Discussion in 'Infiltrator' started by IrishInsanity, Mar 15, 2017.
Massive L2P issues here.
Snipers OP? Is this release all over again?
Spot on pal!
So much clueless BS in one thread!
I will make it simple for you people:
If you are dying from snipers a lot YOU are ******* up BIG TIME! L2P!
Exactly. Its a terrible game mechanic that we constantly have to adadadadadad and run like we are drunk everywhere we go.
I was fine with the old basr before the reload without unscoping attachment. Now sniper rifles are like slow firing scout rifles.
Perhaps just modify the attachment so that if you dont unscope you get no damage multiplier on headshots. 2 hits to kill.
Shoot without the straight pull bolt and you get 1hk headshots again.
Heaven forbid someone' managing to hit a small target's smaller head, can't be prevented by a passive that is amplified by something required: Some manner of motion.
Those standing still, are more often Snipers - since they actually need to be still to unload a shot.
Given accuracy is required.
If you aren't strafing, you'll be dead to every gun but a shotgun unloading on your easily predictive *** -- whom is doing straight lines.
Snipers do it in one bullet, and only have one bullet.
Every other gun however will just as easily chain-shot you to death with head-shots.
And it's as fast or faster than a Sniper nearly - the only exception being that skilled first-shot to the head.
So if you are only strafing when under fire by snipers, and only when someone has to literally exit ADS & re-enter to manage to get to cover...
You should've already been dead to said sniper, or to anyone whom actually uses ADS to aim their gun.
So rather than idiotically claim ADAD spam is from snipers, realize the entire gunplay is that.
Against every gun, you strafe.
Only the BASR needs a head-shot, and has only one bullet to land it.
The others will land & fire multiple - but have the bullets, nor do they have to worry about not hitting it.
You either strafe or be chain-shotted to death by LMG, Carbine, Scout-Rifle, SMG, Assault Rifles even pistols.
Every bloody gun.
If need be, I bet a grand number of us will show you how quick it is to chain-head shots on a barely moving target with nearly any bloody gun, if that it what it takes to teach you the entire damn gunplay is strafing.
Learn to strafe, and actually be aware of cover -- or be Free certs to anyone with a damn gun.
You don't, if you're long-range sniping.
...well, yeah...they're both rifles; one would expect them to function similarly.
That would make it absolutely worthless. The whole point of a bolt-action is one bullet, one kill. If you're not capable of pulling that off, you're not maximizing your time efficiently. I was fine without the attachment as well, but it's not some phenomenal device that turned long ranged snipers into gods.
I honestly think the SPB makes snipers worse. Give the average kid the ability to tunnel vision even harder and they'll stand still like a range dummy until you core their skull. Even back in the good old days in college when I could dump ten hours or more a week in the game and got decent I could probably count on one hand the number of times a week I actually would stay scoped in the whole time between 2 shots. It's convenient sometimes because it prevents scoping in from interrupting the rechambering of a new round but in the end all it really does is allow the rifle to fire at its maximum ROF (which doesn't change, lol).
But seriously I don't know why he's on this crusade about the SPB, he clearly has no idea how it functions. It's like he wanted to rant about infiltrators and didn't know how to start so picked a random feature from a hat. I'm honestly suprised it's not the Daimyo considering how ready everyone was to call that broken.
Yeah, there would be more of an argument if there was actually long-range within the game...but there's not. Maximum OHK distance is 300m and people have an easy enough time flanking a sniper who's locked behind a scope.
I don't think you're understanding me, I'm not making an argument for something. This has nothing to with OHK range or sniper mechanics or render range.
Straight pull bolt makes noob snipers worse than they otherwise would be *as players* due to a lack of situational awareness making them easy to flank and kill. This is simply a result of them not knowing any better than to sit there scoped in until they get countersniped. I have no problem with the attachment, just making an observation. I guess if you want to argue against that, knock your socks off.
Ignore double post. IOS strikes again...
I know you aren't, he was.
I was saying that they would have more of an argument if the render distance, and maximum OHK range for the long-range rifles, was further out. When you get further out, tunnel vision isn't as much of a risk as when you're only 300m away. For example, when I was around 800m+ out in Delta Force: Land Warrior, you didn't typically have to worry about TOO many people coming out for you because it was a waste of time. Their time was better served just keeping on the move to avoid enemy sniper-fire and scoring those kills, as it was a team-deathmatch oriented game with a timer per round.
So, I was just saying that if this the case in Planetside 2, there would be more of an argument against the attachment. ...but even then, it would be a weak argument as it doesn't really give too great a boon.
Ah, forgive me then, it looked like you were responding to what I wrote.
I will say it used to confuse the heck out of me when I started playing this game when I would shoot a distant enemy in what I thought was his head only to get a hitmarker and watch him scamper off. Max OHK range was a completely foreign concept to me.
I believe the max rendering distance for infantry is...400m now? The dev team has never understood, nor liked, the concept of long-range sniping though. We were lucky enough to keep the OHK on headshot at 300m back when they wanted to create some sort of stupid helmet. ...although, shockingly enough, one of the new programmers brought on is, apparently, a long-ranged sniper.
The problem in this game is that no matter what your potential OHK range is, the maximum effective range against a target that isn't sitting still or moving in a predictable manner is always going to be about 200m. This is simply because the velocities are low and players are fast and tanky.
Meh, that's more of a situational issue. There's a few places on Indar that this doesn't apply, because the enemy is often overlooking the base and not particularly mobile for one reason or another. The problem is that Sunderers provide people quick access to the buildings when parked close, meaning there really aren't many infantry fights outside of bases for us to prey upon. That's just, *more or less*, our problem and not really a fault of the game though.
It reminds me a bit of the more urbanized sequels to Delta Force: Land Warrior. In DF:LW, infantry fought outside rather often...but, in the sequels, urban areas became much more dense and sacrificed a lot of long-range sniping in favor of CQC. It wasn't so much bad as it was just jarring to long-ranged snipers who were used to having far more targets. That brought snipers in closer and forced them to improvise with urban nests atop roofs, on balconies, hollowed out vehicle husks, so on and so forth. Hell, people even tried sniping from the NPC helicopter that would, periodically, land for people to jump on and traverse a predetermined flight path over the city, on the most urbanized map.
Sadly, most bases aren't really that complex or large enough in Planetside 2 for that type of closer-ranged ambush sniping...and a Light Assault is going to find you fairly quickly...as will most anyone in situations where there are mobility aids, like jump pads. Instead, closer-ranged sniping favors the arena-style CQC sniping that people have developed...which is much more mobile and aggressive, rather than the ambush-oriented style of traditional sniping. Toss in the directional death indicator, on the death screen, and you pretty much ensure that the arena style of sniping reigns supreme in urban settings.
I'm actually a bit excited to try some Tech Plant sniping after I got my hands on the Phaseshift. That's a base with the complexity for that more traditional style of sniping in a CQC setting. I have been finding some more quirky little nooks and such in various bases as of late. Amerish is another continent that tends to have situations where that traditional form of sniping can work in a CQC setting.
..........I just realized I'm ranting now though.
It's all good.
By the way, if you don't already know from trying it, you're going to love the Phaseshift. I wish the Railjack and the TRAP were as effective and as fun to use as that thing is.
I've tested it out in VR, but I've never actually used it in battle. My connection hasn't been good enough to get into the game lately. I'm definitely looking forward to it. I loved the idea of the weapon, just wish it was a long-range rifle. Can't have it all though.
Something seems off about what you just said. If your potential OHK range is x, your effective range could be dictated by player speeds but what would tankiness have to do with it?
It's super versatile, you'll find the fact that you never have to reload even more useful than the lack of bullet drop or the semi auto-ness. If you space your shots correctly you can keep a very high shot tempo. It's probably one of the best counter sniping weapons in the game.
When I talk about maximum effective range for a sniper I mean the range at which you can reasonably expect to get a kill against a target with the burden of skill being on the shoulders of the shooter rather than the target. (Anyone can hit a stationary target, so I'm not counting those shots. You can't expect your enemy to sit still for you to be effective). If I shoot a moving heavy assault in the head at 150m with a bolt action it doesn't matter what their skill level is, as long as I have the prerequisite skill to land that headshot. Fair enough?
Now, there is a point in this game where hitting a target in the head is not feasible due to the low velocity of the rifles and the fast player acceleration (it is entirely possible for a player making completely normal movements to trivialize a sniper shooting for the head at long range without even meaning to). This means to kill a target at these ranges requires body shots which shifts the burden of skill from the sniper to the target. After the first hit (even after the first miss) it becomes increasingly difficult to hit an alerted target past a certain range. In most FPS a bolt action will two shot at any range to the body. This is still difficult if a player is moving but not impossible. This is not always the case in this game, where a player can expect to take upwards of three shots from a sniper depending on equipment, health kits, rifle used, etc on top of a regenerating shield. Hitting an evading target three times in this game with a bolt action is more luck than nothing else.
As a long time sniper, I have to say that its more of a challenge than most people think. I spend more time finding a good position than I spend actually shooting and often times when it comes to actual base fights the only thing I can do is try to target out of position players and other snipers who are defending a base. Hitting a moving target is an extreme challenge in this game due to many extreme travel times at long ranges. Personally I am often picking people off at a distance that can require me to land two shots.
Anyway, I guess my point is that if you keep moving and out of relatively open spaces, we aren't much of a threat. The only time recently I can think of that I was effective with a sniper rifle at close range was with the Ghost in a biolab where the enemy was just running to the same cover over and over with their heads popping out. In a 1v1 at relatively close range we are pretty much screwed. Also an infil with an smg will loose 90% of the time vs a heavy with an overshield unless they are clueless.
Ok, so as someone who often goes on sniping field trips, I do have an idea as to what your talking about. Heck, I have even had people pull ESF's and tanks to try and root me out. However, there are a few really simple things to keep in mind about snipers.
First off, snipers are usually really predictable. A good sniper spot will always be high up, and the best ones have minimal terrain clutter in the sight lines. The obvious catch is that the number of locations that meet that criteria and the idea ranges for preventing counter attack are extremely rare.
Another part that I have found is that there are a couple of infantry weapons out there, particularly for medics, that are basically built for beating snipers. A perfect example is the battle rifle. Its relatively flat damage profile, low cost, and ease of use can make it a snipers bane.
Next, its important to realize that snipers really don't spend much time actually taking shots at people. It normally takes a while to get into a good position, to the point where I would say that for every minute I spend set up, I spend at least two or three getting there. Plus, its really easy to beat a sniper. Just got light assault, and float on up into their nest.
Finally, actually sniping a target is not exactly easy. The usual optimum range for a bolt action tends to sit between 120 and 250 meters. In many cases, the shot that hits you was fired between a quarter to a half second ago, and was likely their fourth or fifth attempt if you were moving.
As many have said before, if you keep moving and try to stay near decent cover, you are probably not going to get sniped.
Separate names with a comma.