[Suggestion] Slight Buff to the T32 Bull

Increasing fire-rate to 698, and done. I would keep all other stats, since the only thing that motivates players now and then was fire rate. The Rhino won't seem like a straight up upgrade to the Bull for an even cheaper price. Keep accuracy and damage model, since it shouldn't be enough to throw balance off the tables.

It's still mediocre, but sucks less it would seem. Pre-cert inflation price would be 500/750 cert points. Post-inflation would be 625.

just be like ever TR and use the stock T9carv, the MSWR, or the MCG - all the other LMGs including the Butcher are absolute piss. #Torq the Rhino!

How is the Rhino an upgraded Bull? I think you've got that backwards.

I like the Bull as it is. It has low damage, but the pay-off is ridiculously easy headshots. It has next to no vertical recoil, and its horizontal is very low as well. Having no vertical recoil and even horizontal means you put the crosshair on their head, and pull the trigger. If you don't headshot with this gun, you're doing it wrong, and won't be able to fight other LMGs with any success. It actually has surprisingly good hipfire for an LMG as well, so it is the best long range LMG for CQC, and will beat other long-range LMGs at 5m. But don't use this gun with CQC in mind, but if it's a possibility in a long range fight.

The 60 bullet magazine isn't the largest, but the Bull has absolutely ridiculous reload speed. It feels like a carbine. But the strength of this gun is easy mid-range headshots, where other LMGs won't be able to pull off successive headshots, and being able to CQC seeing as you are a HA. It wont beat shotguns and other Heavies (unless they're using a long range LMG) but it offers a good all round range. Long range isn't as easy, as vertical recoil is easier to control than horizontal, especially at long range, which is what the Rhino is made for with the Adv. Forward Grip (practically 0 horizontal recoil, seriously) and 100 bullets.

This gun is a headshot gun. If you don't headshot with the T32 Bull, put it down, grab a T9 Carv, and go kill some NC. This gun doesn't need any changing, it is my go-to weapon for long range fights, and I think it's amazing.

not gonna support the OP cause bull is the only TR lmg I don't have, I simply hate the model design lol, but if you buff the RoF you should also decrese the "total accuracy loss per bullet fired" or the gun will be less accurate as a result.

No ******* way. Increasing the RoF on the Bull would totally kill its purpose: accurate almost non-stop fire.

The Bull is one of the very few LMGs that you can just hold down the trigger with and still get accurate headshots or accurate shots at distance. A higher RoF would send the recoil and bloom out the window. The Bull is an amazing precision instrument, it's not ****, you just don't know how to use it.

do you know that the bull is the only lmg in this game that can keep up with the ns15m when it comes to accuracy and it already has a faster rate of fire than the ns15m. also, if you want a good allrounder that can be used over most ranges with a rof of 698 you have to go for the carv-s.

So is it just a coincidence that even other TR players would take the NS-15M over the Bull?

Exactly, players that have played long enough know that there is something seriously wrong with this weapons stated performance by comparison to the NS 15. Headshot machine my ****. Typical VS ********.

But don't take my word for it. Go out and run a session with the Bull and then swap over to the NS 15. You'll put that Bull in the trash heap. From my experience with the 2 guns, the Bull isn't firing at its stated rate of 652rpm. Its more like 600 or maybe closer to 580. Moreover, the velocity isn't at 670, more like 600.

On paper, the Bull should beat the NS 15 by a longshot with the exception(s) of reloads. In reality...its garbage compared to the NS 15.

I prefer the Bull to the NS-15, mostly because of how ridiculous the lack of recoil is, and the ease of headshots well into the midrange. I may be slightly biased as I don't use the NS-15, and I have Auraxiumed the Bull, and I know how to use the Bull a lot better because of that. The ADS speed on the NS-15 is a definite extra however, giving that extra bit of mobility.

They do that because of the 0.75ADS.

The NS-15M is actually all around better than the Bull. The only thing you're really taking the Bull over the NS-15m for is the <-> recoil bias, which when weak enough (as it is on the Bull,) trumps a single directional bias. However, the NS-15m has the faster reload, single directional bias (making it very controllable) and lacks only 5 rounds to the Bull's 60. It also comes with MORE total ammo than the Bull. Did I mention the .75x ADS movement? That's a big factor too. Like, really big.

If the Bull were to ever get changes (again) it would have to be an overhaul this time, not a minor tweak in a vain attempt to make it stand apart from the Rhino, which IS effectively the same damn gun, and over the NS-15m. The only justifiable change the Bull could receive is entering into the same family as the Lynx and Torq-9. I'd personally like to see an LMG that fits the whole 850-900 RPM, 125dmg model. Super accurate, fast reloads, screams TR... Would kill for an LMG like that.

Of course, it would render the Hailstorm completely obsolete, but it's no secret that the Hailstorm is the $#!%%!#$% SMG in game, and the Armistice has it beat by lightyears, so no real loss there.

I've actually been wondering about this gun's niche in the game.
(MSW-R) hip fire,
(NS-15) accurate low recoil, faster ads movement,
(carv 9) nice medium range weapon with lots of ammo and fire rate....
(tmg) 167 damage model and burst fire

but t32 I just don't get it. the first shot recoil is too strong for it to make use of the low ads cof and head shots, the hipfire isn't good even with laser sight.... its not good at long range,...the only thing it is good at is the 670m/s muzzle velocity .. so less leading the target

I guess maybe I could aim at the neck...and let the recoil go to the head??
kicks like a bull? was that the idea >__<?

how do you use this gun? because even after auraxiuming it I still don't get it... can someone explain it to me?

Nevermind......

Tweak the Bull, instead of just a buff.

Drop its velocity to ~615m/s, up its RoF to 698-700, take the compensator and HVA anyway and give it .75 ADS.

Then you take the Rhino and buff its velocity to whatever the Bull currently has, add a compensator.

Bam, each LMG is now distinct and has a set purpose.

I didnt like the bull when i tried it.
Its less accurate than the ns15 and imo the rhino, and has a low ammo reserve.
I discounted it pretty quick and went for the rhino as my 5th lmg. Which, i will say ive been pretty impressed with as long as you keep some distance to your enemy.

Try VS Polaris with adv. laser sight it is usable even in hip fire mode and has 100 bullet mag.
Also no drop on bullets is brilliant when using silencer.
Exactly that is how accurate Rhino or Bull should be.
One easily forget about NS 15

Can confirm. VX-29 Polaris is the bomb, even though on paper it really doesn't look like it should be. The EM1 is practically the same gun... except it's hipfire is awful. What a difference in hip CoF can make!

The Bull really needs to fill a niche. It's sitting in the shadow of two other guns right now. Besides a tweak to 698 rpm, all I can really recommend is taking the Torque 9 approach to it.