(Speculation) How I can tell that over the years, the age of PS2 players has lowered (a lot).

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Rooklie, Jan 24, 2020.

  1. Rooklie

    And without having access to statistics.

    Are you ready? 1..2.. 3 here goes :

    1

    When my sister was a baby, or rather, just a little older than the age you're at when you're a baby, she really used to make me laugh.

    She would sit underneath the kitchen table, on the floor, with a couple of couple clothe pegs of different colours, and I swear to god, she would sit there all afternoon playing on her own as happy as could be. She'd give each of them names and then do voice overs as she pressed on the extremities and opened and shut them.

    She doesn't do that anymore.

    You know why?

    She grew up.


    _____

    2

    When you're a kid, what adults find interesting is incredibly boring. Adults like boring stuff, like museums, like literature, like architecture, like gardening, there's lots of adults who don't like those things, but whatever it is they like, one of the essential aspects of it, is meaning. Same goes for entertainment, they usually look for stuff that has more depth, more meaning, maybe more realism.

    What adults do not like, and find boring, is stuff that has no meaning, or makes no sense. (there are exceptions of course, but I won't get into that now).

    And the opposite is true. No adult in their right mind could sit under a kitchen table with a couple clothes pegs and spend the afternoon doing voice overs.

    But as you grow up and turn into an adult, what you call "fun" changes and if nothing is stopping Grandpa or Dad from being immature, silly, or childish, as a general rule, as you grow, you will find that if whatever it is you do is mindless, has no point in it, makes no sense, you might enjoy it, but not for long, not nearly as long as some years ago when you were a kid.

    _________

    3

    In the 7 years I have played this game, I have noticed a significant **** in player interest. In the beginning, everyone 3or almost everyone was objective oriented, and even if the PS2 war never ended, and so, ultimately was pointless, there were still many things that gave meaning to players and kept them busy for hours and hours.

    Today this has swung to the other side, and everyone, or almost everyone couldn't care less about the objectives. (although, they all try hard as hell to cap the A point back even though they don't care if they lose or take the base or not).

    I tried to understand this, and managed to, by looking at what was happening from different angles. Ultimately, it was the responsibility of the devs who, through their work, inspired players, or not. There are other angles too, but this one is new !

    ____

    Here we go :


    The average age of players in PS2 has gone down over the years. I can tell, because, as mentioned above, they are perfectly happy playing with clothes pegs under the kitchen table.
  2. icufos

    Felt you deserved a reply for the obvious effort made.
    Feel your logic is flawed a tad.
    Reasons set out below.
    1. I do detect a certain level of grumpiness on this forum. Grumpiness and whinging set in during the late 30's.
    2. The standard of articulation is high on this forum. Again late 30's.
    3. Alot of good snipers in the game itself. Over 30's are the only one's with the patience to sit on their a*** for ages waiting for that kill.
    4. I myself am 66 going on 67 and very grumpy indeed. I am articutate but unfortunately can't spoll. sorry spell. Nothing gives me more pleasure than to 'pop the socks' clean off that 100+ player after sitting on my a*** for hours.

    I ;) rest my case.
    • Up x 5
  3. Demigan

    You apparently arent old enough. While I do enjoy some meaning, I also specifically look for things with a lack of meaning whenever my life as too much meaningful things in them. At those times I enjoy a game of mindlessly murdering the Demons of Hell in Doom, random policechases and killingsprees in GTA or a nice almost mindless large fight in PS2. The meanings I give it are my own during a game. Do I want to spend time perfecting a jump on a random ramp in a game? Its meaningless for the goals the game has set but I give it meaning. Or do I set myself the goal of holding a spire ln a techplant so people can spawn there? Or do I try a mindless push towards the point, and let my allies do the thinking and use my actions so they can flank an enemy?

    Or do I grab the cloth pegs and act like they can talk to the dog in order to entertain myself, pretty close to your baby sister? As an adult its up to me when and where I do something and how much meaning it has. And meaning changes depending on who I'm with, how I feel and what I'm doing.

    So I can't tell if the age has gone up or down. The older generation complains about the younger generation and the younger about the older while the young adolecents rage against everything and everyone.
  4. Rooklie


    I was focusing on ingame players!

    As to other points, I don't dispute them, there always will be exceptions, I was trying to cover "all the players" and you if you do see a couple snipers high up on the hills waiting for hours, and if many of them are "adults", I still think the vast majority can be described in the way I described them.

    There's lots more exceptions in real life too, but in general, you won't find many adults underneath the kitchen table playing with clothe pegs for hours ;)

    Thanks for replying and ... (with humour) and ...

    Case dismissed !
  5. Rooklie


    Why do you say "apparently you're not old enough?".

    Anyway, like I said in my OP, there are exceptions, and if not all adults enjoy going to the museum, or gardening, most certainly don't enjoy doing anything that has no point.

    As a child also. And children tend to find meaning in things that for adults, have no meaning. Doom is a good example, as a general rule, many FPS are good example, and the older you get, the less time you'll spend mindlessly shooting demons or whatever.

    To simplify the argument, cause I know you have a tendency of over complicating everything, think of any game, made for kids. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by kids.

    Now, (step 2) think of a game for adults, something more mature, something kids might not enjoy as much, but something mainly would. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by adults.

    Lastly (step 3). Compare both games.

    There is simply no denying it, it's like I were saying "look a big tree and next to it, a small tree". It's a fact. People who dispute facts, usually (not always) but usually just want to dispute, no matter the topic.
  6. Demigan

    I say you arent old enough because you dont seem to realize that not everyone thinks the same at certain ages, and that meaning changes from person to person and even moment to moment rather than based on age.

    As a child, what games do you think I played? Well Doom was one, and Half-Life, and Unreal Tournament, just about every GTA entry including the 2D games, Renegade, most of the C&C univerde, but also Torin's Passage, Rollcage, half a dozen versions of Mario, Super Smash melee, Prince of Persia, 2D platformers In cant even remember.
    And I'm still playing them, some of the old versions and some the new versions. And the meanings are still there. I played Doom to blow Demons apart and to try and win the game. As I write that I realize that I play Doom with less meaning than before as completing the game isnt an issue anymore and its more the ride of increasing Demons to rip apart in a much larger selection of ways that makes me come back. I still play various versions of UT, C&C, predecessors of old games like Rollcage and Renegade now exist that I play.

    The meanings behind it arent that different. I'll play something like The Last Of Us when I feel the need for something meaningful (as in "heavy story elements" meaningful). But I'll just as happily play something supposedly meaningless or break from the "meaningful" parts of the game and give meaning to something else.

    All that just to illustrate to you: meaning is subjective and it changes. You act like the meaning you find is the most pristine and holy of meanings to attain (I often do too but hey hypocrisy is a human trait) so I have to say: apparently you havent had the life experience to realize that meaning isnt set in stone. Just the fact that someone can find enough meaning in a video game to complain about some of the players can absolutely mindboggling to some people who cant even see the meaning behind videogames period!
  7. Rooklie



    what about this?

    __________
    To simplify the argument, cause I know you have a tendency of over complicating everything, think of any game, made for kids. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by kids.

    Now, (step 2) think of a game for adults, something more mature, something kids might not enjoy as much, but something mainly would. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by adults.

    Lastly (step 3). Compare both games.
    __________________


    You didn't like that? you ignored it completly. It's a shame, cause it's a very simple illustration that shows what is a very simple truth : the interest in having fun and gaming and entertainment of kids is not at all (NOT AT ALL) the same for adults. And one specific illustration of this FACT is that adults need more than pointless entertainment.

    (think of driving a car, any kid, if you put him in front of the wheel, hes gona be like "omg omg omg omg IM DRIVING THIS IS SOOO COOL, but most adults couldn't care less, in fact, if they had the money, they'd buy a chaufeur)
  8. OpolE

    Well durrrrrrrrrrrr. They made PS2 to cater to COD kiddies with the typical mums that buy them anything crap.

    Come to Planetside 1. We have older veterans who have input to the game
    • Up x 1
  9. Demigan

    I didnt ignore it, I told you what games I played when I was a kid.

    But I suppose you are talking about when you are even younger and still developing your brain and what interests you are things that help develop that brain. For example the act of playing with cloth pegs and acting like they can talk is an active way of replicating social interactions. Your little sister was training herself to be social. Pretty meaningful, a lot more meaningful than most things adults do.

    The reason a kid gets excited about driving a car is that it is a new experience and it is about controlling something large and impressive for them. But that very same kid was equally excited about learning how to cycle, yet it'll display the same boredom about cycling to school even before they have reached adolesence. Strange isnt is that the child is able to display the exact same boredom as an adult. If you learned a kid to drive a car to school (for arguments sake with a complete Google driver assisting) since they are young, they will display that same boredom at the ages you say they should display only excitement.

    Do children think different than adults? Yes of course! Until the age of around 20 to 22 your brain is still developing! (And if I would guess you havent reached that milestone yet). This is reflected in their decision making, lack of experience or not being able to understand certain concepts as well yet.
    But to say that a child's interest is purely meaningless? Thats just bad. Or that all adults only seek meaningful things, even though what an adult finds meaningful or if they even want meaningful is completely subjective and changes on a person per person, day by day basis.
  10. Rooklie


    ah ok, you mis understood then :)

    I wasn't talking about you when you were a kid. Bridge is the kind of card game that adults like, not kids, chess is the kind of board game tha adults like, not kids. If you, as a kid, like bridge and chess, that's awesome, but it's irrelevant.

    I'll say (copy paste) it again !



    __________
    To simplify the argument, cause I know you have a tendency of over complicating everything, think of any game, made for kids. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by kids.

    Now, (step 2) think of a game for adults, something more mature, something kids might not enjoy as much, but something mainly would. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by adults.

    Lastly (step 3). Compare both games.
    __________________



    Or, in other words, close your eyes, and think of a a TV show for kids. Next, think of a TV show for adults.

    Or, in other word, "mature" entertainment isn't only about sex and swear words :)
  11. Demigan

    "like" and "meaning" are different things.

    Also if we look at your complaint it's actually a symptom of the gameplay. It doesn't reward playing the objective, capturing the continents. Capturing a base is a good way to kill a fight as some defenders leave and the next base will be easier. Capturing continents isn't even rewarded with something permanent you can show off most of the time, it's just a temporary thing.

    This breeds a player that doesn't care about the objective regardless of age or meaning. If you want to solve your problem, rather than rant about it and insult most of the playerbase, then you should be looking at improving the gameplay, rewards and how players naturally set their own objectives.
  12. Rooklie



    Hey, if you're gona ignore anything I say, I'll ignore anything you say, and then, we can have fun ignoring whatever we say and writing big walls of text for no other reason than what some would call "mental masturbation" ;)
  13. Demigan

    I'm not ignoring anything you say, in fact I give a good reply to your core points. I even went back to your first post and explained what the problem you are seeing is coming from. But if you prefer mental mastrubation instead of a good argument then so be it.
  14. Rooklie





    Laaa deeee daaa, don't mind me, I'm just repeating myself :)



    __________
    To simplify the argument, cause I know you have a tendency of over complicating everything, think of any game, made for kids. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by kids.

    Now, (step 2) think of a game for adults, something more mature, something kids might not enjoy as much, but something mainly would. Something which, everyone would agree, is made for and loved by adults.

    Lastly (step 3). Compare both games.
    __________________
  15. Demigan

    My point is that this isnt about the differences between what a child enjoys and what an adult enjoys. This is purely about how the game teaches players to play the game itself. I can envision any number of games for any number of ages (and actually have done so to help develop card and board games that teach or maintain skills for specific ages. Though predominantly for geriatrics it had some for children.), but the reasons these games are played have nothing to do with the WAY players play PS2 currently.

    Do you understand that?
  16. Rooklie


    Hey, if you're gona ignore anything I say, I'll ignore anything you say, and then, we can have fun ignoring whatever we say and writing big walls of text for no other reason than what some would call "mental masturbation" ;)
  17. Demigan

    So the guy who is complaining that according to him the average age is so low is resorting to this... Gee I wonder if the word "hypocrite" means anything to you?
  18. Rooklie



    geee wizzz !
  19. ican'taim

    16 year old here, and I'd love to be an objective player if I actually knew what the objective for my faction is, like "capture x facility" and whatnot.

    I wasn't in the game when /orders was around, but from what I've heard it's PERFECT for players like me.
    (don't use mic, not in squad/outfit, etc)
    • Up x 1
  20. Rooklie

    I'm like you, I solo, but I cooperate with my entire faction.

    btw, when I say people do stuff that has no meaning, makes no sense, it's just an expression, cause even when my sister played with clothe pegs under the kitchen table, that had meaning for her, made sense for her.

    Basically it's a matter of degree, you could find meaning in what you do whether you spend 2 hours throwing a tennis ball at a wall (like training your skills) but there's a lot more things that have a lot more meaning than that, or, maybe a better way of saying it, more than one meaning.

    At the end of the day though, in a PvP game, winning the game, whether it's ping pong or an Alert on Indar, that -to me- couldn't ever have less meaning than spending 4 hours in a biolab.
    • Up x 1

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