Please Wait 96 Hours Before Panicking about the PTS Changes

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Insignus, Apr 19, 2017.

  1. stalkish

    Came here looking for an announcement......found some1 pretending to be able to tell the internet how to behave.
    I lol every time at that.
    Incorrect use of PSA.

    Small note on Phoenix for future, when you fire it, you become the rocket, so whatever side of the tank you hit it does the damage corresponding to that side.
    So if you could somehow manage to steer your rocket 180 degrees and hit a tank in the rear, youll do rear damage, even if launching from the front.

    Old data, but the fact that for an entire year the stats are pretty much the same says a lot:

    Seems to me that the lancer is the best at AV, the striker is best at AA, and the phoenix is best at killing infantry (probably MAXs).
    Whod have thought wed have asymmetrical balancing on this game huh.....?
    • Up x 3
  2. Villanuk

    The test server is static, have been if their? I used it to see if it has changed and its still easy to use and now with more damage this will get used more than anything i bet you.

    So again, would you have the striker or Phoenix and are you saying the Phoenix needed a buff?
  3. Villanuk

    Indeed, and the graphics look dam good. I think ive had enough of DBG.
  4. boey

    Come up with data that shows, that the Phoenix needed a buff. I would say, that Phoenix's, Strikers and Lancers were quite well balanced till now.
    So, if you buff one of these weapons you also have to buff the other ones.

    Or in an asymetrical balance way, you have to buff something else on the TR or VS side to make up for it.

    Oracle of death only shows old data from last year, but from playing experience i would say nothing really has changed that much:
  5. DarkStarAnubis

    Phoenix from the spawn room (or from an out of reach/out of sight point otherwise it is tantamount to suicide to use those slow rockets) are wonderful weapons to kill Sunderers that usually shielded from direct fire, behind hills around the base - shoot the first one using "T" to get full view and explore, find a target and hammer it with the following ones. Kill a couple of Sunderers and you can break a siege situation. Those weapons are useful.

    Otherwise, you can use those for fun and kill lazy snipers or Flashes if you lead enough or scare tanks.
  6. LodeTria

    It's in most cases it is 1 more rocket to kill targets, but reload speed got buffed alot, so it's an overall buff for launchers.
    • Up x 2
  7. Campagne

    +1'd for the rest of the post, but the Phoenix in its current live state is actually the worst for killing infantry.

    This is because it requires two direct hits to kill standard infantry, has horrible DPS via terribad reload and lamentable projectile velocity & acceleration, and its slow-moving, bright blue projectile can easily be shot off target with a single bullet from any weapon.

    As far as I can recall, the Striker can at least kill in one mag if every shot manages to hit, and Lancer's amazing velocity obviously makes it quite easy to land two direct hits much faster than a Phoenix. I'm sure some of this might change, but we'll have to see.

    (As for MAXes, I'd put my money on the Lancer.)
  8. DarkStarAnubis

    Just my 0.02 EUR, by reading the notes it is kind of unclear at least to me: each launcher got some buff (ammo, reload time) and nerf (damage, direct and blast).

    The only launcher which got an overall buff is the Phoenix: shorter reload time, more damage, more ammo.
  9. LodeTria

    The current live phoenix has low damage but a very good resistance table which is what determines it's actual damage to vehicles, and is unique to each one. So for example, the live phoenix has a -295% damage modifier to ESF, which allows it to 1hko them. Keeping it below 1000 damage and having -% modifiers (which give bonus damage) allows it to 1hko ESF, but not 1hko an infantry-man. You can see this for most weapons here:

    Note, the wiki table will be out of whack when the changes go to live.

    The PTS one has been moved to a generic "launcher" table, and as a result it was doing worse damage than before. This is why the damage has increased, as it was now under-performing on the new table.
    • Up x 1
  10. Demigan

    Not exactly proof but I've already seen some of the video's (one of which I skipped over at first) so yes I agree.

    Keep in mind that this is an iterative process (at least they claim it is), and I expect that this was first and foremost a change to remove the resistances and communicate clearer how powerful a weapon is against vehicles.
    Considering how they've already did do a lot of changes before releasing things, the Rocklet Rifle for example springing to mind where they removed it after testing and gave it another go-over before releasing it, I think they are actually on to something. Obvious problems like an AI gun like the Canister out-performing a dedicated AV gun will definitely be tackled.
  11. Insignus

    My objective is always advisory. I don't tell people what to believe, or how to behave. I ask and advise people on what will be most effective, in my opinion and experience. You don't want to do that, then you're free to not do that.

    But, to your other point. You're telling me that my behavior using the PSA was improper.

    Are you not then creating an implication that you can tell me, on the internet, how to behave?

    Its an announcement/advisory notice for public service purposes.
    • Up x 2
  12. LaughingDead

    All fairness it is a misleading title, I could easily imagine someone misinterpreting that as "devs are going to to change pts in 3 days", as such I'd recommend using a different tag next time.
  13. stalkish

    Well the phoenix gets the most kills, but the least vehicle kills and least aircraft kills?

    I mean what else is it killing?o_O
    Seems like a logical conclusion to me.

    Dont forget engineer turrets.
  14. stalkish

    Correct or incorrect?
    Using PSA, when there is no announcement is incorrect.

    This is not a how to behave suggestion, its clear cut example of you being incorrect.

    And in any case if you want to get semantic about it, i said 'incorrect use of PSA'
    I didnt say, 'dont use PSA' or 'you shouldnt be using PSA' or 'stop using PSA'.
    I simply stated it was an incorrect use of PSA.
    I did not at any point suggest anyone behave in a certain way.
  15. WTSherman

    Regarding the "Phoenix damage buff", this misconception is exactly why they are trying, however incompetently, to simplify the resist system.

    While the Phoenix's base damage is increased from 750 to 875, its real damage is a different story. Because its damage type is getting consolidated with the other rocket launchers. This means it's losing the unique Phoenix damage type, which is a whopping 167% bonus.

    So it's not really going from 750 to 875. It's going from 2002 to 875, a massive reduction in real damage. However, this nerf is not as big as it seems either: vehicles are getting their armor removed. This armor on MBTs generally reduces all incoming damage to between one-half and one-third of its base damage.

    What is the net result of all this?

    Well... the Phoenix's damage is basically staying the same. It's just takes a much more direct route to get there. It is getting nerfed against Sunderers and Harassers, because those just didn't have as much armor, so the removal of armor doesn't hurt them as much. But against MBTs and Lightnings, the Phoenix's real damage is pretty much unchanged.

    This removal of armor also means something else important: any weapon whose base damage was nerfed by less than 60% will generally see its real damage go up against tanks, not down. Simply because removing armor makes that much difference.

    There are a lot of things wrong with the PTS update, but this is not one of them. If nothing else, PS2's damage system did need to be made vastly more transparent. Because you know what the kicker is? That huge information dump that takes up most of this post? NONE OF THIS IS DISPLAYED ANYWHERE IN THE GAME.

    And that's ridiculous. Almost nobody has any idea how much damage most AV weapons actually do. And can you blame them? The vehicle damage system is an arcane maze of insanity that the game doesn't even make the slightest attempt to explain.

    However, while I do admire an attempt to cut through that maze and make the system actually comprehensible to the average player, they have ushered in a whole new set of problems with this approach. Namely, they have nerfed every single weapon massively against infantry. So unless they want infantryside to be utterly ascendant, they're going to have to entirely overhaul infantry damage and/or HP too.
    • Up x 3
  16. Pikachu


    This also goes for acceleration. I remember at MAX update spring 2013 falcon projectiles was said to have it's velocity raised from 90 m/s to 100. What the notes and in game info didn't mention was that this is the max velocity after acceleration. It started at ~50 then had a super slow negligible acceleration towards 100.
  17. Campagne

    Hard to say where the extra kills are coming from. All I can say is that the Phoenix is terrible against infantry.

    Maybe people just like to hit infantry with them anyway? I must confess to steering a rocket or two at randos from time to time. :p
  18. WTSherman

    It's probably entirely engineer turrets. Phoenix can't one-shot infantry, but it can one-shot a MANA turret. And if the Engineer happens to be sitting in the turret at the time, they'll die too, and the Phoenix gets the kill credit.
  19. ColonelChingles

    Pretty much. Part of my analysis on the impact on the Lightning:

  20. LaughingDead

    Can we panick now?