All mines have the same range. What is different is the blast origin. For VS and NC the mines sit in the center, for TR they sit in a circumference. Also the damage is different. The TR mines are stronger than the VS and NC ones.
I've been mentioning this since day 1 but still I've only ever seen about 3 Claymores used correctly (like a Claymore not a pressure-plate mine). NC and VS mines are traditional in that triggering them simply causes a blast with a few-meter radius (it has inner and out radii with different damage values). The TR "Claymore" is quite visible because it's not supposed to be stepped on but stepped in front of - and it's blast is a cone shape from the front (like a real Claymore). So place NC/VS mines IN the the door way: --- o --- Place TR Claymores behind the wall firing across the entrance: --<- ---- Now when your enemies come to the doorway they cannot see the mine because it's behind the wall. It triggers when they walk through. Or place it on a landing so that it blows the face off the first people to come up the steps - this is how a TR Infil. successfully killed a few of us last week. The Claymore is potentially better because the cone can easily hit a few people at once, but it requires more thought in placement.
I would agree with you 100% if those damn lasers didn't show up. They don't always show up but it's silly that they sometimes do.
Unless I'm miss reading your post, I'm afraid what you say isn't entirely accurate. If claymores sat on the circumference (a.k.a. the outside of the circle) their blast would look like this: Needless to say it doesn't. It looks like you'd expect, like this: In other words all mines sit in the centre. The difference is the shape of the blast. Bouncing betty's & proxy mines are a full circle while claymores are a quarter of a circle. Claymores will OHK a target without flak up to 4m while bouncing betty's & proxy mines will OHK up to 2m. Therefore we can say that claymores have an internal blast radius of 4m while the other two have an internal blast radius of 2m. This in turns gives all AI mines an identical internal area of effect ((pi * 4^2) / 4 = pi * 2^2) and technically the same range due to bouncing betty's & proxy mines being omnidirectional although claymores, due to their directional nature, do have greater range in a single direction. In regards to claymores doing more damage, do you have a source for that? All the tests that I've seen and done myself suggest that all AI mines do the same damage. As I said previously claymores will OHK a target without flak up to 4m while bouncing betty's & proxy mines will OHK up to 2m. At 5m for claymores and 3m for the other two, the target will be left with about 6.5 bars of health. However using flak 5 and standing 1m from the mine, all AI mines will leave the target with just under 15 bars of health. From this we can conclude that all AI mines do in fact do the same damage the only difference is the radius of the explosion. To make sure these figures aren't outdated I've just been on live testing the three AI mines.
The circle of the NC & VS mine is 2m in radius. Apart from that your shape of a quarter of a pie is in line with the TR mines. The area they cover is about the same for all mines. The damage is different.
nah, they fall under the floor. i regularly see friendly tank mine icons on roads hovering over nothing.
I have almost 500 kills with the Claymore and I really have to question the blast radius. I honestly do not ever remember a double kill.
That's what I said although to be exact the internal area of effect is identical, there is no "about". I'm sure I don't need to explain to you how to calculate the area of effect but for those that are wondering: The formula to calculate the area of a circle is pi * r^2. r being the radius. Bouncy Betty & Proximity mines r = 2 Internal area of effect = pi * 2^2 = 12.57 Claymore r = 4 pi * 4^2 = 50.27 As the blast from a claymore is a quarter of a circle you then divide that by four Internal area of effect = 50.27 / 4 = 12.57 *Numbers have been rounded to two decimal places. As I said, do you have a source for that? Because it goes against all the tests that I've seen carried out by other people and done myself. I won't quote myself but you can see the figures in my previous post, figures that I'm afraid don't support claymores doing extra damage.
With flak armor 4 (one before maximum), the NC mine takes my full shield and 30% of my life. With the same flak armor the TR mine takes my full shield and 50% and my life. With this flak armor I can survive two NC mines (assuming I let my shield replenish) and die on the third. Against TR, I survive the first and die on the second.
Only 500, you light weight If you wish to test the blast radius of claymores the simple way to do it is to unequip flak if you have it. Set a way point and drop the claymore on it. Stand 4m in front of it and shoot it until it explodes. The blast should kill you. Now repeat the above procedure but this time stand 5m in front of it. The blast should leave you with about 6.5 bars of health. This simple test, if done correctly, should demonstrate that claymores do have an internal radius of 4m. However with that said, due to the more visible nature of claymores it's less likely that the enemy will be running strait towards the centre of the blast than it is with bouncing betty's & proxy mines. Interesting, are you taking into account the claymores increased radius? I ask because if you use flak 5 and stand 1m away all AI mines will leave you with just under 15 bars of health which means that at point blank they must all do the exact same damage. However the claymores increased radius, and subsequent lower damage falloff, would account for the disparity you are seeing.
Ever deploy a mana turret on top of a friendly AI mine? I noticed that people like to knife my turrets after they kill me, +1 to their knife kills. So I decided one day that I was going to drop a mine then put my turret on it so it kills him instead.. You can submit your bug reports now, I already did.
Potentially better does not translate into actually being better. I use them A LOT and good players look for them and easily take them out. Yeah, I put them behind the door jam on the inside; in fact I try to put them a little further away from the door so they are ven harder see . However you are now giving up some coverage of the door way so if they come in on the far side away from it they wont even set it off. If you don't do that though then can just look around from the outside into the room and find them. Try it out; drop one down behind the door jam as you said you should. Go outside and try to find it without even going into the threshold... you'll easily see it. Only reason you get ANY kills with them is 9/10 people just aren't looking. We agree; you have to try harder with them and try to hide them. Lets continue with the door example. Half the things you are trying to protect have more than two door ways to get there. Unless you are heavily certed up with claymores and pouch you only have 2. Ideally you'd like to cover all the doorways like this, and sometimes you can, but often not. Contrast to the omnidirectional AP mines that don't properly render anyways. Just drop them on the top of the stairs.... or right by the generator where they SHOULD be esily noticed but they aren't... You don't even have to try and hide them and can more effectively cover an objective with them. In conclusion the claymore is less effective. I still use them A LOT but most of them either get taken out by situationally aware players or by damn grenades because that's what people throw through doorways =P
Yes, the claymore can be situationally superior. I still see no reason why the TR should have a monopoly on directional mines and be prohibited from having omnidirectional mines. That is unfair to TR who want the simplicity of omni mines and unfair to NC/VS who want to take advantage of directional explosives. I still think that claymores should be made common pool and the TR should get a new omnidirectional mine.
Just to clear things up: claymores don't have a radius. It has a range, and that range is non-spherical. If they had a radius by definition they'd be omnidirectional.
I see where you're coming from but I'm afraid that's not actually true. While it may seem odd, a circle does not in fact have to be a full circle. In regards to claymores the blast is a quarter circle and quarter circles do indeed have a radius.
Kills/hr is: Proximity 196 ~ Betty 191 > Claymore 166. SPM is: Betty 23860 ~ Proximity 22151 > Claymore 17796 So yes, data bears out the idea that Claymores are less effective.
But I would hazard to guess a huge part of that is clueless people using them poorly. What % difference that is I can't tell you but I can say people do NOT use them correctly. They try to use the claymore like it is a Prox or BouncBet and that simply doesnt work AND WILL get you less SPM
If you are talking about the facing of the claymore, we could also add that they are hard to place correctly at the right angle and often flip/tip the wrong direction. In any case, the other two are much easier to deploy and use... ...and they get more kills... so I'd rate them as more effective weapons.
nc and vs mines can be throwed like frisbees, even just decloaking, throwing them in a group of people and going back for more works claymores are just up
