[Suggestion] Spawn Outposts. (what to do with all that removed territory)

Discussion in 'Test Server: Discussion' started by Ronin Oni, Apr 11, 2013.

  1. Ronin Oni

    So we have a bunch of territory now and a scattering of abandoned bases.

    What if those bases, and they maybe should be repositioned or even laid out, were capable Spawn Outposts.

    They'd never have any facility benefits, they'd be generally easy to capture but with some fortifications, but would allow for a limited form of back-hacking, as well as provide more options for avenue of attack.

    These would also be good locations for ammo towers and pads (though not aircraft terminals, and without tech link, since they aren't linked to anything, nothing ever heavier than a lightning... if that. Also no biolab healing or improved turrets or any other facility benefits that come out in the future.)

    They would need some form of indicator of their own, so that a faction could see if spawn outposts were under attack. The region should still be grey, but the icon for the outpost would be colored for the faction that owns it.

    They would provide no benefit outside the tactical options they provide (and of course XP for point flip).

    These would also be the only points to remain affected by "Adjacency". Adjacency would have 2 effects.
    1) The more adjacency you have to the spawn outpost, the faster your cap/decap hack times are. However they would not require adjacency it only causes a longer cap time

    2) Adjacency would affect spawn delay. 100% adjacency = same spawn timer as all other hard spawn locations scaling down to 0% = 2 or 3 times as long. This way a behind the lines spawn outpost has a penalty associated with being 'behind enemy lines'.

    3) Optional. Adjacency could provide linked facility benefits... though I still think a new type of vehicle terminal for lighter than MBT ground vehicles (basically, include the lightning and maybe some future vehicles) should be created. I think some of the existing bases should have their MBT capacity removed, linked or not, and some flash/sund bases maybe upgraded to lightning capable. Either way, I don't think these outposts should be MBT capable.

    As a side note... Sunderers should be slower to spawn on than hard spawn points. Not a lot slower... 3-5 seconds.... but it makes no sense that it's faster. This would go in line with those logistics for slower outpost spawning.

    Hopefully this will cater to both sides of the lattice system argument... giving small outfits side objectives, and keeping use of the whole map, while still focusing the flow of battle into a more structured format to help generate more clash battles.

    What exactly these outposts can or should provide is certainly up for debate. Main thing is concept. Yay or Nay? If yay, what do you think their capabilities or limitations should be? If nay, please share why.
    • Up x 5
  2. Ronin Oni

    All the back and forth about the deadspace and the restrictions of new lattice and not one comment on this proposal?

    Must be tl;dr....

    Here's a quick summary.

    Small outposts that do not require link or adjacency in the empty spaces left from the change to Lattice.
    Nothing ever heavier than a lightning, good point for flanking spawns and resupplies.
    Would have indicators on map so commanders can see if the enemy is capping a spawn outpost.
    The provide no resource nor do they push your influence on the map... their use is tactical only.

    want more details, pleas read OP... it isn't that long (and I've read much MUCH longer here)
  3. Loegi

    I don't see why. think the current base connections aren't that far spread out (obviously not perfect yet though), so I don't see why anybody would need another spawn point or ammo tower or whatever, other than to provide people something to do and to allow people to be spread out again.

    All I see this doing is spreading people out again, for no real reason. Sure they would hold no real benefit etc. But people will still go to there. And this would pretty much directly contradict the Lattice system.
  4. Kon

    should only be able to be captured by an infiltrator who Hacks the Control Console.
  5. Ronin Oni

    A valid concern... and one I've considered, and why I wanted to open this to discussion.

    For the most part, they can be ignored as they provide no extension of influence on a map. However tactically they would provide new avenues of attack, much how spawn satellites currently do for current hex system facility fights. They provide no benefit whatsoever... other than a point to spawn and maybe pull some vehicles.

    I don't think they should be everywhere but a few well placed outposts could add an interesting extra dynamic to the lattice I think. Their positioning would be key to adding to tactical depth while not distracting from the main objective.
  6. Loegi

    So small outposts surrounding bases with fast capture times to basically simulate a Sunderer but stationary?
    In moderation (a lot of moderation in my opinion) and enough thought in their placement, it might work.

    I think they shouldn't be much more than a capture point and a small spawn hut then, with indeed some minor fortifications. And the capture time should be somewhere under one minute.

    Also, I can't see the adjacency working, unless there would be too many of these things. And I don't see why you would ever need to have a benefit to it when they're connected to your own hex.

    Except that the adjacency will allow the defenders to recap the spawn outposts more quickly than the attackers can capture them, which is good. Guess that does work then.

    Still a bit doubtful about the actual need for this though. But I guess it's not something you should write off immediately at least.
  7. Ronin Oni

    I don't think it's needed by any extent...

    I just think, if done in moderation and well considered placements, that it could potentially add more depth.

    Oh, I also think they should create new vehicle terminals... some that exclude Sundies (Flash & buggies when they arrive) and some that exclude MBT regardless of Tech plant (not even for Spawn Outposts necessarily... just a way to have light armor spawns without MBT)

    I don't think everyone should be fully loaded with ammo tower, ammo pad, and some kind of terminal at all.... depending on their location they'd have different capabilities.

    I could see some up on a mountainside/cliff that would be particularly hard to reach that would offer a a couple well placed turrets and an Air Resupply pad. Spawning there would generally be a bad idea (though always an option) since their' literally be little you could do from that location.

    Just spit-ballin ideas.
  8. Chemicalnurd

    I like the idea of some organised stealthy ops and slower combat in the neutral zones, stuff that impacts the nearest parts of the lattice where the main fights are going on.
    I'm picturing infantry only movement to maintain stealth (obviously this wouldn't be enforced mechanically, just infantry are harder to notice than vehicles) and a tense feeling similar to what you get in ArmA sometimes. Mmm mmm mmm. More skirmishes with fewer numbers over larger areas would be pretty fun I think. At the moment all the small squad vs squad combat takes place when a group tries to ghost hack and a squad turns up to spoil their day, but I think it'd be really awesome if something happened like two small 6 or so man squads ran into eachother in the neutral zone without vehicles. You'd get a really tense firefight, since the stakes are higher as you're likely a pretty long way away from spawn points compared to usual.

    Something to capture in the neutral zone would be a great way for this to happen, but I think it'd need to be significantly different to the usual sort of base. Tiny watchtowers or hidden bunkers as opposed to full outposts. Mmm, mmm, mmmmmm <3
    Maybe in the end these could have significant impacts on the main fight, like some being mortar observer stations or something.
    Not really a good game to compare this to, but does anyone remember part of the first level on Battlefield: Bad Company, where your four man squad captures a mortar nest away from where the regular army is fighting, and is able to give support from it? Stuff like that would be awesome.
  9. Giggily

    Bases on Indar are still generally closer together than on any other continent, do you think those others need outposts too?
  10. Ronin Oni

    With the Lattice system?

    There's quite a bit of deadspace that could squirrel away some spawn outposts.

    Chemicul, I like your idea of 'minitowers/bunkers'
  11. Worph

    Defensibility? Absolutely! But only with a well placed Sunderer -> maybe incorporate some good positions to place them in good cover.

    Ammotowers? Yay, why not!? Maybe with a capture point like the outposts of big facilities only to flip the ammotower.

    Other than that, specifically direct spawning? no. That'd be OP.
  12. Regpuppy

    Just have random buildings, terrain features, and areas that can be used as garages in the open unused areas. Players will pretty much make sure it accomplishes the same thing. Don't even need the same considerations of regular bases, just plop down some random assets and let the players imagination do what it well. Throw down some randomized terminals as well, aside from heavy terminals, and players can use sundies to have a makeshift base.
  13. Greenspore

    Hmmmm... why not just drive a Sunderer, because it can be deployed and moved anywhere on the map, are we really this lazy and averse to risk?
  14. Ronin Oni

    I'm not adverse to risk...

    I'm trying to think of side objectives besides the main lattice lines.
  15. Deathcapt

    Bases on indar are already too close together. I want fewer bases per continent like in PS1 where there was actual terrain between bases, and transport was a real concern.