Squad Leaders and Platoon Leaders, STOP muting/ignoring Command Chat- and use TEAMWORK

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Zapon, Mar 10, 2013.

  1. Zapon

    I'm thinking there is a need to be able to talk to other platoons on the server due to the diverse spread of a factions forces on a server.

    I agree though that a command channel that is limited to continent, and one for the server also, might work...think i might go toss that request in the roadmap on the topic for when they add companies since comms are getting redone for that.

    I feel like that's another issue that ....
    So they are irrelevant to whatever the outfit is doing? That doesn't make a lot of sense- because your outfit must run into times when they could use additional support against large groups, or other outfits- where pulling from the faction pool could be useful, surely. After all, how else would you pull up reinforcements the few times you need them?
  2. Pirbi

    The people who mute it aren't the problem. The people that cause them to mute it are. And even the well intentioned can use it poorly. It's better to just learn how to read the map. Just because you aren't hearing anything in your squad, doesn't mean all the other SLs across the faction don't already have a full plate of communication going. Just because you believe your battle is the most important, doesn't mean it is. Just because you didn't get your way in that instant, doesn't mean you should rage quit the lattice. I tend to use /leader and /orders as it doesn't interfere with everyone's coms. You can spam it if you want, just don't expect anyone to be listening to you. And SOE could make it continent specific. Why do we all need to hear about every flea fart from a continent we aren't on? And SOE needs to monitor it and ban the trolls.
    • Up x 1
  3. iccle

    It makes perfect sense. For example if we are playing on esamir, there is an alert on indar, command are talking only about the alert on indar, the entirety of the conversation is irrelevant to what we are doing at the time and is largely just distracting background noise.
    If we need assistance or are offering assistance to anything we usually either just turn up (because we know where were needed by reading the map) or just do it via /tells or /leader because we realize that most outfits run separate voice comms like we do and are usually pretty busy on those like we are. Text chat is more persistent, clearer and a more concise way to communicate in this game.
  4. Zapon

    Waterson used to have one or two leaders on VS who would actively shut up other people on Command and tell them it wasn't worth it- it's what inspired this topic to start ages ago

    Eventually he left, and we started using proper discipline, and started trying to help each- and we made it a decent place where you didnt have any problem people anymore, to really be talked out of it.

    No, as a Leader I often have quite a full plate- but I find the time to quiet comms(this is rare) in my platoon, then talk with friendly forces on Command- especially if they are operating in the same hex

    I also have the option of, if i wanted- of asking on command who is on the cont, and then using the game's power to make a custom channel for the cont leaders- if the other continents are busy fighting(majority of faction is normally focused on one cont at a time, however.

    Anyway, I feel like there's a lack of widespread effort to really address that issue.

    When I use leader text chat- nearly no one responds the majority of the time- and it takes a lot of time to type out that i'm available to support if needed- or if i am trying to gauge the status of if other forces can spare squads to aid someone elsewhere on a continent. Orders works great- until you are in a situation where the enemy is redeploying massive forces fast and orders has not recharged quick enough

    Yes SOE needs to ban Command Chat trolls- I haven't seen trolls on it since the earlier days, luckily- but for what it's worth
    , one of the things I enjoy doing is leading- simply because I like leading the randoms- and I've enjoyed that since my days of doing it in MAG- and I feel like i'mthe only one fighting for bringing everyone on the same page and respectfully interacting with each other.

    I can only suggest , if in the current day- when someone starts "talking about something not relevant" that you ask them to keep things short, sweet- be ready to repeat their broadcast copy if requested, and always treat them with respect and ask them to do the same.Or, if they are just being.....obnoxious and won't do anything else- THEN, mute that specific person, not the whole chat and the rest of your faction, and the leaders which are willing and able to work with you to act as force enhancers to your ops.
  5. Zapon

    With the weakness being that leader text chat (in my experience) does not get anywhere near as strong a response rate- and can be difficult in situations where frequent communicaiton is needed due to a rapidly changing dynamic on the server macro-strategically.
  6. iccle

    I guess if you are unsure where you should be or what you should be doing then command voice in general is useful (you can lurk and just go along where you think you will be useful), otherwise its only ever useful when it compliments your immediate goals. Most often for us it does not. I find that using /tells is the most productive, those who respond usually deliver.
  7. Zapon

    I frequently use tells- and you have to find out who who open to responding first- and with 30+ leaders often in our leaders tab- there's no way to really tell ...
    I use it frequently, and recognize a lot of the leaders- and on waterson could recognize most of the Sovereignty's leaders on the leader tab listing- but i'm not going to bug the same ones only, as i dont know who's doing what ops and where- so I have to find out by another method if they are open to working together or assisting

    problem with tells is keeping track in the larger fights- that might be where the custom channels PS2 already provides might be even better....
  8. iccle

    Except in these instances simply inviting a representative from the platoon/outfit/squad you wish to work with into your own voice comms server works 100% better because you are both sharing only the info you both need and not disturbing others whilst doing it and you have a better standard of voice comms quality in general.
  9. Stanis

    The in-game chat channels have a significant barrier to practical use.

    Those of us 'in outfits off doing our own thing' or even those of us that are working with other outfits on 3rd party comms such as teamspeak.

    We have consistency.
    The Squad Leader role is passed around in most outfit squads. Usually for best use of beacon.
    The PL role is both administrator and leader based.

    But typically the people leading platoon and squads for the outfit are NOT the ones acting as liason and comms officers with other outfits.

    The game reliance on SL for SL chat is a breaker.
    At any given time I'm likely to be an SL only slightly more than the next guy - in busy fights it might get passed along 3 times in a single minute.
    (I hate the bug where if PL that is also SL passes along the SL role .. the new SL cant equip a beacon).

    Command chat is something I would entirely revamp.
    100 certs : read /cont command channel
    +100 certs : read /leader global chan
    If you are currently SL you can also send /orders to continent and send to both /cont and /leader channels.

    If you also want to pay :
    +1000 certs permanent /cont send (text)
    +1000 certs permanent /leader send (text)
    +1000 certs /global command orders (text)
    +1000 certs permanent /cont send (voice)
    +1000 certs permanent /leader send (voice)
    +5000 certs CONTVOICE voice broadcast to continent, unlock. 100 certs / week maintenance
    +5000 certs GLOBAL voice broadcast to all players, unlock. 100 certs / week maintenance

    That's a hiearchy. you want global voice broadcast you've invested 15,000 certs.
    Maximum transmission time : 15 seconds every 5 minutes.
    Players will only abuse it once before they get muted.

    That would be a truly useful command structure.
    Another model would be if players could earn the maintenance costs by defenses, captures, xp earnt as SL.
    That means you either play as SL and get useful toys, or buy your way in if your outfit is structured accordingly.

    The ability to send /orders can remain tied to actual SL role.
    The ability to send to /leader can remain tied to SL role.

    But at ALL TIMES I need to be able to HEAR and READ /leader chat. Or it is both much less useful than it could be and detrimental to those of us that want to engage in co-operative play.
    • Up x 1
  10. Pirbi

    It's been so noisy that I've had to type out instructions to new SLs on how to turn it off. That's with everyone on our end being silent. I wouldn't mind if they removed command chat voice coms. /Leader would get more attention if it were the only option. If it's important enough to say over everyone's coms, it's important enough to type out. There are some who try to use it well but then they are met with snark or fart noises.
  11. Ronin Oni

    I don't mute command chat...

    just every ********* that gets it in his head to insult everyone else on CC for not doing what they say.
    • Up x 1
  12. Zapon

    updating the Roadmap topic about this now with links to here

    I fear this would cause the number of leaders using the comms to possibly decrease to less than a handful-

    the other thing- I act as a dedicated leader of randoms, these days- and something like this might only be pursued by Outfit leaders - I feel like that is something we'd want to avoid , as otherwise the squads and platoons that aren't part of outfits may get left out- in the past i've dealt with outfits that consider randoms and the rest of their faction's groups worthless- and i feel like that is something to try to work to prevent.

    15000 cert entry- sounds like that might work.
    I'd do it in a heartbeat

    , but i'm a dedicated leader. Not sure how well others would be up for it-

    snark and fart noises.....sigh...
    And that's how it's left , eh?

    well, this is where cost windows like the one suggested above would work- or at least, sectioning out the different Command abilities.....rather than lump them all in one thing
  13. Pirbi

    I wish that trolling limited a person's ability to obtain certs. But some low BR's are actually easier to work with. I do like the general idea though. I think it should be tied to resource somehow. Using it depletes the resource such that improper use or spammy behaviour would have a cost. Although if a one time cost is too much to obtain, those that obtain it might tend to act even more like self-important brats. You might only get a certain kind of megalomaniac tryhard attempting to obtain it and that might be the last guy you would want to hear from.
  14. Sovereign533

    I didn't know that. Then I hope that SL's will be removed from leadership channel if there is a PL leading them. And that PL's get removed from leadership channel if there is a CL leading them.

    I don't really understand what you meant with this.
  15. Zapon

    So many are adopting 3rd party tools when we need to encourage and improve the in-game comms systems..
  16. Stanis

    Firstly, why would the number of leaders using comms drop ?
    The same abilities as now are available for 200 certs.

    The players that 'buy in' to this would theoretically ALWAYS be present.
    To my mind that might mean a few tryhards or numpties. I remember the early days of CR5 on Werner.
    When there were about 10 of us. We'd fought long and hard to earn that CR5 rank - by leading squads.
    The co-operation between us was amazing.

    We have no sense of that in-game. I believe if a players buys-in with 5000+ certs they're interested.
    They'll contribute. They may be a stabilising force to see several familiar names offering good advice and opinions.

    (There is of course no answer for the bored BR100 with 10,000 certs spare however by then their name and reputation should be well established).

    As for the rest.
    I am an outfit leader. Also heavily involved in setting up and maintaining a faction alliance on my server.
    I don't consider randoms worthless. I sure as hell don't consider the rest of the factions groups (other outfits) that way.

    That said quite understand why a random or outfitless player would be running platoons and wanting to 'work together'. The first step on the road to co-operation seems to be an outfit.
    Outfits running open platoons seems to be the norm. Their strategic decisions (which you reference as some outfits considering them useless) must be considered in terms of their purpose and sense of fun.

    What is important is that I recognise we all have a different sense of fun and goals from the game.
    One of the long term reasons for our alliance success is that we welcome those outfits that want to work with others.
    Simple as that - outfits that want to work with other outfits.
    Outfits that want to work with other outfits, that are also running open platoons play a vital role.
    Some may be elitist and called them zergfits. Or disdain the fact they move blobs of troops around the map.

    However the tactical units might struggle to exist in an environment without them.
    There is a place for organised platoons, open platoons and more tactical squads.

    Importantly this effort to make /leader a functioning place is predicated on the SLs wanting to achieve some goal.
    An SL that has been handed SL just to put a fresh beacon down IS NOT working towards co-operation or a goal.
    • Up x 1
  17. Zapon

    Regarding the cost levels - , I suspect that some would only go for the beginning levels- and thus one might see - even less usage of the higher abilities than expected

    i have encountered varying degrees of feelings in the past of how effective non- Outfit groups can be, and that was one of the main reasons for me deciding to continue to do what i did in MAG, and lead - except this time i would lead "random" Platoons whenever I could , and work to encourage them to coordinate more than was occurring at the time. I've had varied success over the past year and a half plus...
    I honestly think that Leaders with views like yours are what will end up having the biggest impact on the game.
    So, I think you were meaning to say you don't quite understand why - Well, I'm such a player(although I have not always been outfitless- I was part of a few early on near game launch). - I do/did it to show they can be effective-
    and so on.
    As time went on, more Outfit Open platoons started to appear, I will note.

    By useless- i've run into Outfits that did not have faith in non-outfit members.
    I do feel I have a good idea of why they feel that way- and that's perfectly fine. If anything, if they weren't running things the way they are- they wouldn't be enjoying the game as much- and then there is not much point.
  18. Sovereign533

    With us, the third party tools already existed since we're a multi gaming community. We didn't adopt it, we used what we already had. And since we also play other games together it's better to have 1 single voice coms then multiple.

    This would be solved by removing lower leaders from the leadership channel. And it would work especially well if mapside for PL's and CL's would bring more certs.
  19. Zapon

    Mapside does need to bring certs in several ways- but removing SL's from leadership - i dont know, as some full squads often do help out Platoons

    of ocurse, once companies show up, you could respond that they can just join a platoon- but some won't want to, and will want to run things their own way(not many, true, and this is a good thing) - and then theres the second issue

    if you havea full company of 192, the squad is out of luck!!

    Also, not sure how those changes would help bring people to the in game comms-

    i see what you mean, though
  20. Sovereign533

    No, I mean that if there is a Platoon Leader the Squad Leader doesn't need to coordinate to squads outside the platoon anymore. The Platoon Leader is (or should be) there for coordination.
    Within a platoon the SL really only needs to communicate between his squad members and the Platoon Leader. The Squad Leader will still talk within the platoon to the PL. But communicating with the rest of the NC shouldn't be the SL's role anymore.