Something I don't understand about NC MAX's

It does, however, leave certed NC maxes at a massive advantage over enemy stock maxes. TR and VS have nothing that can compare to the raw burst scattermaxes can dish out. It's a dilemma: Do you allow NC maxes to gib enemy maxes within a single clip? (OP) Or do they have to reload to finish the job? (UP)

Again no it doesn't, that's a silly comparrison, a standard NC AI MAX will LOSE to a fully certed TR/VS AI MAX as well!


Fully certed MAX vs Fully certed MAX (with Kinetic Armour 5) only the Grinder has enough damage per clip (or per 2 clips) to kill a TR or VS AI MAX without a reload (the NC AI MAX dies to the TR/VS AI MAX in the reload if it doesn't have Grinders).

And TTK vs infantry with fully certed MAXs still remains functionally the same for NC and TR/VS MAX, only TR/VS MAXs carry range with that 0m TTK and the NC AI MAXs don't.






Which is the problem.

NC draw with TR/VS in 0-10m TTK vs infantry.
NC lose with TR/VS in 10+M TTK vs infantry.

NC lose with AI MAX vs AI MAX with 3 out of 4 weapons with standard MAXs.
NC lose with AI MAX vs AI MAX with 3 out of 4 weapons if both MAXs have Kinetic Armour 5 and extended mags.


Basically the NC aren't better vs infantry at any range at all, and only are better AI MAX vs AI MAX with semi-upgraded MAXs or Grinders.

You're missing the point. A fully certed TR/VS max will win over any enemy stock max, but NC maxes absolutely demolish stock maxes (they charge into your face and you're dead).
And as I said, NC maxes play around burst while TR/VS are more about sustained damage output.

Er.. no.

Standard NC AI MAXs cannot win vs standard TR/VS AI MAXs without a reload unless they have Grinders.

They need 2x extended mags to have enough damage per clip to beat standard TR/VS AI MAXs without a reload (the NC AI MAXs die in the reloads).

They do not "demolish" anything! (they did, but there have been 2 lots of blanket nerfs since those days)

Infantry-wise TR/VS TTK difference is 0.3 seconds (bearing human reaction time, lag and most importantly clientside hit detection in mind), this is functionally the same as NO DIFFERENCE.

NC AI MAXs have no burst advantage at 0m vs Infantry, but they have a significant range disadvantage.


Again vs AI MAXs it's more complex, but again the NC AI MAXs comes out below the TR/VS AI MAXs with 3 out of 4 weapons.

You do know that's exactly what they did since launch, right? Hell, some people STILL complain that NC MAX is entirely OP.

NC Standard vs TR/VS Standard = TR/VS win with 3 out of 4 NC weapons.

NC Standard vs TR/VS fully upgraded = TR/VS wins against all weapons.

NC fully upgraded vs TR/VS Standard = NC wins with all weapon.

NC fully upgrades vs TR/VS fully upgraded = TR/VS win with 3 out of 4 NC weapons.



It doens't matter how you cut it NC AI MAXs come out the overall losers by quite a margin.

If VS and TR get an upclose personal weapon like the flamethrower, NC has to get something better ranged. I had flame throwers during beta, and they worked just as well as Scat Maxes...except you had more grief because of the flames.

Sure, buff their accuracy but reduce the damage by 80 % or more then.

You clearly didn't read a thing I typed. I wasn't out in the open, I was at the bottom of a Tech Plant, defending. I was within 10m, alone and face to face with a VS ZOE MAX which should be an ideal situation for an NC MAX to be in (little did I know that a KA5 MAX will live through an extended magged Mattock). I shielded up while it started firing, I moved closer while absorbing the damage hoping that I could exhaust most of its clip or even better, get the jump during their reload. It burned through my shield so when it dropped, I opened up with my Mattocks and gave it both barrels. It didn't die before I had to reload and my shield had yet to recharge. It killed me.

Looking at my current killboard, it got me with a Nebula. Not even a high capacity magazine weapon.

The best fix for current NC MAX weapons is to add more pellets in a tighter spread. Considering that each cannon has 3 shotguns each that should be viable.

Or Dual Gauss SAWs. Refund all NC MAX AI weapons, remove them from the game and give us Dual Gauss SAWs.

Gotta agree with this.
Make the slugs more accurate and it wont be a problem.

then they would be even more useless than they already are.

I got chased around a base by an NC MAX I assume was using shotgun slugs while I was in a ZOE MAX. He was hurting me from pretty good range, but not enough concentrated firepower to take me down. In all fairness, I doubt a TR MAX would have been able to take me down much better, as I was spending most of my time bobbing and weaving to evade the guys chasing me.

Another way of putting it is that NC max has one weapon that will beat 4/4 TR/VS weapons at close range. . . = NC wins all the time

Except the Grinder isn't the most accurate and doesn't have the fastest TTK, it is just the only one that competes with other TR/VS AI MAX weapons AI MAX vs AI MAX because of damage per clip.


So basically you're saying it's "wrong" for the NC AI MAX to haveONE weapon that wins AI MAX vs AI MAX?


With forumside bias like that isn't no wonder the NC AI MAX is in the state it is in.

If he was using slugs then the problem with slugs is this.

All they do is front load the damage into one lump for a DPS nerf, they don't change the CoF.
What this actually does is extend effective range a bit (over pellets), but only where the target fills a significant part of the CoF.


This only works because on average some pellets will miss a target past a certain range.

However slugs (because they collect all their damage into 1 slug) become much more hit and miss with range (because of this I actually wonder mathmatically if past a certain range pellets don't do more average DPS again - where slug total miss rate outweighs the pellets spread).



Now slugs will always do damage at range, because when they hit they are carrying a decent bit of damage, but they are basically extremely low ammo, but very hard hitting "LMGs" with HUGE CoFs.

Which basically makes them much weaker versions of any TR/VS AI weapon arm.



Slugs in normal shotguns work very well because people can ADS which effectively makes them much more accurate.
NC AI MAXs cannot ADS, so really should have a CoF reduction when using slugs to make them genuinely competative.

yes I know, I was going for facetious ...

Then I want the PS1 VS max.

Then you simply were outplayed.