Shotguns ruined the TTK/Skill required/Close Quarter Combat of Planetside 2..We need higher TTK!

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Rustler, Mar 23, 2013.

  1. HadesR

    Shotguns have replaced UBGL as the noob tube
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  2. WalrusJones

    My only issue with higher TTK is that it would kill long range combat if we didn't make a proportionate cut to bloom and bullet drop.

    The UBGL hasn't really been a noob toob in planetside, everyone uses flack armor anyhow, so it felt like a non issue.
  3. Rustler

    Exactly...rarely do I see n00btubes anymore, I guess they moved on to the shotgun.
  4. Ouch Electric

    The whole point of a shotgun is that it ends fights quickly at close range. If it didn't do that, it would be inferior in every way.

    TTK is fine.
    • Up x 1
  5. Bl4ckVoid

    All you complainers I have a challenge for you.

    If the shotgun is so OP, then please get one and go on a killing spree with it. Post the videos here. Several videos per user, to make sure you did not just get lucky.

    Surely if it is so OP, it will not be a problem?
    • Up x 1
  6. HadesR

    Shotguns are fine, it's why there is nothing wrong with the NC Max
  7. smokemaker

    If it was available to all, no issue.
    Personal I want a 1 hit kill 50 cal. regardless of where it hits you.
    Any bullet from any gun in the head 1 hit kill.
    I side towards ARMA style play. I love fast TTK's

    Your weapon example would actually make combat in this game look closer to reality. Death at range being very common vs. the CQC we have now. Cover and movement being all important where the sight of you could lead to your death. Most engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan are at extremely long range. It is the very rare battle when opposing sides actually see each other, let alone fight it out within a few meters of each other.
  8. Rustler

    lol ARMA.

    Ill be all for ARMA TTK if this game was actually tactical....If we had prone, leaning, etc.....

    With proper cover all around the continent specially in facilities.

    and if facilities werent created for like 20 vs 20 persons.

    Also Aircraft should go faster than the speed of sound and shoot missles....not hover and shoot rockets.

    Sorry but planetside isnt reality.
  9. smokemaker

    "Ill be all for ARMA TTK if this game was actually tactical....If we had prone, leaning, etc....."
    I like this thinking in my targets, makes them easier to kill.

    "With proper cover all around the continent specially in facilities." & "and if facilities werent created for like 20 vs 20 persons."
    Map issue, and hopefully the new map coming out will be better.

    "Also Aircraft should go faster than the speed of sound and shoot missles....not hover and shoot rockets."
    Agreed on the faster speed and no hovering. But on the other hand we would have far more deadly weaponry.

    "Sorry but planetside isnt reality"
    I understand this, and you dont see me arguing to change it. I like it how it currently is. But you will see me argue against any and all nerfs. Nerfs are bad for the game.

    Example : If shotguns so OP. Dont nerf them. Add armor specificly designed to counter shotguns and sell them in the shop. This way those that have the shotgun still have all their power, and those that hate dying to shotguns have a counter. win / win
    Nerfs do not enhance anything and limit the sandbox.
  10. Rustler

    Well Already said SOE should have Shotgun Armor....maybe be part of the Flak armor...I will bump this thread.

    Nerfs arnt bad at all...Sometimes the game does need balancing.
  11. RaZz0R

    TTK is actually ok - what would be good is to have a key binding to the med pack.
    Then first hit you have a chance to hit the med pack and move to counter.
  12. Bagginz

    I've been somewhat vocal in defense of the pump since it's release. To be completely honest, my opinion of them has changed recently.

    It wasn't getting owned by the shotty that changed my mind. I've been killed by shotties a ton, and most the time I praise the guy who killed me for outplaying me, being that I play with the pump myself. In total honesty, the imbalance became more apparent when I made a conscious effort NOT to use the pump shotty. I found that I die around 10 times more, and kill around 10 times less people with any other gun.

    I have 2k+ kills with the NC pump shotty, and I'll admit that it could use some balancing. I mean, I understand that it's intended to be superior in cqc situations, but the sheer potential it has to allow any class to clear out a small group of infantry is a little bit unfair in my opinion. I'm not talking about potential on paper, I'm talking about it's real potential in game to actually achieve that goal.

    I dunno if it's appropriate to take away it's ability to ohk someone, but the way it is now it's just too easy. I seriously don't use any other gun unless I'm infiltrator because the shotgun grants you the most survivability, by far.

    There's no other gun that has the power to just shut out your enemies, no matter how well they can aim, as long as they're within your range. Yes, you will get dominated at mid-long range, but controlling your exposure to those situations is a trivial matter in most situations.

    Yeah, it takes practice to get good with it, but even if your enemy has a ton of practice too, without a shotgun they're usually toast in cqc. You can even solo maxes if you move around enough, depending on how well they can aim.

    I think that the shotgun should be similar to the sniper rifles in use: it CAN get a ohk, but it should be fairly difficult to achieve that, even under ideal circumstances. Yeah, if the guy is standing still and you get the drop on him, it should be easy to OHK, just like when you're a sniper and the guy is just standing still like that, but even in cqc it should be pretty hard to ohk someone if they're moving around.

    Maybe my opinion is biased. I have twice as many kills with the shotgun as any 2 other guns combined, so it does make sense that I'd be best with it, but it just seems too easy. I feel naked using any other gun, and if that's the case, I think there's something wrong. On the other hand, maybe any gun feels like that once you've gotten 2000 kills with it.
  13. Eyeklops

    While I agree with your stance on the shotties, I disagree with your remarks on "skill." I'm going to throw some other stuff in there not related to your post so don't take it personally:

    Speaking mostly of infantry combat, I think being able to recognize a better position, get into it, and maintain an aim on the target are all skills in which players can vary. I also think that not all players are equal in reaction time, ability to learn maps, recognize complex choke points, and memorize common infantry travel paths.

    The above stated are a few of the most important skills an FPS gamer can possess, if not the most important. IMO, a game should challenge all of the above skills in a relatively equal fashion, while not letting a player "gifted" in one particular skill completely dominate the battlefield. I am not sure PS2 has got this balance down right, it's not totally horrible, but still needs work.

    Too many "one shot, one kill" scenarios reduce the overall effectiveness of the "reaction time" and "maintain an aim on the target" skills for some players. In fact, having a OSOK weapon completely removes the "reaction time" skill in some scenarios, regardless of range. How often this can happen is controlled by the game developers to limit a players access to this scenario, and SOE has clearly said "grind or pay for this right" in QCQ as no free/default shotgun exists. The big question is how often can a "no reaction time" scenario happen and still have a fun, but tactical game that people want to play? I certainly don't have that answer, only my opinion.

    That said, I am not super enthusiastic about being gamed by SOE itself when they intentionally move this scenario around and constantly mess with gameplay balance to make $$. I really wish the F2P model would have been cosmetics with additional cash flow from subscription perks. They could cert limit non subscribers and give frequent free resets with a mid grade option to reset more often. Then new content balance would be driven more by fun and less "how do I make everybody want to buy this gun."
  14. Bagginz

    Dude, I could give you a 3 hour highlight reel of ridic shotty slaying if I had recorded all my gameplay with it. There's absolutely no shortage of ridic pump shotty footage on youtube, and you can take that to the bank.

    Either way, a video like that doesn't prove **** in reality. You can own with a crap gun, and you can be owned with the best one.
  15. Eyeklops

    So would you be ok if this new LMG had lock-on bullets?
  16. Zenith

    The problem is that when facing it you have no chance to respond, which 100% completely different from every other infantry weapon in the game. When someone with a shotgun starts spraying, regardless if he's aiming or not, then he's going to wipe you - and possibly numerous others - out with OHK shots. There is no downside when you're using it in CQC, and that is unbalanced.
  17. Gonkish

    I think the problem with the pump-actions is that their fire rate is high enough to make the first shot not really matter. You can completely whiff it and still fire a second round fast enough to (presumably) murder the hell out of your target before they can kill you. The fire rate is just too forgiving. The tradeoff for the OHK in CQB should be a severe risk of being killed if you miss/glance. Currently that doesn't really happen, and thus CQB (especially in interiors) tends to be "did you bring a pump-action? If yes, YOU WIN. If no, YOU DIED!".

    It completely skews the TTK in CQB, meaning that you either need to have OHK capability (presumably through a pump-action), or you are at a severe disadvantage. Granted, the shotgun is useless beyond about 15m, but that hardly seems like enough of a penalty when you can down two opponents in rapid succession with the current fire rate. It's not that hard to pick your fights when inside a building.
    • Up x 1
  18. smokemaker

    Not so much with the lock on bullets, thats a little extreme.
    But I have no issues with fast TTK weapons.
  19. Eyeklops

    I seem to "tie" allot with the pump action, much more so than any other gun. Do you think this is related to my skill level, or the combination of TTK and latency, or both?
  20. smokemaker

    A little on the tech side for me to say, but I do run into kills where we both die. I dont mind them.
    As for BF3 and this game, TTK seems close. BF3 might be faster on hardcore mode, but on easy mode, BF 3 is too slow for me.
    PS1 had to long of a TTK for my liking. And COD , have not played it.