S1 vs. Decimator

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by faykid, Aug 18, 2013.

  1. exLupo

    Resist Categories

    And the ZOE ability reads that it reduces armor by 30% which would be a massive increase in damage but, unfortunately, it's an increase of inbound damage by 30% which is then reduced by the armor. Much less. :(

    One concept that's neat is things like C4, and AT mines/grenades have negative modifier so they do even more than their listed damage.
  2. faykid

    yeah, soloing vs. a max is not an option, i know. this is why i wonder if 300 more damage really matters. if you're not going to kill him solo with S1, you won't do it with Decimator either. only once i managed to land 2 shots at a max, shooting the first one, hiding, shooting the next one - and he still had half the lower bar. i wonder if he'd survived those 2 shots if it was Decimator. if yes, then i don't see the point of Decimator in this specific case.
  3. faykid

    i understand that Decimator is slightly better in certain CQC situations. like, if you happend to end up near a damaged vehicle, etc. the problem is, when i run into battle, i go through series of different situations. i run in the open and see a distant group of enemies - i will have harder time hitting them with Decimator muzzle velocity. then i run into a close space - and now Decimator is 300 dmg better. then i peek out of a window and see a lightnining scanning the area say 30-40 m away from the building - now i could use a faster flying rocket, like S1.

    this is like the basic rule of PS2 (and probably any other game) - you never know when you're going to need what. you pull a skyguard - now air. you take an AV weapon - the sky is dark with enemy air. you take CQC launcher - you end up fighting at medium range. you cannot just swap launcher in the middle of a fight, not in most situations
  4. Morpholine

    Then you need to decide which launcher is your best-fit for most situations, and accept that there are probably going to be lots of places where one of the other options would work better. It's called opportunity cost, and the whole world runs on it.

    For me, the Lancer provides the best mix of long to short range damage and anti-air ability, followed by the Nemesis with its anti-air lock ability and acceptable anti-ground dumbfire. (The Nemesis was my all-the-time only carry back when it had the fast projectile and no drop, but alas, enemy snipers hated being counter-sniped with rocket launchers, so it was nerfed.)
  5. faykid

    the Decimator has the same AOE and damage falloff as S1. if you use any of these two on infantry, you have the same effect. this is what i was talking about.

    now, you're suggesting using Nemesis on vehicles and infantry if my skill is not sufficient for Decimator (i guess by skill you mean managing to land a slowly moving rocket on a moving target at mid range, which i agree is something only an exceptionally good/lucky player can do). however, it has even smaller muzzle velocity which limits its range, and even less direct damage than S1.

    as for the number of shots vs. kills, you gotta be kidding me. i started using this launcher a couple of days ago. a lot of shots were fired just to damage a vehicle, were fired and didnt hit the vehicle because it moved too fast or started moving suddenly, some of them were fired into a group of people who managed to scatter away (if it was Decimator, it'd be the same since the AOE is the same), some of them were fired to cripple a max. some were fired into the general direction of an enemy camp and only wounded a few people. are you saying that with Decimator a person can get 300 kills out of 600 shots?

    my understanding is that a very skilled player can, of course, have much better shots/kills ratio, but it won't tell you anything about the relative effeciency of this or that gun. i shot over 6000 Paralax rounds, yet i only got 727 kills with it. does it tell you that Paralax is bad? or rather that most shots in this game miss targets, and even if you're very good, you just cannot land every second or third shot, you will miss a lot
  6. Paqu

    I took the Decimator for my VS HA a while ago and haven't touched anything else since.

    I wanted to be able to deal maximum amount of damage to MAX units and to get rid off that blue smoke.

    Also its tons of fun to be able to one shot hoverpodding ESF's.
  7. CrashB111

    The default dumbfire for all factions is a functional one shot for ESF's, that 0.5 of a second of burn damage to kill them is basically instant death.

    And I only use a Decimator on my TR HA for when I am dealing with vehicles up close and the Strikers lock on time will get you killed.
  8. exLupo

    I was specifically responding to your claim that you were getting 3-4 kills in one shot in biofarms. You clearly are -not- doing this with any regularity. Making up scenarios does not help your argument.

    My point is that focusing on using AV launchers for AI purposes will never be as time efficient as using your LMG. Sure, there are times when you've used your grenade and you want to attack a group that -maybe- dropping a rocket on them will be worthwhile but they're few and far between. The only people that get good mileage out of rocket launchers are aimbotters and they get banned real quick.

    Learn to use your LMG and grenades for infantry. Save your rockets for MAXes and vehicles. There are some people who use AV primary vs infantry and it really does their team no favors. Sure, you can get a shot off on one person and if you directly land it or splash super close you'll kill them but, otherwise, you die. If there's more than one, you die. If you -really- want to deal with crowds and MAXes, use C4 in place of medkits. Med is great when you're solo but if you're team playing and have Medics all about, C4 is a super easy choice. You'll get more group and MAX kills than you ever will with a rocket launcher. Added bonus, setting traps and providing better sustain vs vehicles per loadout.

    This whole thing is like when TR MAXes kit Fracture for AI work. Sure, you can, but you're going to be inefficient. So much so that I won't revive you. HA players who spam rockets at infantry? I don't revive them, either.
  9. Masterofm

    if you are going to get 1k cert weapon use the lancer over the deci. The empire specific launchers are pretty much better then the deci in a good many situations.
  10. Adeon

    Decimator deals higher damage to Maxes and Tanks (damage to Sunderer = S1). Decimator have -1 rocket and slow projectile speed. To be honest you can find better way to spent your certs.
  11. faykid

    i didnt make up any scenarios. there were several instances of triple kills over the last three days that i've started playing as HA. im not saying those happend every hour, just like headshot sniper sprees don't happen too often. im saying that a triple kill is possible with S1, let alone single kills, and inside a biolab or any other building S1 will do a job as good as Decimator against infantry.

    also, you keep saying that launcher is an AV weapon, but its not, even from its description we can see that it is universal. so why not use it on infantry if there is no vehicle around to shoot at? ("im very smart and skilled, i will not dumbfire at infantry indoors because this weapon is better used against vehicles!")

    besides, i still believe that it is easier to dumbfire armor at range with 120 m/s muzzle velocity than with 60 m/s (Decimator) or even 50 (Nemesis). the easier it is, the more chances you hit. the more times you land it, the more you're efficient for your team
  12. DeadLamb

    Here is the thing with HA, you don't tend to end up fighting gear 1 vs 1 all that much, it's more like your entire squad is shooting away at something. IMO at that point if your aim is all that then sure the 300+ hit damage might get you a few more kills. Personally, I would rather have the extra rocket..

    plus if you are the sort who will spawn HA when you know a sundy is at location X and then try to go kill it you are going to need so much "boom" to kill the thing that an extra 300 hit damage is not going to matter in most cases. Being you have to stack two c4 + fire a rocket into the thing anyways..

    it's why one of my load outs is the default launcher + c4 and the anti-vehicle grenades (those seem to hurt maxes a ton by the way) and the other is a lock on launcher with ammo pouch for long range spam. IMO ff you're cert poor or newer to the game, don't drop 1000 certs into a rocket launcher to only gain 300 more damage being there is just sooooo much else one could spend it on.

    I think I have like 3k certs stacked up, still have not bothered with the Decimator, but that's just me. It's not enough of a boost or a good fit for my play style.

    I'm totally clueless on the stats but, isn't the S1's velocity ALOT slower than the Deci? it seems so, ie you have to lead even on slow moving vehicles.

    I could of course, be totally wrong.
  14. exLupo

    You used 3-4 kills as justification for it being a good AI weapon. The frequency of 3-4 kills are so rare, judging by your own stats, that it's not an efficient use of your time. And this is, again, my point. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should chase it.

    However, I really don't have time right now so if you want to keep lobbing rockets and being inefficient, rock on. Good luck with that but, hopefully, this will nag at the back of your mind until you come around. If not? Free kills on you. :)
  15. TeknoBug

    Deci is better than the S1 against vehicles and MAX.
    No, Deci travels slower than the faction default rocket launchers.
  16. faykid

    i guess you just misplaced your argument when you decided to reply to this topic

    part of my argument was that S1 is just as good at killing infantry as Decimator, and i was wondering why i should pay 1000 certs for something that is just slightly better against armor and maxes damage wise but has the downside of having way slower muzzle velocity

    at the same time, your argument was that a rocket launcher shouldnt be used against infantry at all. this is like a completely different topic!

    you say that it is not an efficient use of my time. well, what is better - launching a rocket, tossing a concussion grenade, then coming in hot with LMG, or just tossing a concussion grenade, then coming in hot with LMG? it takes me almost no time to shoot a rocket into a room before entering, so why skipping on this opportunity? there is no penalty involved, no downside. why then? should i just ingore the fact that i have it and not use it because derp?

    again, if you're saying that using S1 against infantry is wrong, then it means using Decimator against groups of infantry is wrong. in which case it is a completely different topic.
  17. ent|ty

    I wouldn't, for precisely the reason you stated about it's stats.

    Having a slow travel speed just to get an extra 300 damage isn't worth it.

    As a dumbfire user, there's already plenty to compensate for with leading and such, but I need speed, and the Decimator simply isn't worth it.

    Also, the S1 is a OHK on infantry, at any range. If it is not, it's just because you didn't hit them square, and only got splash damage on them.

    The S1 is dependable, stick with that if you want dumbfire.
    • Up x 1
  18. Koldorn

    This. This is how its done. I picked up a Nemesis when it was first introduced; and have yet to be disappointed. But, mattherson just has so many air targets.
    • Up x 1
  19. Ronin Oni

    splash radius is why

    also, if you use munitions pouch, the 1 less rocket matters a lot less.

    These things are brutal in lab fights/any time your firing into small rooms packed with enemy inf
  20. Ronin Oni

    I use Nemsis most often now when I'm outside.

    Lancer when I'm setting up to defend against armor zerg at range

    Decimator for interior fights.

    For TR it's Striker for outside AV, Decimator for Infantry fights