Severe A2G Nerfs

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Zen_Master, Mar 3, 2015.

  1. BlueSkies

    A) Weapons aren't supposed to hit things beyond render range. Whats wrong with you?

    B) They didn't nerf render range... they fixed it, sort of, after they broke it (has still been mostly broken).
    • Up x 2
  2. NinjaTurtle

    I'm sorry if ground can shoot air air can shoot ground.

    Heavies taking the AA lancher aren't giving up much because it can still be dumfired and used against ground and infantry

    And if air can only use their nose guns for ground attacks then having Skyguards and Bursters = base AA turrets to defend agains them is over kill.

    This whole vendetta against air is way out of hand. Air has been nerfed since it's release state where it was OP. ESF are made from wet paper, if you sneeze to hard near one it falls apart
    • Up x 3
  3. Selenadread

    I never agreed with taking away after burners from ESF, I was asking clarification on what exactly op was yes you are still the troll :p
  4. Juunro

    It was pretty reasonable to allow 3-5 LPPA scythes to bombard spawn rooms from three times the range of AA lock on launchers.

    I mean, it's not like that's exactly what got the PPA nerfed on every other vehicle or anything.
  5. Alarox

    So aircraft would finally leave us alone? Sounds good.

    My message to A2G farmers: "Piss off and let us enjoy the damn game."

    Most farming is done by letting idiots come to you. A2G farming involves you going around slaughtering people who can't fight back.

    Unfortunately the game doesn't allow me to sneeze upward, but the wet paper is allowed to drop nuclear bombs on my face.

    This is like attacking an old man on the street with a baseball bat, but playing the victim when he pulls a knife to chase you off.
    • Up x 1
  6. Takara

    I can understand that, honestly I was originally of the same opinion. Most A2G weapons are terrible at A2A engagements when faced with air superiority weapons. But....I do understand that some of the ground game guys don't know or care to learn how to fly. So there should be some option open to them. People complain that skyguards are worthless. But the truth is most people dont' really know how to use them. One skyguard is usually never really enough. Two skyguards are really good when paired together. It just takes team work. Three is overwhelming. But most ground gamers just detest the very idea of having to face the problem they hate so much, which is aircraft. So I usually ignore most of the complaints because so few (just like tankers) refuse to actually attempt to deal with aircraft they just expect everyone else to do it for them.

    So i feel you there...but I'm willing to give them flak/AA maxs/walkers and some faster dumb fires.
  7. Meeka

    Infantry should be flexible in its loadout, vehicles not so much. It's rather funny you compare ESF to infantry, two entirely different classes. Especially when ESFs have IMMEDIATE countermeasures to all Infantry G2A weapons called flares which gives ESFs about 12 seconds of immortality, where in a game with such a short TTK is an eternity; where as infantry have zero immediate counter measures to A2G weapons.

    You want to ground pound it? Fine, take your rocket pods, but give up your afterburners. Or, take your afterburners and ground pound it with your nose gun only. See, options.

    Oh, but you'll say the infantry has the MAX, right? In which case... infantry HAS to choose between G2A or G2G; they can't do both.
  8. zaspacer

    When enemy air arrives, if you pull an ESF and you're not an Ace (or at least much better than them), you will die.

    Your best bet in a medium to large size Ally Population area (for most areas) is to pull AA (from whichever spawn location has the best line-of-sight on them), send a /region "AA", and then attempt to be annoying to Air to the point they go away. I prefer pulling HA with Annihilator and climbing a Tower or hill between the Air's target and their point of attack/retreat.

    In a small size Ally Population area you're pretty dead. You can try to play peek-a-boo with a Lockon Launcher from range or Dumbfire Launcher from close up. But a persistent non-bad ESF pilot can get you.

    I fly ESF almost all the time, and I agree that ESF is OP... just like about every Unit and Loadout currently being used in the game.

    Nerfing ESF vs. Infantry is a good idea... depending on what aspect is nerfed and how it's down. I'd give every starting HA access to a Lockon. This would at least make AA access consistent across battles. I'd also experiment with a "snapfire" Lockon Launcher that took half the time to Lock and did ~1/2 the damage of other Lockon options (but same reload time).

    Nerfing ESF vs. Ground Vehicles is more problematic for many reasons:
    1) it diverts more ESF attention onto Infantry (etc.)
    2) it is likely to buff the Ground Vehicle the ESF is nerfed against, many of which already lack enough good counters
    3) it impairs the ESFs ability to contribute to the battle or accrue XP
    Best bet is to test buffing the Vehicles defense options (like give MBTs access to AA Secondaries), give ESFs (and everyone else) partial XP for non-destroyed Vehicle Targets, and increase the number of other counters (and power of those counters) to Ground Vehicles.

    Another option is to make ESF vs. ESF combat more Universally viable. Further lower the advantage from "Skill" in ESF duels and decrease Resource cost for ESF.

    Another universal change that would benefit all Vehicles, is to add Air Radar that perma shows on Mini-Map and Main Map any Air that moves more than 1 Hex outside their Faction's controlled area.

    There are a lot of change options available, and they can provide a number of different outcomes and impacts. The trick is to define what players want to see in terms of future gameplay, and then make the corresponding adjustments to get it.
  9. ColonelChingles

    All aircraft munitions should be severely limited... mostly to what they can hold on their wing mounts. I mean not like the pilot is getting out of his cockpit in midair to reload his pylons. :p


    You get 16 of them. Fire them off all at once or one at a time... up to you. But when you're out, you have to head back to a airpad and wait for 3 minutes to rearm (as you should for all pylon-mounted weapons).


    You get 14 of them. Once they're out, then it's back to the airpad for you!

    Rocket Pods


    You only get 12 of these. Spam them all at once or try to rocket-snipe, but after firing a dozen you're probably heading back home.



    Four total, meaning that if you randomly spam shots you're going to be spending a lot of downtime sitting on an airpad.



    Hey noseguns are cool, aren't they? Well not so much when you only carry about 20 seconds of ammo for them. The good news is that at least they only take about a minute of sitting on an airpad to reload!
  10. TechMechMeds

    Esf's are op.

    Check my esf stats.
  11. TheRealNattyIce

    as a pillot i agree that running a 2ndary weapon on esfs should remove you afterburnng ability.
  12. Haquim

    Hey, if the realistic ammo reserve comes with more realistic firepower im all for it!
    Mind you though, I'm a pilot that occasionally destroys tanks in 4 seconds (about 2 seconds from their view), and im doing that with the hornets I have right now.
    Although im not flying as much as I used to...

    I remember breaking into a hysteric fit of giggling and coughing when I (after playing already for half a year) discovered that warning sign on the hellfire rocketpods - implying that they are NUCLEAR WARHEADS.
  13. Scorponok

    you can take afterburners away from ESFs...thats like taking away sprint for soldiers and leaving them with walkspeed..have fun with that...
    • Up x 1
  14. Cyrek

    ESF pilots will cave in for this deal: you can nerf A2G but SoE needs to remove the ability for tank shells to one shot ESFs, it stopped being about self imposed "skill" and more about a little luck some time ago. Also give fuel tank users a chance to explode the ESF instantly from flak or small arms.
  15. MahouFairy

    But G2A weapons can still hit tanks. Annihilators can still target BOTH.
  16. MahouFairy

    Yeah, so one Hellfire rocket should half kill a tank and wipe out 10 people? Sure.

    Hornets should pretty much OHK everything and level a building?

    Yeah A2A lock on missiles should OHK any ESF and Valk, 2-3 HK any Galaxy or Liberator? Why not.

    Coyotes should pretty much kill any thing that flies with 1 salvo.

    Yeah noseguns are cool! Especially when a burst of 10 bullets should be enough to bring down an ESF, a slightly longer burst should kill the passengers in a Galaxy (hey we saw that on the trailer right?). Oh and don't forget, a strafe run should be able to wipe the floor with infantry bits.
  17. ColonelChingles


    Of course, at the same time 1 SAM or 1 flak explosion will also probably kill most aircraft as well.

    Live by the sword, die by the sword. :p
  18. MahouFairy

    Provided the SAM actually hits. Because they don't have a 100% hit or kill chance. However, a burst of nosegun or rockets should level any SAM site or any armoured vehicle.
  19. ColonelChingles

    Ummm... you're right that SAMs are not guaranteed to hit or kill. But neither are aircraft-mounted rockets.

    For example, the rocketpods in PS2 are unlikely to fire rockets that are guaranteed to kill a MBT in one hit. They're kinda small... probably more akin to 57mm rockets (the Halberd being an 85mm rocket, and each rocket from the rocketpods is much smaller than that). Also they're listed as HE rockets, not really meant to cut through armor. Would work against light vehicles perfectly and might have some success in messing up a Lightning. But definitely would need much more work to take out a MBT.

    ESF noseguns (and even Liberator TB) are also not guaranteed to kill a tank in one run either. Reaver noseguns are only 20mm cannon (the Airhammer being larger at 30mm), and I doubt the Mosquito uses anything heavier. 20mm is unlikely to defeat MBT armor, especially with the slow velocity that ESF nose cannons have. These would work well against Lightnings from the rear, top, or sides, but probably just bounce off a MBT.

    So Hornets... yeah. Those are going to be your tank killers, capable of ripping through even MBT armor. But noseguns and other missiles would be significantly less effective.

    MANPADs would probably have a 80% hit probability (even if the aircraft is evading or flaring). One hit wouldn't be a kill, but it would definitely take that aircraft out of the fight. Advanced vehicle-mounted SAMs would likely be OHK and a very high hit probability (greater than 90%).

    Though we still need advanced SAMs in the game. :p

    40mm flak would probably disintegrate aircraft. Even small arms fire would have a chance of critically damaging aircraft as well.

    All in all I think it would make the game more interesting, where aircraft would be at extreme risk if there was enemy AA in the area. But if ground forces disabled that AA, then all hell would rain loose. Yay, combined arms!