[Suggestion] Reasons why more people leave than stay?

What you're implying is players have to grind when in fact they don't.

Yes they don't HAVE to but they want to get their upgrades and weapons, so they actually have to.

Compacted for ctrl+c/ctrl+v when i do this. I will format it all correctly and present it nicely.

1. Each VP earned awards 7500 exp
2. Alerts award 22,500 exp (3 VPs) and a bonus 7500, so 30,000 total.
3. VPs are earned if you played on the continent for a meaningful amount of effort, even if you log off before the VP is gained. You get the exp next time you login. There is a limit to one hour after you logoff, those VP's don't count.
4. Contintent capture awards 30,000 exp to everyone online (and has participated). Those who logged off within an hour get the full exp when they login. Those that gained a VP while online but logged off more than an hour before the continent capped get 10,000 when they log in. Those that participated but didn't get a VP and logged off more than an hour before, get 5000 when they login next.
5. All VPs earned and continents capped while offline do not count towards anything. So if you capped Indar, then logged off, then it opened and capped again, you don't get anything for the stuff you weren't logged in for.
6. All bonuses modified by boosts, population (at the time of the event), and membership. So yeah.. a member with a boost running could see nearly 400 certs for their effort. That's the idea. Everyone has an incentive to win these things.

Koltyr

This was supposed to be a great improvement by giving new players a bridge into the game where they get soft exposure and, hopefully, an advanced tutorial on how the game works.

From my understanding, there are quite a number of players that feel that it is their duty to grief new players in order to "weed out the weak". I mean seriously, there are some players that think this way. They honestly think that driving new players away is good for the game.

The DEVs really need to do something to fix this even if it requires someone to get paid money to sit at a computer and watch Koltyr and lock griefers out of the zone manually if they can't put systems in place to lock out obvious griefing.

As I have said before, weapons should be locked to the basics while in Koltyr and do not allow and purchases or prior purchase while I this zone. Heck. I don't think you should even be able to spend CERTs gained in Koltyr while you are in Koltyr.

An Area for new players is just that. Don't allow Alts in there either.

K/D players

Are just going to sit back in a good place and kill until they it looks like they are going to get killed and go elsewhere.

The best confrontations I have been in have been massive battles where someone has to be ballsy enough to plow into the thick of it in order to bust the stalemate. The guy that is worked about his K/D is never going to be the one to bust up in there and cap the point. They are too busy not dying.

Who's looking out for the New Players?

I would think that part of the reason behind the Social Directives is to get new players into outfits quickly.

One would hope that outfits are willing to take time with new players to explain to them how to play the game and to answer their questions about how the game is played. This does happen in some outfits.

Perhaps a mentoring system should be set-up by the DEVs to allow players after a certain rank to become mentors for new players. Make it a CERT unlock for all I care. It grants the ability to start a squad that auto lists as "New Player Training" or "New Player Q&A". The squad only allows in characters under a the BR cap for the Mentoring/Drill Sargent directives.

I wouldn't mind this being set-up to temporarily disable all my weapons if it meant being able to lead squads in Koltyr. Would I do it all the time? No. But would I have the option to do it? Yes. And all my characters are still working on those directives.

One would think that mentoring in this manner would be a great outfit recruiting tool as well.

Getting players in outfits increases retention. Giving outfits tools to find and train new players to gain their dedication to their outfit? Seems like a win all the way around.

Heck, I wouldn't even mind having this option in the main game. Even if I couldn't do damage, I could still use my nanites to pull vehicles for the new players in the squad so that they could experience what it is like to have CERTed out equipment in the field (which is way different than doing so in VR).

Just some thoughts.

The tutorial is bad, was bad and probably will be so for all eternity
there'S a reason for that. It's really not so easy making an entrance to this game

The only one who could help new players in this game is YOU
Yeah you infront of the screen
Most players just ignore each other so much that they often end standing in front of friendly barrels

I've heard it's a european server problem that the prox-voice chat is exclusivly used for whining and dubstep-concerts at the warpgate
People need to talk more with eachother besides the /yellchat-warriors who sometimes do a great job at entertaining me

If there would be more communication via prox chat the noobs would at least get a small clue of what to do and where to go

The problem of cert points has to be viewed from two angles

The players want more bling fancy weapons and a tank that is a fortress and shreds everything
and they want it fast
Nobody expected that it would take you far beyond BR100 to cert out every loadout to your liking (without paying a single quantum of currency)

DBG wants ca$h
the more the better (i'm not criticizing they are a company that's what they do)
So it is not likely that they will lower cert cost or increase cert gain anymore

The +100cert per BR should be extended till BR100 anyway
For the newbs it's a perfect motivation and past BR50 100certs don't make so much a differance

for the character stats of about 6m and only 20% past BR10 should be mentioned that a year ago cert farming for newbs was the worst thing ever
Of course many players would quit befor BR10


The other problem especially with those COD people who keep spawncamping all day long has a very simple solution

Kills out of a spawnroom are not counted towards your statistics
They simply irritate the attackers

That would motivate the players to leave the spawnroom or if the enemy is overwhelming leave the base cause it's already lost

So the cheap kills would turn worthless

I can understand grinding for Directives, but grinding just to get weapons and upgrades?

You should plan on buying weapons with real money (with the understanding most are just sidegrades) and save your certs for things only certs can buy.

I agree with you, i've spent loads. If it was up to me then this game would have a sub and even upgrades would be purchasable but that is irrelevant.

What matters is that people like to get new weapons. What me or you think is irrelevant because not everyone thinks like that. I have heard plenty of people complain about 1k certs for a "samey type weapon" on the ps4 and have seen hundreds quit over the grind by now.

Yes we're fine with that, but that is not the point. We are not everyone and the player retention issues leans towards many more thinking it's too grindy than not. The fact we're here still means that we are fine with how it is, but the point is about new players and retention and what makes them leave almost x10 more than stay, not about what me or you think.

If you truly want planetside 2 to continue to exist... You're gonna have to kill a few liberals. Everyone's gotta do their part contribute to freedom.

That's F2P in a nutshell.

Instead of buying something with cash, they complain about grinding for it and then quit.

Yeah it's annoying. I'm sure they don't question buying crappy snacks and/or junk food now and then. I indoctrinate everyone who joins my outfit into understanding why spending is fine (our outfit camo is incline as well) and how they're not beating anything, just denying themselves stuff through cheapskate honour. I do it in any decent f2p actually.

But I think we need to pander to them a little somehow, not too much though.

I am getting off forumside now btw so i'll reply later/tomorrow to anything.

Except you don't. The act of normal gameplay is conductive to earning certs.

Grinding is going out of the way to do anything to gain certs, whether it be fun or tedious or even remotely related to what you actually plan to do once you gain those desperate certs. It doesn't have to help anyone or promote any objectives. And it's not necessary. And it's also not fun, at least I've never heard of someone claim it to be.

Grinding is work to get things you want.
There are two ways to get things you want... You either pay for it.. Or grind for it. If people can't u derstand this concept.. They should dish out 60$ for battlefront 3 and leave F2P for LIFE.

That's how F2P works... Stupid f'ing entitlement degenerates ruin everything....

Why should new players even bother to continue playing, let alone pay a monthly subscription, when they get constantly steam rolled by organized squads of BR-100s? After getting head shotted several times in a row, they'll simply leave and uninstall the game.

exactly. i didn't had any problems to grind for a 1k weapon ( maybe 1 - 2 weeks because i was lazy af xD) and i've seen the "pay with rl money" option only as a way to "skip time to get something" option and for me i reather grind for it then pay because that way you learn more about the game and improve yourself then simply buying a weapon.
i don't mind spending money here and there for stuff but i always chose grind over pay as long as its possible and ps2 is one of those f2p games that aren't p2w.

the reason why i stopped playing was the constant "cry for nerfs and balance" that ruined faction diversity. ( NS Striker and the VS Vulcan for example).
the game got boring because of the constant degeneration of faction diversity. ( more and more ns weapons showed up and faction traits kept taken and given to everyone)
oh and devs aren't even listening to their community as seen in the implementation of the ns striker ( it has received a lot of bad feedback (even more then good ones) but still got implemented)

one of the main reason why i played this game was faction diversity because most fps games don't have that and ps2 was unique.
i might give it another try tho

OP's wall o' text notwithstanding,

Problems in PS2 are simple:

It takes too long to find a good fight.
pop balance in battles sucks
everyone plays HA because they're OP

also lack of new content,
new content lately has been restricted to the archer, spitball turret, space pumpkins (soon to be space snowmen) and the 'get revenge' (aka give DBG money) button

the problem isn't the grind the problem is players focus on that grind at the cost of fun and then quit when they realize there likely will always be something more for them to want to get and then they quit.

having fun while earning certs is the important part.

Personally, I think they could do with addressing all the parts of the game that cause incredible frustration. Non-exhaustive list:

- getting killed in one hit when playing infantry. So many weapons can do this. It's rarely fun. Heck, it's not even fun to be in a tank and have the only way you can kill infantry be a direct hit. It doesn't feel like driving a tank, it feels like a heavily-armoured, motorised sniper rifle.
- air vs ground dynamics. It sucks when you're infantry and some dude in an aircraft apparently has nothing better to do than try to line you up specifically and nosegun/rocket pod you. It sucks when you're a tank and an aircraft is shooting you with the Dalton or Hornets or whatever and you have no way to respond. It sucks when you're in an aircraft and whenever you go near any significant fight you get three lockon warnings and flak starts exploding around you. The whole thing needs an overhaul so it is actually fun for both sides.
- tank mines. You use them, I use them, but they don't improve the game for anyone. They just make whoever gets killed by them feel frustrated and have less fun.
- light assault and SMG infiltrators. These classes more or less exist solely to shoot people in the back. Weirdly, being killed without being able to respond is frustrating. I think a theme is developing here.
- let's add repair. You shot a vehicle and did a bunch of damage? Oh, it drove behind a hill and ten seconds later it's back with full health, for free, and it can do this literally forever. Wonderful.
- C4. Yes, it's stupid. The only thing stopping it from being super out of place is so much else in the game is ridiculously frustrating. Still, it probably deserves to be higher on the list. Meanwhile, people will complain that they try to C4 stuff and fail all the time, so apparently they aren't finding that super fun either. This ties into the repair thing, because so often if you can't deal lethal burst damage to a vehicle all you're doing is making it drive behind a hill for a few seconds (if it even bothers doing that instead of just having the gunner hop out and repair it from behind).
- that stupid little tune that plays when you die on NC. I swear whoever put that there was actually trying to make people frustrated.
- I kinda want to mention the gunplay in general. So many of the fights are: you run around for some length of time, come face to face with someone, have a shootout lasting around a second, maybe less, then it's over. Feedback about what you did wrong tends to be poor, and fights are often confusing and quick, and when you die it frequently feels like you didn't accomplish anything - you knocked out someone's shields, they're probably healed and their shields are back up before you've even respawned. It rarely gets mentioned anymore, but the super low TTK probably isn't doing the game any favours in the frustration department.
- I've probably forgotten even more, because there are so many.

It makes me sad that these frustrations haven't been addressed over the years, even the gimmes like tank mines, and I feel like so much of the player attrition is to the anti-fun this huge list of issues generates, especially to players who are new and don't know how to mitigate them yet.

Yeah it's not fun and neither is having to spend ages just playing for it. When have you not heard people comment on having to grind?. Who in their right mind just plays normally, knowing that doing so increases the time it will take to get what they want?. It's not like they can spice it up either as they have nothing.

It's a grind no matter how you want to dress it and this Isn't and issue for me. If i want something so badly, i buy it. We're talking about the average newb, 1 of the huge percentage of players who quit.

Until dbg comes out and says they don't give a toss about the players who are turned off by the cert costs, i'll continue to see it as something that puts people off the game in large numbers. We have a very unique game that allows people to play without the usual constraints, yet barely anyone stays. I think the grind is a big part of it.

Pay up or shut up just Isn't working, unfortunately.

Have fun with what?.

You mean getting facerolled by those who have everything lol.

Look, guys.

Maybe i'm inadvertently being a social justice hero here but i care about the game. I can't tell now if i'm having a feelings attack or i'm on the right track with cert costs but i have heard it a lot in the past and hearing it a lot on ps4.

The ps4 is where we're at after 3 years!. There's still millions on the pos3 so it should get better though.

Does anyone have a decent rebuttal to why cert costs should be lowered a bit?. I'd rather i stopped giving a crap now to be honest, valid game issues aside.

Save me from myself!

No please,if the certs system was same as PC version,it take much time for buy/upgrade things. Ive heard that certs system on Ps4 is much better,so keep this as is actually.

If you want to actually enjoy your time in the game, you do NEED to grind the hell out certs and buy stuff. Don't believe me? Make a new account and try to have normal week of fun. If you do more than simply doing a single thing over and over again, you will find a huge wall of grind between you and the variety of game play you would like to enjoy.

Power disparity between new players and players with a lot of certs and options has gotten bad since launch. For a new player today, the game is not a level PvP playing field. Nanoweave is a numerical advantage. SMGs have a numerical advantage in TTK, due to high rate of fire and low hipfire bloom (that one is directly pay2win sadly). Every single vehicle is garbage until it has thousands of certs, because... so many other people have thousands of certs into theirs that give them numerical advantage over uncerted vehicles.

To say new players don't need to grind is simply ignorant.