[Suggestion] Spitfire - wrong slot?

Discussion in 'Engineer' started by DemonicTreerat, Mar 14, 2017.

  1. DemonicTreerat

    Playing around with my engineer again I was struck by how different the Spitfire is from its "brethren" the MANA turrets. In fact it functions more as combination of motion sensor & mine that trades off the potential for a one-hit kill(s) for greater staying power. Perhaps part of the "Spitty's" problem is that its frankly in the wrong slot?

    Move the Spitfire to the utility slot, give it a nanite cost comparable to mines, and allow engineers to deploy multiple of them within a relatively small area (maybe 10m minimum). Certing further into the turret increases the number that can be carried and deployed at once. Replace the missing turret (if desired) with a light AA turret (single barrel burster) or a light artillery turret (basically a Bulldog with slower reload and more range).

    Upside. During longer defenses we don't have to worry about running out of "mines" quite so fast or having to choose between bring a "Spitty" to watch a door or a turret. Plus better ability to have "eyes" on multiple points (but not as capable as an Infiltrator's motion spotter).
    Downside. No mines or C4 with translates into less potential for mass-kills and less vehicle potential. Not to mention no med kits at all.
  2. Eternaloptimist

    Can't say as I would take Spits instead of mines myself...................

    I'd prefer an option of an AA mana turret I can use myself.
  3. TR5L4Y3R

    no, they are in the right spot .. because then it would be turret and turret instead of turret and a one off to secure an area .. spitfires also already have a nanitecost on them .. deploying even multiple of those would be ... frankly overkill .. because in that case JUST one person would be like 3 or 4 .. say 2 or 3 spitfires and the engineers own manaturret .. and imagine 2 or 3 more engineers to do that ... just NO!

    that or give both manaturrets a high pitch ..
  4. DemonicTreerat

    First, please. Learn basic grammar. Capitalization, single periods, etc. Even 1st graders do a better job. Second. Invalid. Just because something is called a turret does not mean it belongs among others. Using that "logic" infiltrators motion spotters would use the utility slot as they're nothing more than "mines" that "damage" people by automatically spotting them. Plus both the other options for that slot are manned while the spitfire is automated with a mechanic akin to mines (limited number that need to be resupplied by a terminal). And if they do have a nanite cost that just strengthens my case as it shows that Daybreak considers them similar to mines. Finally if you had ever set foot in PS1 you would know that Spitfires there had exactly the same mechanics for deployment as mines and worked just fine as such. In other words great for killing idiots who rushed in thinking they're Rambo, so-so if the other guy had a bit of a brain, and prime targets for EMP blasts or EMP grenades (hint: EMP grenades here are the PS1 CR3 EMP blast).
    • Up x 1
  5. TR5L4Y3R

    the way i write is simply my style on the internet as i don't care about correct capitalisation or punctuation ... just spelling .. feel free to critique it .. i don't realy care or just deal with it ..

    as for what you say about the spitfire while it is unmanned it's still an item to last unlike mines, c4 or medikits .. and we eventualy get hardlightbarriers which also are there to stand longer than just be used/triggered once ... that's a major difference and that's why i disagree with it being in a utility slot and again because of the example i gave ..

    also just because ps1 was a certain way doens't have to mean it was neccesarily a good idea ... if so then why didn't they do it that way in the first place .. which imo means that they had clear ballance concerns on that to go the route they did with its implementation in ps 2 .. now you speak about emp .. in ps2, the only class that has access to emp are infiltrators and no one else the default grenade of each class are frags and they are simply not as effective in tacking out mines or deployables in a broad area ... meaning if i want to clear a whole room or entry filled with spitfires and mines and stuff i would have to rely on a infil being close by which is not often the case ..
  6. LordKrelas

    I can only imagine the horror of facing a hand full of near-hitscan spitfires guarding an entire cap room, while a single engineer afk's behind one.

    Hoping an Infil has an EMP, that doesn't wipe allied shields & HUDs, just to enter the meat grinder.. made from 1 guy.
    A whole squad of engineers?
    Ever dream of an automated firing line, I certainly do! And it's in my nightmares as well!



    But two at max rank, wouldn't be one-man-army engineers?
    I think?

    However, I'd hate to lose my anti-infantry and anti-tank mines, just to place a spitfire.
    Since land mines, and spits go together really nice in a defensive line.
    • Up x 1
  7. DemonicTreerat

    Sure it would be nasty. If someone was stupid enough that their entire concept of "tactics" is rush in hoping to kill whoever is there first. Now if the bag of tricks includes bring some sort of information-gathering ability (xbow with detect bolts, an infil, or just peeking through a window for a second or two with a scope) and something to clear out entrenched defenders (grenades or C4 tossed through a door or window, heavies willing to play peekaboo with rocket launchers, etc) I bet it would be far less dangerous a task. Certainly no more dangerous than having to clear out a room full of heavies. And in those cases were someone doesn't have any of those options (due to say an overemphasis on kills). Well isn't that sort of the point of having multiple engineers when defending something? That they can put down enough nasty stuff that those who refuse to bring counters are going to have to pay a high price for their lack of flexibility and foresight.
  8. LordKrelas

    You ever just walk into a room?
    How about in the middle of combat, move a inch to the side: That's enough for a spitfire to unload into you, with no time.

    Let alone if you are defending a base, and have to quickly engage..
    Let alone if One spit noticed you, there is no time to quick peek, throw an emp if you have one, and slowly walk in.
    Either an infantryman is going to be ready for you, or a dozen are, rather than getting the drop of them.

    IE Attackers use the bloody things too. And the actual Defenders, don't have the benefit of time, in those cases.

    And yes it is actually Harder.
    It doesn't die as fast as heavies whom have a reaction time, miss, and die easier to a normal grenade.
    You also can get the drop on a heavy, One spit is barely ever a problem.
    Two means, you have to take the damage: You can't blast two apart, you can destroy one in an instant, and that is it.
    That means an entire reload for either the RL if you have one, or your primary.

    Like I said, two wouldn't be all that bad possibly per engineer.
    But more than two is certainly.
    3 is enough to kill before you can even unload a mag, and is more than any class's load out allows to destroy at once.
    Unless you happen to get in range for C-4, to hit one, and still have the time or health to destroy that one Engineer's set of Spits.

    There is flexibility. And then there is being able as a single person, place enough spitfires to kill infantry whom can not survive long enough to one single person's spitfires due to the sheer accuracy multiplied.
    After all, You don't place spits side-by-side, so not even grenades could hit them all.

    Add in two bloody engineers, and that is a ton of AP mines, Tank mines, & spitfires.
    Originally, that's two spitfires.
    If each had 3, that's a total of 6, which means enough to take down 2-6 people isn't it, and that doesn't count the two engineers.
    Nor anyone else in that battle.

    That's an entire automated firing line, capable of downright slaughter, place-able on rooftops as well, that is fully automated.
    No down time.
    Can't miss unless not facing the target.
    Can't be surprised.
    And takes a Rocket, a lot of a clip, high explosives, or an Infil with an EMP.
    They are horrid on their own, yes, but even two might be pushing the line between useful and too useful.

    As a single engineer capable of rivaling a squad's firepower without needing to even be near? Dear Lord.
  9. VhynSeven

    Mutiples Spitfires ? Hell no !
    2 Spitfires + 1 Engy throw far more DPS than any weapon in the game. The only reliable way to kill an Engy would be either a long-range headshot, or a close-range pump-action shotgun burst. Now imagine 2-3 Engineers putting all their Spitfires in the same area...

    That doesn't mean that Spitfire is OK as it stands. But increasing the number of placable Spitfires is definitively a bad idea. The only buff it needs is as follow : it should works like other deployables. Which means, carrying an infinite amount of Spitfires, and placing a new one will make the previous one disappear, just like the MANA Turret and the Barrier.
  10. OldMaster80

    Naaa... I feel ok when I have 4 Spitties. In the end thereis always a terminal where to resupply if needed.
    If thereis one thing wrong with the Spitfire is the reaction time. It is so slow.... I often try to set a defensive perimeter but enemies mostly destroy Spitty before it can deal any damage.

    The only places where it can be useful are on top of grav lifters and jump pads because enemies need a little time to realize from where they're being hit.
    • Up x 1
  11. VhynSeven

    I might sound a bit stingy, but 4 Spitfires means 2400 certs, I'd rather spend those 1400 certs somewhere else (like in a Lightning/Sundy). No offense to you, I'm just a low-rank Engineer trying to save as much certs as I can ;)
  12. OldMaster80

    I agree. The Spitfire is definitely one of the last things you want to unlock. Better use AI mines and the old good MANA turret.

    Even the deployable barrier is better than Spitty.