Railjack - A Good Rifle

Discussion in 'Infiltrator' started by Shadowstorm, Jun 20, 2014.

  1. Shadowstorm

    Hello fellow Planetsiders.

    A quick review of myself, I've played Planetside the original since its conception, and Planetside 2 since its beta and eventual release, without a doubt there is one thing in this game I love more than anything else, that's Infiltrator, and sniping.

    So with a large amount of experience and a hugely successful career as a sniper, I wanted to share experiences and suggestions about the relatively new Bolt Action sniper rifle, the Railjack.

    First of all, lets try not to get disillusioned with numbers and personal opinions about whether or not this rifle is good or not, I've seen evidence a-plenty that support both arguments using both analytical means and subjective experiences.

    The truth of the matter is, this weapon is awesome. Some say that the .2 second delay before firing is an issue, its not. Like a lot of weapons in Planetside with their own characteristics, whether its muzzle climb or high match velocity rounds, you have to get used to the way the weapon fires. I didn't want to make a comment until I had plenty of experience, I've used the sniper rifle for just 3 days now, racked up 200 kills with only a few hours each day. It didn't take long to get used to the delay, and once its in your muscle memory, the effect or "disadvantage" is negligible.

    Now its evident that this sniper rifle was intended for use at maximum ranges. That the lack of bullet drop and extremely high velocity give you as an advantage it draws on your skill as a sniper to account for the .2 second delay. That being said, once you have mastered that, the weapon is incredible. Interestingly enough, very few of my kills were at maximum range. I like to reposition, anywhere between medium range headshots. To close range reaction shots. With the NS-44 Commissioner at my side, putting a quick Railjack round into someone and switching to pistol and capping someone, at point blanc range, is extremely effective.

    I honestly don't see a downside, the extra damage is marginal, sure, but it makes the difference between 4 kills with a 4 round clip, or the Longshot, where you are more likely to get 3 kills with a 5 round clip or even more likely, killed because it takes multiple pistol shots at close range to dispatch a target.

    Some would argue that this weapons advantages are outweighed by its disadvantages, but if you are a haptic sniper, and can learn to use to pre-empt enemy movements, which you really should be able to do as a sniper. Then give it a try, you'll be pleasantly surprised.

    Any disagreements, questions, or suggestions and similar experiences, please post below, so we can learn from one another. I would especially like to hear from other faction's Infiltrators as to the effectiveness of their own corresponding rifles.

    • Up x 1
  2. Mustarde

    Just wondering, how hard did you find it to hit moving targets? How does it compare with moving targets to the longshot or bolt driver?
  3. m44v

    Is just another longshot, of course is going to be a good rifle, using one of the other is just a matter of taste.
  4. Shadowstorm

    Hey dude,

    Yeah, at first I will admit, hitting moving targets was a nightmare, but the bullet velocity and lack of bullet drop to kind of make up for it, at first. But once you get used to the delay and the lead time having to be "Held" for .2 seconds, it becomes far easier than that of the Longshot. Whilst the number crunchers might disagree, in practice at a distance of extreme ranges the difference in bullet drop is substantial between the Longshot and the Railjack, I find that the smaller compensation required for the Railjack is more intuitive and natural, and as a result, once you get used to the lag time, it actually becomes easier. But pre-empting movements, distance compensation, mil-dot usage and lead time are all skills of a sniper, irrespective of what weapon you are using, you are either very good at it or not. Practice makes perfect as with everything mind you.

    Dont get me wrong, the Longshot is still a fantastic rifle, and if it wasn't for the cool reload animation, the slightly better damage, and the cool model, I would still be using the Longshot. But I genuinely believe that as a sniper, my role is to take the hardest hitting single shot highest accuracy weapon available, aka. the Railjack, and just learn myself out of the disadvantages until there are none.

    Ultimately this takes a weapon with pros and cons, and turns them into just pros, and therefore the better weapon.

    • Up x 2
  5. Baccano

    Honestly it's a rifle that is capable of killing but it isn't worth 1k certs to unlock (Outside of Raxin' it). As of this writing I have 1426 kills with it so I have quite a bit of time with it.

    This has been hashed out in many threads already but here's the really short version:

    It has no real niche where it out performs or set it's self aside. Unlike the BoltDriver, LA80, and Longshot that trade Velocity, Recamber, and Reload times to give you different flavors for different situations or playstyles the RailJack falls short of this sort of trade off to gain something.

    You might say the velocity is what you get for the long reload, short mag, and long rechamber but velocity only matters in the time it takes the bullet to reach your targets head.

    The number crunchers you dismiss have already proven that (and using it in game will bear this out) if you are less than 130m from your target my Longshot bullet will kill the target before your bullet leaves the barrel even if we pulled the trigger at the exact same instant.

    So what does that mean as a RailJack user? If you're squaring off against the likes of Mustarde he's going to win unless your reaction time is .2 sec faster than his and I'm betting his reaction times are on the order of .3 or .4 sec already

    So now that we've establish that the RailJack doesn't win in the short range of BAs let's look at the long range. Does it even beat the BoltDriver (default sniper for NC)? Not until you get to the 300m mark. And forget about ever killing sooner than the LA80 and Longshot you would need about 100 more meters than you have render.

    So if you happen to like the rifle that's fine but please don't advertise this as good rifle. Advertise it as a cool looking rifle with a nice cute reload animation but is ultimately not a competitive rifle for advanced BA Sniper Infils.

    I do plan to revisit this rifle once I finish my goals with the Longshot but it will be because I want to fool around and look cool.

    • Up x 7
  6. Mathgeekjoe

    Your point is void. The advantage of the Longshot isn't the kill time, it is the accuracy. Just because your bullet meets your target first, doesn't mean anything if you miss because of drop or lead.
    • Up x 1
  7. Wobulator

    I bought the Railjack during the Memorial day sale, and so far I enjoy it a lot. I'm easily making shots that I never could on the bolt driver because of the delay- it lets me compensate much more easily for moving targets. Also, for sniping, the time between the Longshot and the Railjack really is negligible. It's clearly meant for render distance sniping, and it works quite well for me.
  8. 7 Drunk Midgets

    I have messed around with the rifle in VR, and I can see how someone could make the case of saying that you would get used to the delay mechanic. If you master the idiosyncrasies of the Railjack, I could see it becoming a very powerful tool, and I have lost many a sniper duel against the thing due to the sheer bullet velocity.
  9. Sworaven

    I know some people who genuinely like it but I did not enjoy it that much. Sure, it's easy hitting stationary targets because you barely have to account for bulletdrop but hitting moving targets is a lot harder because of the delay.

    The Railjack is very effective at renderdistance-sniping but that playstyle has never really been my thing. So I'm guessing this falls under the "personal opinion"-category. I you like sniping from extreme ranges, you'll probably enjoy the Railjack. If you're a close/midrange sniper, not so much.

    Overall I still think most longrange snipers are better off with the EM4 Longshot. Bulletdrop is something you can easily learn after some practice and that's exactly the only advantage the Railjack has: barely having to account for bulletdrop. If you go with the Longshot, you'll have a bigger ammo-pool and you'll be more confident in your ability to hit moving targets if you're used to the conventional sniper rifles.
    • Up x 1
  10. Wobulator

    To me, the delay is a positive. Of course the bullet drop is nice, but by no means necessary. The delay lets me adjust for moving targets much more easily.

    But at the end of the day, it's really just personal preference. I like the Railjack, you don't.
  11. Vaphell

    i am at 1000+ kills with it and my previous opinion improved a bit from utter crap to somewhat usable, but still inferior to tier2/3.

    RoF and frequency of reloads are atrocious, no other way to describe it. You can't be aggressive with this weapon and you reload all. the. *******. time. It's a bushwookie noobkiller - if it stands still it dies no questions asked, but the rifle is nearly useless in close/mid under pressure. 1k kills and for the life of me i couldn't figure out the leading on moving targets. I don't even try anymore because reloading, so much reloading >_<
    • Up x 1
  12. minhalexus

    It's a matter of play-styles.

    If you're an aggresive sniper, you won't like this gun.
    If you're a sniper with precision, you will probably like it.
  13. Baccano

    Oh boy here we go again...

    First things first if you like the RailJack that's fine but the RailJack is objectively inferior to the tier 2 and 3 Bolt Actions.

    Now to answer your comment about accuracy I'm going to assume you mean the way velocity affects drop and lead time and not that the weapon is somehow more accurate than any other Bolt action rifle.

    Please reference this handy chart

    The numbers assuming both bullets leave the barrel at the same time:

    Range_____Longshot 650m/s________________RailJack 850m/s_________Difference in time

    50m_________ .07 sec _______________________ .05 sec _________________ .02 sec

    100m________ .15 sec _______________________ .11 sec _________________ .04 sec

    150m________ .23 sec _______________________ .17 sec _________________ .06 sec

    200m________ .30 sec _______________________ .23 sec _________________ .07 sec

    250m________ .38 sec _______________________ .29 sec _________________ .09 sec

    300m________ .46 sec _______________________ .35 sec _________________ .11 sec

    So what can we infer from this chart?

    That even if the RailJack had No Trigger Delay, the RailJack and the Longshot would both kill the same target doing the same thing before the target could react (a humans reaction time and ability to move measured by hundredths of a second is nonexistent). Willing to make the hypothetical at the 300m mark only if your aim was slightly off you might hit with the RailJack and not the Longshot but that scenario assumes you screwed up in which case it's more likely that you miss by a few pixels not just one.

    So what does this mean in game? With the trigger delay you need to either Lead More with the RailJack than the Longshot or you must continue to move your crosshair at the same relative speed as your target for an additional .2 seconds plus maintain the lead you need until your bullet leaves the barrel.

    I don't know about you but I would argue that this is more difficult than simply pulling the trigger with a Longshot.

    Now for the Drop Argument:

    The Longshot has no noticeable drop out to the 225m mark and only drops to the first mil dot at the 300m mark (values for 74 fov 12x scope). So if you are having problems in this 75m range with judging drop that only has to be measured by one mildot I don't think you're going to see the difference.

    The next weird thing is when you realize that at the 300m with the RailJack (values for 74 fov 12x scope) you still need to aim with the first mil dot to hit your target in the head. But wait a min I have to do that with the LongShot too where's that extra velocity that the RailJack has that's supposed to help?

    Unfortunately the difference at the 300m mark is so minuscule as to not matter. The actual difference is that the RailJack uses the first mildot aim pointed on the nose of the target's face to get the headshot at 300m and the Longshot uses the first mildot aim pointed on the targets forehead to get the headshot at 300m.

    As an advanced sniper I know the differences but I'm willing to bet most people don't need to be this precise and won't really see the difference between that slight upside at the very edge of infantry render range.

    Now if you are a beginning sniper that snipes render range against people just standing still and you need the help by all means feel free to use the Railjack (forget about moving targets unless you want add that weird leading/dragging problem we discussed earlier), but you will never learn to become as quick or accurate as someone who uses any of the other rifles for both long range and short range.

    If anyone wants to test things in game or discuss this further I'm all up for it but my current opinion is that All ESSR's are sidegrades to weapons already in game but are actually slightly worse for the roles they are intended.

    The Phaseshift it's heat mechanic and no bullet design is kinda cool but for the love of god fix that semi-auto fire mode and maybe give it an alt fire mode that passively charges the shot so it's less annoying for the user.

    The Trap could use more ammunition in reserve and maybe slightly adjust the recoil for the burst shots to tame it a little.

    The RailJack.... honestly I would be happy with a reduction to either the chamber time to be near the LA80's chamber time or give it the reload times short and long near the BoltDriver's reload times.

    If anyone else has other ideas by all means post them. The ESSR's just need a little more QoL love.

    • Up x 3
  14. Plunutsud pls

    Tried the Jack on an alt and didn't like it compared to the Phaseshift, only 4 rounds and slow reload.

    The Phaseshift can get 2 ohk rounds off within half a second of each other, reload is faster and ammo is infinite, plus zero bullet drop at any range.

    Only thing I liked about the Jack is the velocity and the gun model itself.
  15. Mathgeekjoe

    Oh boy it is the chart that I saw earlier and is misused. 0.11 seconds difference at 300 meters means nothing because humans cant react that fast. LOL this argument.

    By that same argument, I could say there is no point to the Longshot over the Bolt Driver.

    Hmm time it takes the Bolt Driver to hit 300 meters-- 0.5454545 seconds
    Time it takes the Longshot to hit 300 meters----------- 0.4615385 seconds
    Difference-------------------------------------------------------- 0.0839160 seconds. Notice something, oh wait the difference is smaller than the .1085973 seconds difference between Longshot and Railjack.

    So um, well people forget to use parallelism in statistics. o_O

    Now dealing with drop, lets assume that they have the same gravitation pull. Now drop would be times it takes to get to target squared and multiplied by gravitation pull.

    Now lets compare the drop between the Bolt Driver, Longshot, and RailJack. at 300 meters.
    BoltDriver takes .5454545 seconds to target, squared is .2975 drop
    Longshot takes .4615385 seconds to target, squared is .2130 drop
    Railjack takes .3529412 seconds to target, squared is .1246 drop
    Difference between Bolt Driver and Longshot, is .0845
    Difference between Longshot and RailJack, is .0885

    So difference in drop is also bigger than that between Bolt Driver and Longshot.
  16. Baccano

    Except all three Long Range Bolt Action Rifles are balanced by three things:

    Velocity - Time it takes your bullet to reach your target; affecting lead distance and drop.(Non-hampered by some weird trigger delay of .2 seconds. Although maybe some people like an artificial 200ms lag on top of everything else)

    Reload time - How much time is spent loading your magazine makes a difference to the amount of kills possible in your session. The longer the reload the less potential kills over time.

    Rechamber - An even more visceral stat which limits your killing potential as well as ability to quickly place follow up shots if you did not land that perfect headshot.

    The RailJack is worse at all three. It has the longest Rechamber time. The longest Reload time. The velocity doesn't matter because you are already limited by trigger delay which ensures your bullet will always reach it's target last inside of infantry render range. (It will beat the BoltDriver bullet at exactly the 300m mark but not by a time frame worth mentioning)

    Love the math it will help illustrate my point.

    So if the math bears out at 300m the difference in RailJack and Longshot drop is 8.8 centimeters (and that's in game not on your screen). For that your willing to put up with the 200ms of trigger delay, horrible rechamber time, terrible reload times, and less ammo in the magazine? o_O

    The difference between the Longshot and the RailJack's aim point is literally half the size of a mildot at 300m if you want a headshot. Feel free to test it out in the VR if you don't believe me. Drop is one of the least concerns between the BA rifle variants.

    Numbers are fun but don't forget to tell people how it translates to in game performance as well. :D

    As long as we're doing this again how does your in game NC char fair while using this weapon? Perhaps a link to your players stats? You seem like a vehement proponent of this rifle. I can only imagine your Char also backs this opinion with suitable in game experience as well.

    Feel Free not to respond to that last part just some good-natured ribbing ;)

    • Up x 1
  17. Mathgeekjoe

    Just like to point out the math behind it. It is funny how you can spin numbers to one way or an other based on what point you want to make (of coarse politicians take the cake here). Hmm funny thing about zoom, the farther out you go, the smaller things get. Sooo at ranges a small difference in your scope's mildots, is a big difference in drop and your ability to hit targets. Lets put it this way, 300 meters is twice as far as 150 meters, any length at 150 meters is half as much as 300 meters, any area at 150 meters is a fourth of what it is at 300 meters. So yeah, a difference of lets say half the length of a mildot is doubled when you compare it between 150 and 300 meters. Did I forget to mention the size of the head of a person at this range?;)

    And dealing with playing with the weapon itself, you don't need to play with it to know the numbers. My computer wouldn't do the gun justice, and my currently slow Internet leaves me unable to play the game at all. How can I say it is good when I haven't really used it?:eek: Well FYI I am just defending some of the people above who say it is a good weapon and have used it. Hmm isn't that weird, some people like using it. There must be a reason why? ;)

    Why don't you ask Shadowstorm why he think it is a good weapon.:D
  18. Baccano

    And I love that you point out those numbers, an informed player base is a good thing. I've also never spun the numbers I always back it up with what those numbers mean in game.

    And you are correct about differences is size based on visual distance, but your drop formula is not subject to difference in zoom or visual perception based on distance. If you aim at a specific point on a wall 300m away, fire both rifles at that point your bullet impact difference is only 8.8 centimeters. Thats in game not your screen don't forget so not subject to difference in FoV or scope type.

    Now if the Models of the characters' heads follow real life the average head length from chin to top is approx. 10 inches or 25.4 centimeters. So that means at 300m the drop difference it only 8.8 cm. You are likely going to succeed in hitting the head with either rifle needing only minuscule adjustments to your aim point to ensure a headshot.

    In game (this is the numbers to real play comparison not subject to conjecture or theorycrafting and is repeatable by anyone) this means that with the RailJack you can aim at the opponents nose with the first mildot (74 degree FoV and 12x scope) and get a headshot and with the Longshot (same FoV and scope) you would aim for just above the eyebrow line to get a headshot. In game, with the settings mentioned, this is half a mildot width.

    No you don't need to play with it to know the numbers since the numbers can be seen outside of the game. You do need to play with it to know how those numbers translate into the use of the weapon and whether it is more appropriate to use a certain weapon in a certain scenario. Not that that means you can't use it just that you run the risk of being at a disadvantage. :eek:

    Just seems odd to defend a weapon that you haven't really used is all o_O

    Thinking something is a good weapon is fine however you are making a subjective statement requiring a comparison. Good compared to what? Using the other Long Range Bolt Action rifles as your comparative metric leaves the RailJack falling short in every category: Bullet Time to Target, Rechamber Time, Reload time, and even Ammunition available :confused:

    Like I said if I were to give it a slight buff it would be to the Rechamber or Reload times nothing that directly affects it's power against a single target just it's performance over a given period of time.

    I don't think it's unreasonable to give the RailJack something to make it more of a sidegrade niche choice instead of an overall downgrade. I would have payed 700SC for a re-skin of my Longshot to look like the Railjack if I was able.

    • Up x 1
  19. Mathgeekjoe

    Just like to point out the measurement your using is based on FoV, since your measurement is based on what you see through the scope, IE the mildot.

    I guess the word spun was the wrong word for me to use, since we are not Politians but reasonable people. I use the word spin because your measurement of mildots is based on scope and the difference between two points in the scope are amplified at distance.

    :D I am glad you measured the drop in cm and inches rather than scope.:D

    Well unfortunately I can't test anything on planetside 2 right now (bad internet), and before when I had good internet I had a slow computer (so using any sniper would have been an bad idea).

    Well I defend the lasher as well, I have ran into a lot of situations were the a lasher held back my teammates.

    Well I would like to point out that shadow has explain why he finds it better than the Longshot, and gives several comparisons.
    I really don't know if you read what shadowstorm posted yet, so I will quote what I find best explains my argument.

    • Up x 1
  20. Baccano

    The drop from your formula was the main calculation; the reference to FoV and a 12x was to illustrate what that looks like in game using a FoV and scope that most long range snipers are likely to be using. Clearly if someone uses a different FoV or scope their in game aim points will need to be adjusted but the effect of the drop is still the same regardless, only an 8.8 cm difference at 300m

    And your formula helped illustrate the slight variance. As long as SoE's weapon stats are real world applicable :D

    And that's fine. I too have used a lasher on occasion and understand it's niche and can explain which situations to use it over an LMG, eg needing to suppress a doorway on the defense from inside a building is a pretty good place to use it.

    The RailJack just doesn't have anything going for it that gives it a niche. That is not to say you can't get kills or enjoy the RailJack, heck I enjoyed the Beta version of the lasher when it was a 15m ghostbuster laser :D

    But ultimately it wasn't a competitive HA weapon so it was changed.

    If you gave the RailJack the rechamber time close to the LA80 you would give it a situational niche. Against another tier 3 rifle infil you still won't win a direct 1v1 duel unless your opponent has a worse reaction time but, you will be able to have a follow up shot ready before your opponent if either person failed to kill. This is then counterplayed by your opponent recognizing that he should seek cover until his next shot is ready and not stay in the open leaving himself vulnerable to your quicker follow up shot.

    If SoE needs to rebalanced I'm sure they will but for the moment it lacks as a competitive rifle choice and is merely a weapon just for flavor's sake. A tier 2 / 3 rifle will still be better at long range for high skilled players.