State of all factions, VS > NC > TR

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Runefugue, Nov 2, 2014.

  1. Fellgnome


    Hahaha you are leaving it out. You switched from kills per hour to daily average which is completely irrelevant.

    Pounders have 16.78 / 13.95 avg KPH

    Blueshifts have 29.84 / 29.33

    That's nearly double. Pounders are not imbalanced against infantry, they're just more of an AI weapon than AV weapon. Should they nerf the Air Hammer against air because it's an AI nosegun? Or just any weapon that has a fair amount of dual purpose potency?

    Problem is if first gen AV aren't going to be as good at AV as second gen, they need something. AI potential is currently that something. And there's a good reason for them to have some AI potential since they're pulled as anti-MAX weapons which is probably a good thing or AI MAXes would run even more rampant especially NC's since their AI perform better against other MAXes most of the time.
    • Up x 1
  2. boey

    Comets for long-range AV? Did you ever use comets before? You can use them at maximum for close to mid-range AV. For Long-range they are useless. I very rarely see Vortex Maxes when playing VS, but i very often see Fracture Maxes on the TR-side. Must be with a reason.

    So you think Fractures aren't a good TR MAX weapon? Then why do i see them being used effectively in nearly every battle against TR?


    Nerf the AI-Power of the Pounders and give it a buff in its AV-department and thats it. Leave everything else as it is.
  3. a-koo-chee-moya

    Yes, while the balanced weaponry of TR makes them more balanced on live, where players will be less informed in their choices, in Server Smashes, every gets organized, so every can know what the OP weapons are. Besides, I remember Waterson playing TR during the merger smash.
  4. MasterDemoman

    NC = / = VS = / = TR
    TR = / = VS = / = NC
    NC = / = TR = / = VS
    TR = / = NC = / = VS
    VS = / = NC = / = TR
    VS = / = TR = / = NC

    Hey guys, I have a chart for you
    9 of them, actually. :eek:

    Overall, I perform better on TR at the moment, however, I fight against TR (As NC/VS) the best.
    Overall, I perform similarly on VS as I do on NC, however, I perform much better in a VS MAX than an NC MAX.
    Overall, I perform the worst on NC infantry, but the best in NC vehicles (All vehicles combined, my prowler is better than my VG)
    Overall, I think the game is balanced, albeit in a damn stupid way. (Shotguns are ****, and the GODSAW is worse than the Gauss SAW, but there are enough ups to balance out the downs, no matter how stupid and easily fixable they are.)

    Oh, and the whole "Faction food-chain" argument is the most invalid, and utterly garbage one. Ever. EVER.
    • Up x 1
  5. Asageh

    #1 Really? TR has a similar weapon with an almost identical TTK, MSW-R and its only 100 certs, Carv comes really close. Many VS LMGs are only decent at best, SVA-88 and Orion being the best they have.

    #2 Don't have C4? :rolleyes:

    #3 No opinion on this as I'm not a Tanker or a Pilot. Shows what I know, I'd pull BS out of my **** if I tried arguing this.

    VS:
    Although it is really a "one gun" faction, their few weapons are strong (too strong some would say). Also lacking in ES stuff.

    Not really an issue.

    IRNV scope? :eek:

    NC:
    If you're talking about the NC's Heavy Weapon, the Jackhammer, when you're talking about Infantry Shotguns, then yes, its really good. But if you're talking about the shotties like the Mauler, no, every faction has an exact identical copy, Mauler = Barrage = Thanatos.

    Yes NC MAXes are cheesy, leave it like that, MAXes are cheesy to begin with. I am Bias, I like it. :p

    Again no opinion/argument for the MBTs.

    If you're talking about the NC Phoenix, they you are not aware that it is bugged and half the time will not let you control it and just plummet into the floor.

    Your opinion on the aesthetics of the faction. :mad:

    TR:
    ES stuff, kinda agree yeah. But they're not completely useless, just very situational, bit more variation in playstyle will do them good. MCG is fine tho.

    Burst Fire? It's not all that hard. Also TRV, Jaguar, Carv/MSW-R and Armistice all have the best TTK in their respective weapon category. :confused:

    Again, your opinion on the aesthetic, man.
  6. dstock

    I skipped the video, but I totally agree. It has several facets that make it really interesting, but most people would rather just run a Halberd because point & click is easier than anything requiring fire control. I use it (and the other ES AV) almost exclusively on Harassers, but this is one of the best asymmetric balances in the game, currently.

    Yeah, preach the gospel.

    There have been several faction balance passes since then, and a lot of those players played TR to begin with, or drilled it enough it didn't matter. No one bothers to do that anymore, the question is 'Why?'
  7. Casterbridge


    What significant faction balances since then? There have been very few major faction specific balances since then and the ones that have happened that impacted the TR have primarily been positive while the NC and VS have been hit with a few negative ones.

    Also while there where indeed some TR outfits in the smash from Waterson side there where heck of a lot of NC and VS in it as well.
  8. IberianHusky

    As a TR main, our LMGs are mostly fine. I absolutely love my CARV and MSW. The Rhino is decent too, and the MCG is fine the way it is, though a mag size increase would be nice. The CARV-S and Bull are still garbage though, and need a massive reworking. I've never used the TMG-50 so I won't judge that.

    Our ARs are second to none and our Carbine selection is decent too.

    Yes, most of our ES stuff is pretty terrible. The Striker is still shameful even after its reworking, the deploy/lockdown abilities are just trash, and the Marauder is just a gimped Fury.

    Our MAX weapons are slightly underwhelming, but if there is one thing they are good at it's suppressive fire. With a Heavy Cycler and Mutilator with Ex Mags I can keep a never ending flow of bullets on the target without ever having to stop to reload.

    Overall I think the thing TR suffers from most is definitely lack of identity. It's like the Devs didn't have a clear direction when designing us, so we got this weird mishmash of high-speed vehicles/stationary deployables. Yeah, we can shoot fast but so can the other factions, and we may have 10 extra bullets per mag, but that's about as useless as "No Bullet Drop" when the weapons are in the hands of a player like me who compulsively reloads.

    TL;DR: Most of TR's infantry weapons are pretty decent, our ES stuff is mostly garbage, and TR just does not have enough individuality to make it stand apart from the other factions.
  9. nehylen

    While i can't claim to be a TR authority (yet!), that's what's been troubling me the most after my recent switch from my VS char: i compulsively reload, which is quite fine with about every VS carbine/AR (except the higher RoF Serpent carbine and H-V45 AR incidently).
    BUT...i had an epiphany with the Repeater, i was like "damn that reload" and "wow that sidearm" at the same time, then juxtaposed the two...and it all made sense: Repeater(and Amp, i guess) feel like they are the direct compensation to the long reload (in theory their dps is slightly higher than the 652/143 model).

    Also one thing that i noted in my first TR steps: you have more spare ammo too. The typical VS AR/carbine is 30+180 while the typical TR one is 40+200. That doesn't seem important in the grand scheme of things, because you usually die way before you have any time to deplete your reserves, but it's not entirely insignificant when there's a shortage of engineer (running around with a pistol isn't very reassuring, mind you...).
    Most importantly though, it authorizes you to shoot at bullet sponges (Harasser or MAX more), without worrying as much as you would as a VS.
    Anyway i've started to adapt, and not reload that often, it feels close to what i'm used to the Orion, i'd say (same RoF, 40 vs 50 rounds/clip). I do think i'm better off with a Cycler+Repeater than Pulsar/Terminus+whatever as a general rule, when i account for the reload time.

    About the MAX thing, i tend to think were VS/TR MAXes AI weapons not fittable with extended mags, it would be about balanced. Slightly more accurate vs slightly more bullets is fair in the principle. For instance the usual Mercy vs Blueshifts debate seems about ok to me if it's 40 vs 50, and the +.1 CoF penalty. But when you have 60 rounds vs 75... while the relative difference is the same, in terms of actual use, it's not, you won't find many situations where 75 is that much more useful than 60.

    I don't understand why MAXes have extended mags anyway, outside of bursters. Yet i have to admit they would feel even more empty a class than they are now, were they not to have that.
  10. Goretzu

    Part of the Pounders power is suppressive, it's another one of those weapons where pure kills doesn't show the whole picture, certainly it has high kills relatively, but there's still more too its power than that.

    Bit like the Striker 1.0 really.



    NC AI MAX vs MAXs is the most easily avoidable thing in the game.

    1) The NC AI MAX has to have extended mags or Grinders or they lose even against basic uncerted TR/VS MAXs.
    2) The TR/VS MAX has to be at LESS THAN 8m to lose, above that they win.
    3) If the TR/VS MAX has KA5 they are immune to anything NC AI MAX-wise, but dual Grinders with extended mags.
  11. MAXArmar


    I've actually had a lot of fun with my Vortexes vs infantry. For some reason the lazorbeamz now visually explode (without doing splash damage of course) and it seems to scare the crap out of infantry when I semi-automatically spam shots in their direction. They are also mid-range beasts vs MAXes, impossible to miss with them.

    Vortex as AI still sucks though.
  12. CrtmN

    Developers look better statistics, and players do not cry on the forum.
  13. CrtmN

    With such a farm Enforcer impossible infantry. Get in infantry with him very difficult.
  14. Goretzu

    Whilst they do make mistakes, it true that generally they've gone in the right direction.
  15. Kunavi

    How is Vulcan good in any way shape or form? Really? I've run with this way too long and it's ****. Hell NO it's not good on a Harasser, the thing maneuvers so much that coupled with low Dmg, reach and long reloading plus low mag pool and COF increase /Sec, you're just randomly firing in what you THINK is the target's general direction - Said target sitting there with a beer in their hands going "WOW THIS GUY CAN DRIFT! Hey who threw that pebble!?". Common pools just out DPS you and in the VS' case(Their ES, Mag) they even outRUN/Maneuver your Harasser and you get R3kT royally. For NC it's just WinShieldROFLUDEDGITGUD.

    Want to talk Harasser against Harasser? Yeah NO you don't. Haven't gone against many PPA ones after the change but pretty much even Cannister will shred you if you go against with the Vulcan(Or the Marauder for that matter).

    TR have a long way to go and I could comment on a lot of misperceptions here but I'll keep it Vulcan only; The Vulcan comments in particular got me all worked up.

    I missed the OP Vulcan days as I refused to spam Harrasers when they were OP as well just like I missed OP Lib days on purpose and Viper OP days for the same reason. When randoms like some of the people pertaining to be TR authorities come here spreading this nonsense about the Vulcan I get kind of pissed off. No offense, stick to your Faction and defend it against NerfHammers if you want but playing 10" TR then coming here to say they are fine as they are, is just laughable.
  16. Golconda

    I recently switched from TR over VS, all I can say is the personal reasons of that.

    I'm the kind of "empire specific" only player, I'll never use NS stuff or copycats weapons. to me there's no reason why there should be copycat stuff in a factions game. if a player joins PS2 he does it because of the factions, or he could just have played another " 'muricah vs the world " game.

    I always used the MCG (~6750 kills with it). I love the weapon, I don't like the fact that you only have 200 bullets (and that by sacrificing the brrt usage) which is the same amount of a lot of other TR and NC LMGs. the problem is that with the MCG you have a spin up time to compensate for which forces you to pre-fire bullets into nothing in order to achieve the max spin time. that requires bigger magazines and bigger ammo reserve. other LMGs start firing at full rpm since time 0, there's no need to waste bullets.
    the MCG has a fixed CoF that is bigger than enemy model even at 10 meters. that makes so that even at full spin and at the former max damage distance the weapon won't do the full damage and you will have to spam more bullets to the opponent in order to deal the same damage as other LMGs. other guns shoot where the player wants since time 0.
    the MCG has 1.5 headshot damage multiplier, that means that even if you headshot you will need more bullets that other LMGs in order to kill.
    I think you got the problem here. a so-called suppression weapon that has same amount of bullet as other lmgs, but less accuracy and a spin up time that makes it very little useful at close ranges. even if you are at less than 10 meters from your opponent so the CoF would cover it entirely, the full damage of the gun is comparable to the one of an assault rifle, but with spin up time and 1.5X headshot multiplier.
    TR doesn't have a useful empire specific rocket launcher. I used to play with the striker when it was an ES-version of annhilator, now it just suck and have little use only versus air, which I care far less than ground just because you see tons and tons more tanks/ground vehicles than ESF and AIR in general.
    TR has boring ES prowler/MAX abilities. not gonna argue about how effective they are, but they'r are plain boring.

    I just keeped rolling TR just because I like their appearence, music, voices, old style weaponry and so on.

    VS has lasher, a weapon that is capable of scare groups of enemies at pmuch any range. it deals full AoE damage at loooong distance, and, thanks to the bloom resetting so fast, the stream of bullets goes where you actually aim. whats the point of the MCG, a suppression weapon that is only good at short distance?
    yeah the gun has ****** TTK (more or less than MCG? dunno) but I dont care since it can easily kill stuff also when dancing & shooting from the hip thanks to the AoE. the only concern I had with the gun was its bloom but, after seeing Wrel using it, the weapon just became perfect at my eyes (the only good fix would be change the particle effects when using ads so you can actually see what ur shooting at using 3.4X scopes for suppression).

    the lancer, oh man what a nice weapon! you have pmuch the damage of an S1 (even more vs sundies) but you can hit EVERYTHING you see on the map with ease. use it vs big airs, use it to snipe tanks @sses, vs MAXes at any range, use it even to snipe infils (they will remain with like 150 hp after a full charge lazer, just a little spam with lasher and it's done). this is the perfect launcher for vs, so nice in combo with lasher (that compensates lancer's lack of AoE)
    and the best part is that it is a skill based weapon, you need to learn how to anticipate fast moving enemies, you need to know how to cancel charges etc.

    when you are fighting a group of vanus you pmuch can't deploy vehicles/maxes in line of sight thanks to vortexes and lancers. (and that sucks for TR especially.)

    NC btw has everything I'd like to use (vast weapon diversity, shotguns, spartan-like shield abilities for their MAXes) but I dont like space 'muricah so GGHF.
  17. Fellgnome

    Uh....Jaguar isn't even close to best TTK. And with headshots the Anchor/EM6 are theoretically best TTK for LMGs. MSW/CARV and Orion are all slightly better if bodyshots, slightly worse if headshots.

    Cyclone is also about the same as Armistice, but way, way better accuracy.