One idea for the "OMG OP" Striker.

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Earthman, Oct 7, 2013.

  1. DeadliestMoon

    What people don't realize is that the Striker was dominating as a team weapon, just like Lancer is. Only difference is that the Lancer doesn't warn you that you're going to be shot down.
  2. Thovargh

    I love how forumside made the striker into a fear weapon.
    I've cleared entire air spaces without shooting down a single plane just because pilots think "OMG OP STRIKER" and vacate the space
    • Up x 1
  3. Earthman

    Skyguards have that effect, too.

    But I don't think skyguards will be nerfed anytime soon, thankfully. The Church of Skill has its witch-hunts focused on anything with a lock on and often anything with an explosion radius. Sort of sad.
  4. Santondouah



    So actually you want to be able to kill infantery with it ? Vehicles are not enough ^^
    IMO a balanced solution would be to remove one rocket in the clip and let everything else just as it is.
  5. IronWarrior

    So it's weaker then all the other launchers? What would be the point of taking the risk to fire 4 rockets against 1 rocket which does more damage?
  6. Santondouah


    I used to flee strikers even before coming on forumside... Strikers are really much more efficient than NC (Phoenix, HAHAHA) and VS equivalents (Lancer, quite good though). When I spawn a liberator my lifetime is average 4-5 time higher in VS areas than in TR areas, really (I play NC). Same reasoning when you spawn a lightning or vanguard and when you hear vulcains... I instinctly get very careful facing these weapons (as a reminder: vulcain, strikers) whereas versus VS I just play normally, even when AV ZOEs are in the neighborhood...

    and yes, "fear" is the world
  7. DirtyRoger

    There was a bug that make you use the striker in dumb fire for the last 2 missiles if the target was destroyed by a third party, but you had to be fast because it vanish if you stop shooting. I killed a scattermax with it. Imagine his rage lol

    Like Roll Flizzebeef said anyway. No more scatmaxes and glowing ballerinas inside biolabs, guaranteed (awesome)
  8. HadesR

    If the AI capabilities were a problem they could nerf it's AI dmg like they did the Nix while retaining it's AV standing.
  9. MurderBunneh

    How bout put the other 2 ESRL on par with the striker instead?
  10. Slandebande

    Why a Vulcan would scare you in a Vanguard (which can win any close range engagement) is completely beyond me.
  11. Santondouah


    please don't say ridiculous stuff and consider the damage per clip.. Comparing the damage per rocket is totally ridiculous. A few maths : 5*500 = 2500 damage. AA NC/VS rockets = 1500 damage or 1250 for the both air/ground lock one. Please...
    And if you don't agree with me, just go to VR training and see the TTK on ESFs...
  12. Santondouah


    FYI vanguards do not have a huge shotgun that makes them magically OP in close range. I agree that Vanguard is very competitive in one-to-one MBT fight but don't you find amazing that sometimes in close range you see an AP-equipped prowler driver switch from the first seat to the vulcain seat ? Moreover and usually when I get killed by a Prowler AP+vulcain if it is less than 50m from me I get more damage from the vulcain than from the main gun... If you do not agree with, just play NC a few days.

    When I say that I fear vulcain it is less when they are mounted on prowlers than when they are mounted on harrassers. I stopped counting the number of times a Harrasser got behind me when I was in my lightning and destroyed it in less than 4 secs... OK weak point, CQB blablabla, but the combo harrasser+vulcain is just crazy... Otherwise how can you explain that so much players use it (most TR harassers you see on the battlefield) whereas NC harrassers use Halberd only ? (executor is far less competitive).
  13. lilleAllan

    nerf range to 300 m and call it a day
  14. Slandebande

    Well first of all I was referring to Vanguard, not Lightnings. A Lightning will have it tough against most targets these days, and has to fight against the odds for its wins. Most experienced TR Harasser crews use the Halberd, simply because it is much more versatile, it opens up new targets that the Vulcan can only dream of attacking effectively, and it allows for a much safer play-style. As soon as enemies start working together the slightest, the Vulcans effectiveness really plummets. It excels at picking of lone targets that stray from the pack (1/2 MBTs, Lightnings, 1/12 Sundies etc etc), but other than that, it really has its shortcomings. Going up against a single competent 2/2 MBT with a Vulcan-H is very risky, unless you time your approach to happen whilst they are occupied fighting (in which case a Halberd-H or a MBT could do it just as well, from further away. Even then, you have to get in close, opening up for other enemies to join the fight. A competent crew would see the Harasser coming on the mini-map before it reaches the effective Vulcan range, and can thus prepare. Personally I have no problem whatsoever hitting Harassers that come close, be it with my main cannons, the Halberd, the Basilisk, and whatever else I forgot to list. If you have decent situational awareness you will see them before they get to your juicy rear, and then you can simply out-DPS them (from a 2/2 MBT perspective).

    The reason most NC aren't using the Enforcer should be the same as (most, barring the lack of ranged utility of the Vulcan) of the reasons why most experienced TR won't use the Vulcan except for specific encounters. Namely its inability to magdump quickly (thus leaving you more exposed), low alpha strike, poor AI-capability (compared to the Halberd).

    Oh, and no I don't find it "amazing" that people switch to their secondaries, people should be doing it across the factions to maximize DPS-uptime if you are caught in a 1/2 MBT. The exception to this is a deployed Prowler, as then the main guns heavily out-DPS the Vulcan at that point. It should be irrelevant though, as a MBT should be played as a 2/2 vehicle to be effective.

    If the Prowler is within 50m of you, you really shouldn't lose the fight unless you are 1/2, you have been heavily flanked due to lack of situational awareness, or you are heavily outnumbered (again most likely due to lack of situational awareness). Within 50m, you have the advantage if played correctly, Vulcan or not (assuming equal manning of the tanks and matching loadouts/cert-levels).
  15. Liewec123

    the recent fix has done alot in removing striker issues,
    they're no longer invisible, no longer noclip and LoS breaks the homing (most of the time, its still quite buggy) which is good,
    the only issue now is the flares bug which is present for all kiddylaunchers *ahem* "lock on launchers".
    i can confirm this for A2A kiddylaunchers too since i've popped max rank flares and still had the kiddylauncher hit me.
    • Up x 1
  16. Santondouah

    Yeah, but I was referring to Vanguards AND lightnings. Using the latter I only have a bad time against TR harassers these times. I manage to take out most VS harrassers (with my HE canon, while moving around them) and if you pick the right spot it is no problem to flee as soon as a prowler/magrider shows up.

    Maybe a slight teamwork is effective against harrassers but on the opposite a joint operation involving many harrassers+vulcain or harassers+vulcains & prowlers is much more effective than its equivalent on the NC or VS side. Simple proof : people don't do it as often as TR do.
    For the rest of this paragraph, saying "you suck, learn to play" is not a proper justification for the OPness of your weapons... Just face the facts : TTK over distance for vulcain as compared to equivalent weapons. Let's laugh.


    Enforcer is weaker than Halberd in every situations, this is why almost nobody uses it on the NC side since the nerf. And if experienced TR crews use Halberds on Harrassers, then it seems that only noobs play Harassers on Ceres on the TR side. In my experience I see 4 vulcains for 1 halberd on harassers, and maybe I suck and so on but Halberds do not worry me at all whereas vulcains do. On the other hand, most prowlers use halberds for sure.


    I switch to my halberd too when I'm alone, but only during engagement (first shot) or to finish a target, but not in the middle of the fight, which is commonly seen as soon as we get within the 50m range...


    As you say I usually win the fight. I agree that most of the time when so gets killed by a vulcain it's a tactical mistake or so one. The point is that this weapon is not at all forgiving as compared to Saron or Enforcer. Moreover it is really amazing how much damage they can deal as compared to an equivalent magrider or Harrasser. For balance purposes the figures should be the same. They're not.
  17. ConcernedGamer

    The Striker:5000 damage in one clip(500 direct damage plus 500 explosive damage is 1000 total times 5).
    Other Lock on Rocket Launchers:2500 damage in one round (1500 direct damage plus 1000 explosive damage for 2500 total)

    Nerf the damage on the Striker to bring it in line with the other lock on launchers.
    That should quiet most of the whining about the Striker.
    Even if brought down to the 3000 that the Decimator does, it would be better than the double damage that the Striker does.(perhaps 300 direct and 300 explosive times 5, or some such)
  18. Slandebande

    Double posted. Sorry for the inconvenience.
  19. Slandebande

    Normally the 2 damage types are looked at separately (Direct vs Direct, indirect vs indirect), especially seeing as the weapons have quite different mechanics. For instance, using the Striker rarely lets you take advantage of the indirect damage because you are only targeting vehicles. Also, because vehicles don't receive the indirect damage, only the direct damage. You are also ignoring the fact that the Striker can be countered by an active countermeasure (flares/smoke) and it actually gives a warning before you are even hit. The others don't.

    It's all fine you are using both as arguments, I just stated Vanguards should not lose a fight within such a range.

    Any Harasser that gets taken out by a sole Lighting with a HE cannon is just not up to snuff, you really do make it sound like you got a lot of noobs over there (like you asked about why you see so many Vulcans). A Harasser should always have the advantage over a HE Lightning. If you are a lone Lightning using a HE cannon, you are just free food for a Halberd Harasser, even if you stick with your allies, since it can peck away at you from much further away without you really being able to fight back effectively.

    I never wrote you suck, or even implied it. I wrote that, given appropriate situational awareness, a Vulcan should not be able to sneak up to your rear unnoticed unless it uses Vehicle Stealth, which no Harassers do anyways (at least not until Composite Armor is nerfed/changed). And then, once you see it coming, a 2/2 MBT can easily scare it away if you can aim/lead a bit.

    Also, at least 9/10 Harassers entering within the Vulcans effective range of my 2/2 tank, is effectively destroyed much faster than the TTK of a Vulcan is against a MBT. If they aren't destroyed, they are sent off smoking/on fire, turboing over cliffs (with some hilarious kills due to flips on occasion).

    The point about teamwork:
    Teamwork can make a Vulcan Harasser ineffective, since going inside its effective range is suicide against competent and aware enemies, combined with the fact that the Vulcan has to remain exposed for quite a bit longer in order to dump its entire magazine in your vehicle. Yes, a few Vulcan-H's working together can wreck a tank fast, but where are its allies, and why didn't it/they see them coming in? If you spot them coming in, you know pretty much where they will strike, because they have to get in close to their intended targets. This makes it easier to set up "traps/ambushes" for them, either with your own Harassers, or tanks. Infantry can also be quite effective against Harassers that come close to them (Vulcan).
    Also, try attacking an AMS-Sundy with infantry pouring out with a Vulcan-H, and see how fast you are repelled. Then try the same with a Halberd and compare your results. That should sum it up quite nicely.

    Do you want the DPS of the Vulcan to be the same as the other secondaries whilst still lacking any sort of ranged utility? That's what the end of your post makes me think at least, but I'm not sure I'm understanding it entirely correctly, as it is written a bit strange (no offense intended of course, I just want to make sure I understand your point in the end correctly). You also cannot balance a weapon 100% based on its dps inside its effective zone, without accounting for the area covered by said zone, the weapons inherited limitations/weakness' (like the highly increased exposure time required). I've been a long-term advocate of altering the Vulcan slightly to give it more ranged utility and in turn has its CQC-ability reduced to compensate. It would make for a more fun (from a gunners perspective at least) weapon and it would feel natural on the Prowler as well.
  20. Kociboss

    I always wanted it to be wire guided, just like engineer turrets.