the ESF fighters you'll see most of them go down in a burning wreckage if they engage. Most of the time however they leave the area in which case you'll fulfill your role as an adherent (which is fine by me) but you won't earn much in the way of certs (fine by me but not fine for many).
  11. Oreo202

    I doubt that the majority of Mattherson VS know what a skyguard is. This is not a balance issue, this is a knowledge and understanding issue.
    • Up x 1
  12. BetaGuru

    When you have so many players, I severely doubt there is a statistical difference in the base knowledge of your average player in any of the three factions.
  13. Oreo202

    There is a noticeable lack of anti-air on the VS side. I rarely notice people pulling skyguards when there is light/medium enemy air presence.
    • Up x 1
  14. Iridar51

    And how would you know if your faction is never superior in air?
    I get it, you notice enemy has air when that air kills you.
    But how would you notice that your faction has air?
    Somehow I doubt that you spend your gaming hours staring at the sky and making notes.
  15. BetaGuru

    I've played now for hundreds of hours, and I've played all three factions. I would not have come here to make this post and serve myself up to the Forumside 2 Brain Trust if I didn't feel it was something significant worth mentioning. And since air is so annoying, and since my empire can't seem to fight back, I do what I can to try and help, however ineffectual my tools happen to be. So yes. I spent some time looking at the sky.

    I'm not a fan of the stupid little shields they're putting up. It seems like a solution from a team that has run out of good ideas. What, you can't balance out the air game, so you're just going to put up a roof?
  16. Iridar51

    I'm just saying it's common attitude "omg X killed me, nerf X!!11"
    I used to be annoyed to hell by getting killed by air. Then I got Grounder (lock on on air) launcher, and I started getting some payback.
    Now I have Striker and I try to make life of every single ESF pilot as miserable as I can.
    It also seems to me that lolpods have been nerfed to the ground (pun intended), and I rarely get killed by them nowadays.
    Also, I don't quite get what your point is. That VS scythe and AA is weaker than other factions'? Doubt that.
  17. Goden

    I remember there was an interview with the head of the Tripwire mod group (not the current game developer) and he was asked the question of why ROoST did not have aircaft. His response was simply "They ruin the game". And he's right. Look at any game that gives any amount of power to aircraft. The first mentionable game would be BF1942. Once a pilot got good in that game they were pretty much unstoppable and dominated the server. Same with every other combined-arms game which includes aircraft, including Planetside 2. If you look at the leaderboards almost every person rank BR90 and above is either a rocketpod spawnroom camper or a liberator gunner cert farmer. While this is fine and dandy for the people in the air, it IS NOT FUN FOR EVERYONE ELSE.

    This holds true even for the real world. In reality, aircraft trump pretty much everything. You cannot implement this mentality into a game. It ruins the enjoyment for everyone except the elitist pilots who think they are something special for farming helpless infantry.
  18. zib1911

  19. MarlboroMan-E


    BetaGuru, meet The Great White Whales. Probably want to get a few of them on your friends list, they will solve your problem. BTW, Zero, I almost had you yesterday in what I thought was a 1v1 until some scrub Scythe made me break contact.
    There is a whole other game above the game that few people know about. I started flying with Notorious a few weeks ago, and was exposed to organized air battles and air outfits that seek each other out. Listen: if QRY is on your continent and TGWW or N isn't there to stop them, count on the NC having air superiority, and vice versa times two. As a strictly ground player, this is transparent to you until the Daltons and rockets start raining around you, but trust me, there's a whole other layer of game in the air above you.
  20. Pat Cleburne

    The OP is smoking something. Mattherson VS air blackens the skies most of the time when I am on. It's nothing to see 15 galaxies 20 libs and 50 scythes flying through an area at any given time. Hell I spend a lot of the time just sitting on inclines in an AP prowler blasting them out of the sky. Easy pickings since there are so many of them.