Redeploy - Its Fine And Necessary

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by NoctD, Nov 18, 2014.

  1. WTSherman

    Well, my point was basically that if we give the Valkyrie some more speed, nobody would be in any position to complain about redeploy being removed. The Valkyrie would be cheap, and would get them to the front as fast as could ever be considered reasonable.

    They'd complain anyway because they're lazy and don't want to spend nanites, but their complaints would have no basis in reality. As a bonus the Valkyrie gets a little something to set it apart from the Galaxy.
  2. LtSqueak

    I personally don't like this plan, because of the resource cost. Even pulling an ESF, a lone wolf has to spend 250 (?) of his 750 resources to get somewhere. A squad has to spend 450 of a combined 9000 resources. I understand that this is a combined arms game, but forcing people to use resources (which are supposed to get a lot more valuable in phase 2) seems like a bad idea.
    Instead, you introduce an option where one person can get somewhere free in roughly the same amount of time as an ESF, but as soon as you have 3 or more (needs balance) it would be faster to grab a gal/valk if they buff it. Then you have to start considering the economics of the situation.
  3. Astriania

    Valkyrie does need a speed boost, it's insane that it's quicker to take a galaxy.

    Regarding lone wolves who are too lazy to pull an aircraft: first, are they in the right game, but assuming we want to keep them, the answer to that is to allow vehicle pilots to advertise their vehicle as being open for anyone to hop in. You already get good transport XP for dropping players from your gal who do good work, so I'm sure there are plenty of people who'd be happy to fly randoms to the front in their gal. Just use the V-"I need a ride" macro from inside a transport vehicle that you own to signal it as open, and use the existing 'steering wheel' icon on the minimap and in the vehicle's dorito.

    Spawning into squad vehicles should also be nerfed to only apply to the same range as AMS spawns, so there's a reason for people to meet in the warpgate again.
    • Up x 1
  4. OldMaster80

    The mission system could be the answer. Players who want reinforcement could create a transport mission: pilots get xp for moving people around.
    • Up x 1
  5. zuka7

    There could be a simpler solution. Make the redeploy work so that when you redeploy you do so from the orbit and not the spawn room. You would be in a drop pod except this drop pod would be slow or it would have to slow down when at lets say 500m. Make these drop pods weak against flak or anything that shoots. Attackers would have to set up a defense and if they do so they would have advantage by shooting them out of the sky. If defenders got there before the attackers then game on. It should balance itself out but correct me if I'm wrong.

    Also make these drop pod have a window and no third person so that it feels claustrophobic while you watch all of the flak and tracers of doom. This would make some epic moments and scenery. Also you want be able to spawn in the base unless you reach the ground.
    • Up x 2
  6. LtSqueak

    Why are so many people against having a slightly slow but free way to get to a base, i.e. the HART of old?
    • Up x 2
  7. Whiteagle

    Because the HART required SANCTUARIES!
  8. Crator

    I agree completely... You forgot one of the redeploy options in PS1. You could also matrix to an AMS and spawn at it from anywhere as long as it doesn't get destroyed and is deployed.
    • Up x 1
  9. Smokki

    Faction A moves to capture base. Faction B redebloys inside the base. Close range cluster **** occurs inside the base while vehicles spam the base from outside. Either faction A camps faction B for few minutes and moves to next base or faction B destroy faction A Sunderers and moves to next base/redebloys elsewhere. Rinse and repeat every single time in every single base.

    I would rather have large scale combined arms battlelines forming on both side of the contested base flowing back and forth without stopping in bases for the usual cluster ****. Now all battles are fought in small areas a'la operation metro with 64 players on both sides, that gets old really fast.

    Instead of redebloying to the contested base (redeployside), players should spawn from nearby non contested bases or from sunderers that are being constantly pulled from those nearby bases. Contested bases should act as a no mans land without spawn cabability and fights should be fought between sunderers.
    • Up x 3
  10. LtSqueak

    Go to warpgate. Open new terminal. Select hex (single hex, not entire base area) that you want to go to. After pre-determined amount of time be dropped in a drop pod randomly inside of the selected hex.
    More people trying to drop at once takes longer.
    No sanctuary required.
  11. Einharjar

    Redeploying is considered a problem because it removes mechanics of the game that would've other wise made Planet Side 2 unique.
    PS2 is currently a mediocre game in which we see just how important "size" is... It's not. The game's revenue is proof of that. It's only surviving off of Whales like myself and others who've been here for a long time.

    Redeploying destroys any sense of logistics and logistics is needed to enforce scale.
    With redeploy, the vast seamless loading world I travel is constantly interrupted by LOADING SCREENS just like I kept logging into new Lobbies on a typical Arena Shooter. This is because redeploying is vastly more effeceient. It's faster, it's cheaper and I'm in total control, negating any discipline for team work what so ever.
    Redeploy allows me to take a platoon, and systematically hold over 4 bases simultaneously by plating Lead Frog. 3 Minute capture timers are so long when you consider that reinforcing a base may take you 50 seconds at longest when it comes to hopping. AND, it's stealthy. It's very sudden. The platoon arrives near instantaneously, with no warning signs, and no way to "intercept" or even "position" a flank to prep for my onslaught. And when it comes to attacking? Same bull crap applies.
    Defenders finally Teleport in, so we all leave to another base that has easy access to another target.
    Platoon + Squad redeploy WORSEN this and now attackers can port just as effeciently as defenders! (minus cool downs).

    Redeployside removes all logistics and consequence of your actions for when you utilize Bad or No-tactical / Strategic resolve. SO congrats, you win; you get to be babied and not have to think about the March, Force Marching, Insertion, Spearhead, Siege, Intercepts and Terrain.

    Second Result?

    The game feels a lot SMALLER than it's advertised.

    I think I may have two analogies for you; since I can't outright insult (been warned already for questioning why people even play PS2 if they just want EZ mode Arena bullcrap...)

    So you don't want a transport. Too lazy. Just want the gun fight.
    Redeployside is like buying a Viper but getting it equipped with an Automatic Transmission... Sure all you have to do is press the gas and just worry about going fast - but you're so lazy that you've neglected the feeling of having true CONTROL over your shifting! The danger of SCREWING IT UP or the thrill of GETTING IT RIGHT.

    Redeployside is like saying you're going to go sight see your country's landmarks just before you die; but you do it in said Viper going 180 MPH without stopping to even try the food! So focused are you on just getting their, that you don't even take a moment to look at the surroundings as they are still for a moment to take in the journey and EFFORT it takes to get there!

    In Sun Tzu's Art of War, Terrain is the most important thing to study and learn how to utilize effectively in Warfare. Not because of simple crap like "Get to high ground, it gets you easier head shots"; no. Actually if you read that chapter; it talks about the GRANDE scale positioning, the LOGISTICS. What roads are safe, what terrain is valuable and what each locale means to your success as a Commander. Redeployside? Ruins ALL of that. NO greatness exists in it. It is not impressive. It's not even a feature. It's just an implementation that benefits the lazy and ill fated individuals who lack any sense of a deeper game and wanton all conveniences possible so they can quickly pull the trigger and move on like some quickie.

    And just as an FYI, I completely understand the "lack of time" to play reasoning. I work A LOT and have a new daughter. I haven't even been on PS2 in... what over a month? (And I'm still paying for this silly thing ... hmmm...)
    But you know what? It's called being an Adult. If I don't have time for the game, I DONT HAVE TIME FOR THE GAME. I take it as it is, and I'd rather have a game that I know I could sink myself into when I set aside 2 to 4 hours JUST FOR ME than to have a game that tries to thrive on cheap 15 minute thrills that get repetitive and BORING after the first full hour...
    • Up x 6
  12. Astriania

    You quoted my post so I guess this is addressed to me. I'm not that against HART, but I think it's unnecessary given galaxy drops and it would have to be carefully balanced to make sure 48 people couldn't HART drop on demand every 5 minutes, because like redeployside there's no counter to HART drops.
    • Up x 1
  13. LtSqueak

    I do very much agree with nearly everything you said, except gal drops aren't made for individual players.
    Kinda like PS2 is pay-for-convenience (currently), I think there should be a free option for the casual players, but squads should have to pay resources to conveniently and quickly move their group around the map.

    But reading over some other comments (not sure who said it and no time to go find it currently, so sorry :( ) I would love to see the mission system completely overhauled to where gal pilots can state a destination and time to departure and start ferrying people.
    But keep the ability to deploy the three major facilities when they are not under attack (all adjacent bases must be friendly owned).
    But I would be afraid this would drive away even more players because of the convenience factor.
  14. Tuco

    30 friendlies move into a base, no enemies around, they bring with them 5 cloaked sunderers. So they spend their time dotting the landscape with about 300 PS1 mines, 150 PS1 spitfires, 50 PS1 motion detectors. The base is covered.

    2 minutes left on the cap a 60 enemy counter-zerg spawn in to "save the day". Not only do they have to fight through 30 of you, they also have to fight through 300 mines, 150 spitfires, 50 motion detectors, and 5 cloaked sunderers. Good luck, you have 2 minutes.

    Oh that's right, we don't have the PS1 AMS, PS1 mines, PS1 spitfires, PS1 motion detectors.
    • Up x 1
  15. Flashtirade

    Current redeploy mechanics trivialize transport vehicles. I don't see random galaxy taxis anymore. I don't see Flash hordes anymore. Sunderers were almost only used for AMS to the point that the ability was put in an entirely separate slot so people would be encouraged to use other options. Harassers were intended to be light transports but were used as and still are skirmishers. Redeploy-hopping along lattice lanes is a thing.

    The devs really need to think on how to make logistics work in this game.
  16. Whiteagle


    Gates that you can DRIVE through to get from one Continent to ANOTHER!

    You're all ******** and moaning about "Muh Logistics," but you apparently never considered the fact that, if one were to spawn and load up a Galaxy on Indar, they currently CANNOT take that Galaxy to Amerish...
    If you can't transfer Vehicles from one Front to another, what's the point in PULLING THEM?!?!
  17. FBVanu

    The big difference is that I can shoot down Galaxies.. . i can blow up Sunderers.. and they have to travel there first, while, hopefully, encountering our air.. they have to fight to get there.. then they have to fight to stay there....
    That is a LOT different than just hitting one button and tons of players spew out
    • Up x 2
  18. NoctD

    Sure you can in theory do that. You can also kill the guys that come out of a spawn room too.

    But an organized force you cannot stop alone. If you think the bunch of bozos who are partying at the cap point shooting bullets at the ceiling or totally gone AFK at an easy cap are looking to take out incoming Gals and such, then I don't know what game you've been playing. Cause all over the game there are just many terrible base captures in progress, done by people who have zero coordination and will totally get overwhelmed. There's even coordinated bads hoping for an easy capture that would get so ROFLstomped with real opposition.

    Try stopping a force of Gals with proper escorts or a sunderer train mixing up max level repair sundys with blockade sundys, you'll need a sizable force of your own and considerable coordination to have a hope of stopping them on the way over.

    Like I said at the start - you cannot really nerf teamwork. Those that want to crash a party - will crash the party anyways.

    But I've got no problems if the squad spawning options got to be more restrictive and made more sensible. Just don't touch the stuff that would affect everyone in the game, cause you will not accomplish anything at all.

  19. Astriania

    The thing is though you can do a lot against a platoon trying to gal drop you with two squads. Set up in the base, get 10 AV engineers and 10 AA MAXes or heavies (or hack the terminal and pull vehicles), and you'll take out or deter or at least spoil the dismount of the incoming platoon enough to make a difference.

    Let's address the serious issue with intra-continent redeploy first, because that's something that can be fixed with small changes (disallowing redeploy to contested bases should be a simple logic switch, adding SCUs in all bases is some work for the level designer but no serious overhaul). You're right, warpgates that take us between continents (and from a VR kitted out as a sanctuary to the main maps) would be awesome, but that's far less necessary for deeper logistics than a nerf to redeploy.
  20. Whiteagle

    There IS no issue with intra-continental redeploy!
    It takes 15 seconds to move between one Base to one IMMEDIATELY ADJACENT to it, you are adding another 15 second for every Base you have to jump between, UNLESS said Base is marked with "Reinforcements Needed".

    Like NoctD is saying, this has NOTHING to do with the ability to Redeploy, because anyone organized enough to abuse that System will just abuse any of the dozen of other Spawn Options available to them!
    Most of you just sound like your mad Reinforcements came to stop you to BEGIN WITH...