[Suggestion] Stop balancing every aspect of this game towards infantry.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by TammelTR, Oct 31, 2014.

  1. Pardus

    See also problem one. Ok, assuming that was the only issue?

    1 fully certed proxmity radar 1,200 certs.

    1 infantry fully certed for C4 700certs

    1) Why should I look at that as a 1 to 1 balance or even call it a fair balance?

    2) C4 is a full tool by it's self. Proximity radar is a addition cost to let the primary use of a tank work on top of everything else, not a useful item on it's own. Why should I call that a balanced trade?
  2. Moonheart

    No, sorry, That's wrong.

    The enginneer/LA is not going to have all that you have for this price, not even closely.
    It will not be immune to small arms, not moving at 300% walk speed, not able to fight at full efficiency without needing to spend an addition single ressource until your next death, not able to survive to 3 tanks rounds, to roadkill, to banshee fire, and not to be able to self-heal... and even for tank killing, they will be subpart compared to you.

    Your comparaison is just stupid.
    • Up x 2
  3. Exonis

    Why do all these guys from CoD insist on sticking to planetside 2?
  4. Pardus

    The time to get in place is a rough estimate, but which part of the math is wrong?
  5. Moonheart

    I didn't say the math is wrong.
    I said this sentence is wrong:

    The two don't accomplish the same goal, not even remotely.
  6. Pardus

    (I try not the be cynical.) I'm confused.

    A main battle-tank outfitted with anti-tank weapon's goal is not to kill tanks?

    A infantry explicitly said to have gone back to a terminal, and refitted to get C4 to kill a tank ... doesn't have the goal of killing a tank?


    As someone else already said, C4 runs out after one kill. If that's what your saying that glosses over the fact how easy and cheap it is to get more vs. even getting one tank.
  7. GaBeRock

    This may surprise you, but dedicated pilots are bound by the resource system too. If they're the kind that can spend an hour in their vehicle, they've played so much they're probably good infantry players too.
    • Up x 1
  8. Uncle_Lou

    I still think the biggest problem is the jack of all trades infantry. I am hesitant to compare PS2 to PS1 because they are vastly different games, but I think one of the things that allowed for better balance in PS1 was the fact that players HAD to specialize. You had to make conscious choices in what you wanted to cert into, and you couldn't cert into everything - you had to sacrifice some things to cert into others. IMO it was a much better mechanic and made gameplay infinitely more compelling. It's never going to happen at this point in PS2, so I don't even know why I bring it up... But I firmly believe it would make a huge improvement in PS2.
  9. david06

    Planetside 2 has lost something like 90% of it's players since launch, you can't blame SOE for finally thinking that the obscene farming in this game of infantry by vehicles is bad for business and trying to cut down on it.
    • Up x 1
  10. Pardus


    That's sort of a loop. I will not argue with them protecting their business, but ...

    You don't teach kids "fire is hot" by removing all fire everywhere and pretending it doesn't exist. (Not that you should throw them into bonfire to teach the lesson either.) Then no one knows what fire is when they see it, or later in life -when they do have to deal with it- they have no practical examples of how to respect it.


    When getting shot by tanks do you:

    A) Go right by into the nice flat plain the tanks the are in to get shot again?
    B) Get more DAKKA a bigger gun?
    C) Get your own tanks out there?
    D) Use cover and advance? (If you ask what cover is you automatically fail. :p )
    E) Find a path they're too big or clumsy to follow and just ignore them?
    F) Get a APC(sunderer) and just run the blockade?
    G) Call down a orbital strike. (Sorry this option is out of order by popular vote.)

    The option to 'H) Cry about it' is unavailable, and stricken from the record. :p

    If you picked anything but A, you got around the tank. If you picked A, I have no sympathy for you. If you picked B) Get more DAKKA' you pass on general principle.

    If you picked 'Z) Know they're too busy farming the the sheep to bother to notice you and just walk by.' You only technically pass, and your booted out of tank school you filthy infiltrator!
    • Up x 1
  11. Copasetic

    You're cherry picking the things that support your opinion and ignoring everything else.

    I invest that much in a tank because, unlike C4, I can use it at any range instead of only point blank. I can use it against moving targets, something C4 can't do and if you pay attention to what's going on in game you'll see the vast majority of targets are in fact moving. I can use it to travel the map quickly while being able to destroy anything on the ground in between. I can repair it and rearm it for free for as long as I can keep it alive. I can soak up damage with it that would instagib me as infantry.

    Viable AV targets for my C4? Any tank that is close to infantry and sitting perfectly still for long periods of time. Viable targets for an AV tank? Absolutely everything on the ground regardless of what it's doing, and even aircraft if you can be bothered to position your tank properly.

    Lastly, there's a very simple counter to C4. It costs nothing and is 100% effective. It's not even this magical situational awareness everyone is always talking about, although that helps you decide when this counter is necessary. It's moving your tank. Unlike all the other AV in the game this one can be completely defeated just by moving. It's so effective that I don't even try to get near a moving tank, I look for the ones sitting on a hill for 5 minutes spamming shells into a base. Or the ones sitting in front of a gate shield for 5 minutes waiting for infantry to let them in. Lucky for me there's plenty of those around, and just like a sniper headshotting people who are standing still on a rooftop I don't feel the least bit bad about blowing them up.
    • Up x 1
  12. Moonheart

    I'm going to quote someone that found the exact sentence about this:

    - Vehicle KPU of AV tank weapons is 3 times higher than C4
    - Infantry KPU of AV tank weapons is 4 times higher than C4 (yes AV weapons, not AI weapons)
    - Amount of xp earned in a tank is something like 10 times higher than when playing you LA/engineer
    - Tank makes you imune to the two thirds of the threats on the battlefield and able to fight everything

    And for the cost, that's just so convenient to only counts what happen at spawn time, without counting all the cost the LA/engineer will have to spend after he used its C4: cert cost for weapon and defense, amount of time lost running everywhere at foot speed, ressource costs for every consumable it will use only trying to survive...

    Yes, you're only picking things that support your opinion and ignore everything else in the game... but we don't play in your head, we play PS2.
  13. StillMostlyClueless

    Cost of a gun powerful enough on the MBT to one hit infantry.

    Default Cannon: 0 Certs
    1.25x Scope: 1 Cert
    Rank 1 Magazine Capacity: 1 Cert

    Total Cost: 2 Certs (You can skip the 2 Certs if you're a monster)
    • Up x 1
  14. Bernardes

    Agree in all aspects.
    Another day I was thinking about open a SR to SOE to be reimbursed about the certifications I spend on items which were nerfed… PPA is one (and don’t think I use it most, in fact I am a pilot and hardly ever used the Proton PPA)
    Remember when Night Vision highlighted targets?! Why dev nerfed it this way?! It is completely useless now…
    Does anyone find a way to use night vision now a days?! Nights aren’t even dark in this game…

    Stop nerfing the stuff.
  15. Yuukikun

    You couldn't be farther from the truth. Dedicated vehicle outfits have more than enough resources to be 100% of the time in aircrafts/MBT, especially with the new resource system. And most of the players in these outfits have 2 to 4 k/d overall and when you check their infantry vs infantry, they have around 1 or lower and that's while maining HA.
  16. Targanwolf

    For whatever reason SOE decision makers think its ok to pit BR1 vs BR 100 players...and have a mechanic that enables one player to kill another in under 2 seconds. Head shots = instant death from somewhere unknown. And the company wonders why they cannot retain players !!!! ???? AND THE MONEY TO DEVELOP THIS GAME .
    This game is not on a growth trajectory like EVE.It's in a dive angle into the ground. and it doesn't have to be this way.
  17. Axehilt

    I'm not sure fast TTK factors too much into it. (Even as a PS1 grognard who's been in favor of slower TTKs since alpha.)

    The bigger problem is letting players know how they died and what they can do about it.

    The screen is currently so broken that occasionally it tells me I died to 0% total damage from an unknown mystery weapon. This sometimes confuses me even as one of the games longest veterans. For a new player it's utterly useless!

    Then even if the screen tells you how you died, it still needs to inform you what you can do about it. Died to an AI vehicle? Well those weapons deal zero damage against AV vehicles, and you can easily win that way by spawning one (possibly at the next-closest base if the battle is too busy.) Died to a lib? Time for an A2A ESF. Died in a vehicle to a dual-AV tank? Time for a A2G aircraft. The game has a lot of nuance to its counter system which can be communicated directly by the death screen, which is a huge potential for educating players.

    But instead it's just broken.

    There's even a bug where after a long enough play session it can break entirely (every new death tells you the damage sources of some prior death.) (Which is in addition to the "overkill" bug that's been in since beta, where you take so much damage from a prior death that it actually shows up in the next death too.)
  18. Targanwolf

    I have no confidence that if I subscribed some how things would change. SOE decision makers like the things that I feel turn people off FAST. So....i won't pay a subscription.
  19. Pardus

    Then tell me how that isn't a logistic problem, and I'll stop trying to show it to you. Telling me about a different aspect shows only that. A different aspect, not how I'm 'obviously wrong and should never have opened my mouth'.

    Let me define my term here then,


    1 the aspect of military science dealing with the procurement, maintenance, and transportation of military matériel, facilities, and personnel
    2 the handling of the details of an operation


    To word it another way, my point isn't that a tank can't excel.

    It's that it's a bad investment.

    It's active part can be done by a infantry with less and quicker. Not that say PPA spam doesn't kill infantry, it's that by the time you get that PPA and have in in position to fire, you could have killed those same infantry two times over already. (Edit: You could die a few times before doing it and still come out ahead.)

    For the oppositions active part, It costs them less to kill you then it does for you to kill them.


    Tell me how that information could be applied (so I know you understand the point), or that information is directly wrong then I'll stop repeating my self and "cherry picking" details.

    Edit2: One more detail. Don't assume the enemy is a idiot.
  20. Andy04

    Vehicles are meant for support not farming...... It's the vehicle farming that got them the nerf so it's your own fault : D