Regarding snipers, why is this a nerf?

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by teks, Nov 15, 2013.

  1. teks

    I'm fairly sure a headshot at any distance will nearly kill a guy. The only thing they said is past 150 meters it wont kill them outright.
    I imagine it'll have no dropoff till 150 meters, then itll drop off with a slight arc, so even at 300 meters the guy will be in the red.
  2. Ronin Oni

    good enough for me

    and so slower BASR's do have advantage of OHK range against other snipers if they scale right
  3. GumboEU

    You don't balance a game around hackers. "Balancing" a gameplay mechanic with "because hackers could abuse it" as reason, you are basically admitting that your anti-cheat systems don't work.
    • Up x 1
  4. Xidaraf

    this 150 meters is not a good idea it is quite difficult to get a second shot one an enemy who already starts moving when you hit him with your first, even worst when your silenced sniping and you hit him when he starts moving it basically requires a bit of skill and lots of luck to hit him. so no SOE please dont go ahead with this change, also if you enjoy going are behing enemy lines and sniping their heads off well you cant do that anymore 150 meters is just to close for stealth when using a sniper rifle.
  5. teks

    We all know it doesn't. No reason to remain ignorant about it and hope itll go away or people wont notice.
  6. teks

    MY argument here is that its exactly the same way now except you will be able to kill everyone within a range, and wont be able to kill the few people without nanoweave outside that range. With nanoweave being the go-to ability theres a good chance your KDR will actually go up.

    The 150 meter range is a conservative starting point for the staff, which they said is open to change based on feedback, but this feedback will be quite dilluted if the sniper supporters are whining (not referring to anyone specific) so much before the change is even implimented.

    The problem becomes clear to me when I notice the sheer number of snipers who think the change has already happened and blame it for why they can't one-hit-kill targets when in reality it because of nanoweave, and ultimately nothing i really changing in the sniping world pre and post patch.
    • Up x 1
  7. lilleAllan

    those guys are complete morons. the quintessential forumsiders parading their ignorance for everyone to see.
    • Up x 1
  8. PhilDun

    Stop trying to turn PS2 into something it's not. This is NOT a game for skilled/competitive players. If I want to stand still when I'm shooting, I shouldn't be punished just because some sniper happens to be perched on a hill somewhere.

    I don't want to have to move around more than I need to. This should be a RELAXING/FUN experience, not one where I die just because I might need to go afk for 5 seconds.

    Besides, if I'm standing still, it's not like it took much skill to aim at me. So stop with this "the game should reward skill" arguments because it doesn't take skill to hit a standing target.
  9. Flapatax

    Not sure if joking or terrible.
    • Up x 2
  10. FocusLight

    You seem to be missing the point here:

    Inside of 150 meters head-shots with a sniper-rifle is a guaranteed kill. Outside of that range the one thing that mitigated your head-shot-to-kill ratio was nanoweave armor. NWA is getting nerfed to the point where it don't protect against head-shots AT ALL, FROM ANY SOURCE.

    Think about that for a bit. Again, inside that magical 150 meter range NOTHING WILL SAVE YOU. Outside of that range NWA WILL NOT SAVE YOU.

    Now, let me tell you something.

    I am not the best sniper around, nor am I a very good tanker or air-man, truth be told I am far better at the CQB side of the game - getting in close and personal, using grenades (concs are my favorite) powerful rapid-fire weapons and skillful split-second decision-making, aiming, and maneuvering to win fights, that and knowing when it's time to get a tad closer and use the chain-blade for lethal effect. But even I like going at it differently on occasion. Play Medic, focus on reviving and healing your team-mates, don't be first into a room, don't risk your neck to much because others rely on you even more now. I will admit I fail at this very often, as getting in close and personal is, again, just the way I roll.

    But when I do play sniper I play *SNIPER*. On occasion there is the cloak-and-dagger style SMG-infil run but I prefer my more... elegant options. Do you know what I've found out?

    It's easy to find good positions for the top-tier bolt-action anti-materiel RAMS.50 and the trusty old 12x. It's easy to aim. What is hard, is predicting enemy movements, bullet-drop and cloaking/de-cloaking at the right time as well as breathing in and out when needed. At times, I time my shots wrong or hit the wrong keys in sequence cloaking up when I meant to de-cloak because it just ran out and I did not time it right... and so on.

    It's easy to equip this gun with my 8x and silencer, then getting in closer. Knowing when to use and not use the cloak while you maneuver isn't to hard, nor is finding good spots closer to the front, say, inside of 100 meters or closer. I love the thrill of keeping my position inside of 50 meters of my enemy and landing those hits for those delicious *THUNK* sound-effects over and over and over again.

    Yesterday night I was on with my VS toon and offered my wrath to the Miller-NC. On the bridge leading from Indar Bay point to the area right between Highlands solar station and Sandstone Gulch Mining they marched, with tanks in tow.

    From my position on their flank I delivered head-shot after head-shot, with a few misses, that were easy to correct with a follow-up body-shot - after all there were plenty of Vanu on the end of the bridge shelling down, and a good number of Vanu snipers sitting on that end as well. They all, to the last guy, assumed that the head-shot they just survived due to their NWA came from the front of the bridge, and all adjusted their cover in accordance with that - sometimes making it EASIER for me to shoot them again. The number of NC snipers I nailed was absurd. The number of engineers I creamed was amazing - so many assumed that they were safe to stand behind their tanks and repair while crouching down, using their armor as cover. It still amazed me that none realized something was wrong when they got OHK'ed while in that location - there is after all only so many places that super-heated ball of plasma could have come from. Course, Medics were plentiful and the vast majority of them were skilled enough to never stand still while reviving, making my job a good bit harder, but providing an ample supply of targets.

    I estimate about 2/5 of all the head-shots I landed even at this range was negated with nanoweave, I was after all not using the most powerful VS rifle, and I did silence it, reducing it's power. Considering that I did get killed once in a while and had to go back to that location and that once, early on before I certed 3 levels in ammo pouches, I ACTUALLY RAN OUT OF BATTERIES and had to re-deploy to Highlands solar to get more, those 135 kills I got in 1 hour could have been so many more if the coming changes were implemented yesterday. Less than 20 of those kills were close range Beamer skills, SMG kills or knife kills. The rest were head and body hits with a bolt-action. Or whatever passes for a bolt-action among Vanu.

    Point is:

    In a few weeks when I, or anyone, do something similar to this, the number of hits that gets saved by NWA won't be two out of five. It will be zero. None. In that situation I reliably kill anyone I hit in the head with that rifle, and even if I go further back and use the non-silenced 12x version I'll still score OHK's - the most powerful rifles among NC, TR and VS do 800 damage flat. Head-shots are a 2x multiplier for 1600 damage. NWA mitigates none of that. Range mitigates damage to 550 after 100 meters, ergo a head-shot outside of 100 meters will do a minimum of 550x2=1100 damage to any infantry it hits in the head. Course, out to 150 meters it's still a guaranteed kill, but beyond that you are still Fubar'ed - all infantry have 500 HP and 500 Shield except infils who have only 400 Shield (or was it only 400HP, I'm not sure) so that's 1000 health, at most. NWA won't mitigate any head-shot damage, and you got, at minimum, 100 damage to spare for any other factors that might save the occasional victim of sniper-round-to-face-impact.

    Snipers should not complain about these changes because frankly, the only snipers who will get a worse performance after this are the abysmally sucky ones who could not hit the ground even if they slipped and fell. Snipers are being handed an absurdly potent upgrade to their play-style and YOU STILL MANAGE THE AUDACITY TO WHINE ABOUT IT.
    • Up x 1
  11. Vaphell

    I am not missing anything. There are many spots that are heavily exploited that literally beg for sniper intervention but are taller/wider than 150m. This hard cap means that snipers will still be an ineffective counter which was, is and will be wrong. If you put sniper rifles in the game, they better be ******* working as sniper rifles not as goddamned slug shotguns with ****tier aim mechanics.
    Yes, NW in its current form takes a huge dump on snipers' head but that doesn't mean snipers should stay largely toothless against crapload of mlg ready, 'skill' laden tricks that print certs, as if any of dozen medics present at the crime scene, undoing the job faster than the rechamber animation was not frustrating enough.
  12. hostilechild

    Too bad they can't make it so if you equip and SMG you get a cloak and if you equip a sniper rifle (make then OHK) you don't get a cloak. Past 150m infils are completely invisible while cloaked. Line up shot, decloak, fire, recloak pretty dam safe.

    In past i could see infils cloaked way the hell out, anymore i swear past 50m its near impossible to see them. If not moving give it up even closer. Some of its obviously just render issues and not the cloak.

    But at same time, shotguns should be unnerfed, phoenix unnerfed, HE unnerfed, Bursters unnerfed, Antitank rockets buffed, etc. :p
    Like thats going to happen, use to be so much more fun and had to think about what you did.
  13. Malacovics


  14. Kid Gloves

    I completely agree. I expect the range is going to settle at ~300m. Starting with 150m means we're going to get a whole lot of yelling on the forums, etc. That'll get pushed out to somewhere in the 200-300m range, and people will be glad for the 'buff'. It's a solid tactic for selling a potentially unpopular feature.

    Of course, the 'OHK range' mechanic is one that's in the game anyway - it's just weapon drop-off at work.

    As for how does a good sniper know which targets to aim for? That's what makes a good sniper good. :) You get to know names, outfits, roles, etc.

    Watching an NC sniper who clearly knew his stuff repeatedly taking out our platoon leader because he knew the guy would be platoon lead was interesting to watch. The guy managed to distract about half a squad once he got the platoon leader riled enough.
    • Up x 1
  15. teks

    Thats awesome
  16. FocusLight

    No I think you are missing my point, STILL. Once again you have repeated your old argument of "Snipers will be an ineffective counter to AT Turrets rockets etc. outside of 150 meters and rapid-fire weapon users will still beat us" without even adressing anything I said, you have not even bothered to deal with my direct examples using weapons damage numbers and damage-loss ranges to back my argument that no, snipers will not have huge issues with this and will in fact be buffed pretty well by these two changes, ESPECIALLY the NWA changes.

    If I'm wrong, kindly point out why I am wrong. If you can't do that because I am right, concede that I am and stop fussing over this. Right now it looks to me like you are complaining for the sake of it while ignoring anything I say to counter your statements.