The 0 Cert challenge. This game is not Pay 2 win.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by FortySe7en, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. Cedj


    While infantry are around fairly well off , vehicles and aircraft get a massive boost from equipment and most of it is 1000 certs a piece.

    I'm not a FPS prodigy, I suppose I'm slightly above average. And i beat your 3 hour 15 min score in my first encounter with the Dalton in ~20 mins, with ease.

    There is something that enrages me when talking about the pay to win issue, when people claim that pay to win is when you can buy something that f2p players cant that is overpowered. THIS DOES NOT EXIST!

    Sure, It's been seen a few times in the past as a desperate move to milk out some more cash from dead games, but no one can pull it off anymore.

    To me, pay to win is when you can buy in-combat items straight out for cash, items that will take an unreasonable amount of time to acquire without paying, provided that they provide a combat advantage. Which a lot of vehicle/aircraft weapons in this game do.

    Most of the default ones just can't decide what they want to be good against, and the 1000 cert ones are flat out upgrades.
    Before you say, exceptions do exist. Mag primary for example is fabulous, I'm sure there are others.

    I'm not saying that the game is pay to win, but I'm not saying that it isn't eighter. It's just not that simple.

    I'd continue to rant but I have to back to pretending to work.
  2. HvcTerr

    And don't forget, one guy without certs is still going to benefit a lot from all the random teammates around him who are spending certs. Every time you spawn at a sunderer, for starters.

    Maybe SOE should set up a special server where one faction can't spend certs. :p
  3. Inviso


    I'm no pro-gamer. But this seems incredibly easy. You're right. It's totally not Pay2Win.

    And I didn't even do it on easymode NC
  4. rzr22

    I feel like this whole Pay2Win thing is an annoyingly boring topic to discuss.

    In some way, PS2 is pay to win in the sense that you save a ton of time by paying. You can pay to get an XP boost, which means you can get cert upgrades faster, which make you STRICTLY better than other people that don't. Yes, someone with a grip or faster repair time will perform better than someone that isn't. Someone that pays spends less time getting that point.

    Likewise with weapons, except less so. This aspect depends more on weapon balance. There are some exceptions, though, like ESFs. Yes, you sacrifice afterburner fuel, but who here really argues that having a secondary, highly capable weapon is equal to more afterburner? Maybe some really pro primary gun users, but I doubt many.

    I personally don't see what the big fuss is over the rocket pods. Maybe I just suck, but I don't get kills galore when I use them. I tend to get a much higher cert flow just playing infantry.

    So here is my proposal. Quit playing if you don't like it. You can easily spend less than the $50-$60 price tag on brand new games and obtain a number of "must-have" items in this game. It's a business. They're here to make money. You don't like how they're doing it? Quit. It's pretty simple. I'm sure others like me are tired of reading about it. This game doesn't require an egregious amount of money to get enough items to satisfy yourself, nor does it require a constant cash flow to keep you up to par. I have rocket pods now. I'm happy. I don't need to spend any more.

    So really, there have been much worse games out there. Sure, there are games like TF2 where everything is cosmetic, but this game isn't. Either get over it or quit. I really doubt SoE will change their business model at this point.
  5. Fear The Amish

    APB does it right now....
  6. Cedj

    I giggled at this. You should try the NC to get some perspective:p

    They've been ****** up hard since the beta. The Orion is so much better than the NC LMG it's silly to even compare them. And the light/engi gun is not that far off.

    Sure, the TTK in theory is the same. But in a real combat situation it's ridiculous, where you have to shoot in bursts and counter the recoil and pray to the spread gods to bestow upon you a headshot with NC LMG, you just point and hold left click with the Orion.

    Unless at high range where you can just dance it off since none of you can do a bloody thing to each other:p so... lazy...

    Oh! And, I'm VS:)
  7. Inviso

    I've got characters on all 3 factions.

    NC still has some of the best weapons. They just reward accuracy and weapon control a lot better.
  8. Cedj

    My point exactly, APB was dead on arrival. Hell, they had to reboot they game shortly after they released it because it was a financial disaster.

    Are they pulling it off with the "F2P" system? Hardly.
    They bought some extra time by Steam promoting them in their store but it's not helping them, no one will play with a turd when there are turds coated in chocolate up for grabs around:p
  9. Cyridius

    I hope the irony of that statement isn't lost on you.

    You can support who you like when you like for whatever reasons you want, and I can choose to dislike what you're doing as a result. I like the idea of what you're doing, but by promoting and broadcasting his stream, you are supporting BuzzCut and to me that is the same as agreeing with the pure **** that comes out of his mouth. Simple logic to me. Nothing personal.

    @NC weapons are **** - I don't really think so. As someone who plays NC, I think effectiveness of a weapon comes entirely down to skill. Sure, your Guass Rifle wont hold up to a Chaingun up close and personal, but not much else will. NC weapons are made for quick bursts from a moderate distance to burn down your targets HP, rewarding your accuracy and control of your recoil. If you fail to do either, then it's your own fault. A TR weapon has hardly any effectiveness at long range compared to NC the same way NC has less effectiveness up close compared to TR.
  10. FortySe7en

    Orion is the best weapon in the game atm hands down as far as starting weapons.

    It isn't pay to win at all. People are just complaining. Also, stream starting!
  11. hammyhamm

    The only huge difference station cash can bring over certs right now are AA missiles, bolt-action rifles (for NC/TR), lightning armaments and aircav/liberator weapons (notably rockets). Everything else seems to be a side-grade.
  12. Cedj

    Let me be clear, I'm not saying that the NC weapons are bad. Hell, I think they are great. The feel of NC weapons is great.

    But in comparison to VS weapons they require a certain amount of skill to be used effectively, while most of VS weapons are as simple as hold left click and move your mouse over the target. Which I think is not OK from the balance point of view.

    I'm not the biggest fan of the Orion, i like the VS light/engi starter gun more.
    The absurdly fire rate of the Orion does not work well with client side hit detection. But then again, nothing does.
  13. HvcTerr

    However, every cert you can avoid spending on a great gun is a cert you can spend on upgrades instead, so people with SC are still going to have more upgrades than people who don't.
  14. AbortedMan

    Certs don't cost how is this proving the game isn't pay-to-win?

    Use certs, not station cash.

    I'm not against your sentiment, btw, OP. I don't feel this game is pay-to-win at all. I just don't get what this is going to prove. Station cash is a good alternative to dumping tons of time into a game, which many people cannot do. In time, everyone will cert into what they want and the battle lines of pay-to-win or not will be heavily blurred.

    Certs are demographically/financially borderless. They cost nothing and everyone gets them for playing the game...hell, you even get them when you're not playing the game.
  15. FortySe7en

    Sorry, I guess I forgot to be clear. I'm not using station cash OR certs. So, yeah.
  16. TheEvilBlight

    Then it's not just pay to's also defeating the grind-to-win paradigm. Good luck.
  17. FortySe7en

    And you are? I hope you have some sort of reference or something to back up that accusation. Anyone who knows me can vouch for the fact that I have to apologize to someone even if I accidentally run them over with a vehicle, or someone I know says something rude, or I accidentally nade them.

    We get it, buzzcut did something to upset you, and now you are going to voice your rage on the forums. That is a completely legitimate response. But do not confuse community support with individual support. As much as you apparently would like it to not be a true statement, BuzzCutPsycho is a big part of the planetside 2 community. The developers get a lot of information and feedback from his stream, and if by promoting it I can help increase the life expectancy of this game, then so be it.
  18. FortySe7en

    aHH, Forgot to mention I'm not using vehicles or aircraft or "farming" kills either. I am legit doing this infantry style for the first run and moving from base to base to base. There is no point holding unless we are legitimately defending a base.
  19. MooK

  20. Gantz

    People keep harping on how this game isn't Pay2win, we get it. That doesn't mean the current system is good.
    It's Pay2GrindALittleBitLess or Pay2ProgressFaster. If you're going to make a challenge how about you and a friend start new characters same faction/server. You pay any certificates that can be bought with cash and let your friend only use certs and see who makes more progress.

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