[Suggestion] New items slot and C4 nerf, some grenade changes

Discussion in 'PlanetSide 2 Gameplay Discussion' started by Halkesh, Dec 6, 2017.

  1. Halkesh

    It took me some time to think about all these changes to balance item between each other and (probably) make people won't take C4 as the go-to.
    What do you think about it ?

    ITEMS
    Medkit
    Un use, instantly revive the target (knife range). No effect on MAX.
    25 nanites

    Restoration kit
    On use, start heal 1000HP over 12sec and instantly start recharging the personal shield as if the player had waited the 6sec. Damage taken stop the healing process.
    25 nanites

    C4
    maximum damage changed to 935. Now cost 50 nanite.
    First rank allow to use 2 C4 and second rank allow to use 3 C4.

    Auxiliary shield
    Increase max shield by 50
    When revived, start with 300 shield (stack with rank 5 of safe revive implant)

    Termite paste
    Throw a brick of termite paste (range is similar to C4). It stick on vehicle, MAX or the ground. Once activated, deal 2000@3m - 50@6m (C4 damage type) over 5 sec
    Termite cost 0 nanites but have a 30/25/20/15 sec cooldown that start once the termine is detonated.

    Mining drill
    This tool is surprisingly effective at destroying constructions and might work on abandonned vehicles or sleeping MAX.
    65 dmg with 600 RoF (C4 damage type)
    Infinite ammo but same range as the knife
    Echo on minimap on a 40 meter radius, drill sound can be heard as far as a gunshot


    GRENADE
    Frag
    Grenade warning icon only appear if it's an ally grenade or if the player use the mine-sweeper implant, otherwise the grenade warning icon won't show. Grenade can be spotted so everyone will see the grenade warning icon (your character will shout "Grenade ! Get away !" or something like that).
    50 nanites

    AV
    25 nanites

    Sticky, Concussion & Flash
    Unchanged

    EMP
    50 nanites

    Decoy (infiltrator only)
    Infinite ammo, cost 0 nanites, can be actived while cloacked
    On use, create faction specific sound cloack sound and a faction specific default pistol gun sound. Also create a red dot on the mini-map.

    Have a 45-30 sec cooldown and one charge. Grenade belt allow to have up to 4 charges.
    • Up x 3
  2. Blam320

    C4 is fine. It's always been powerful against infantry.
  3. Kdog559

    Another topic about C4's. Just leave it alone. It's never going to get nerfed.Why? Because they do the proper amount of damage a C4 is supposed to do.To give us one or two more bricks because of damage reduction just to do some actual damage against tanks and infantry would be pointless and no one would use them because of the lack of time it takes to place one.
  4. Prudentia

    but why remove the grenade indicator? it turns enemies into anti-cats, they run away from the red dot, right into my line of fire.
    • Up x 1
  5. Eternaloptimist

    I'm not against ideas being put forward but I don't understand why these changes might be needed
  6. adamts01

    I seriously want your proposed termite paste. I hate ******* termites, wrecking my outdoor furniture and tool shed. Kill them all I say.
    • Up x 1
  7. LtBomber1

    You are right, C4 has not changed much.
    The most viable platform for it has!
    The LA got new jets, making them self into suicide bombers. Combine this with the delay reduction (buff to C4) and cost decrease (100 N--> 75 N) some adjustments are justified.

    ---

    Some ideas are nice (decoy nade will be much better with this one!) other are questionalbe.

    Anyways, thank you for putting things up and may the devs decide what to do with it!
    • Up x 1
  8. Icehole1999

    All the different jets (except Icarus which suck for everything) are great for suicide bombing.

    Suicide bombing is fun even on foot.

    Using a Flash as a suicide bomb is a riot!

    God I love C4.

    What we're we talking about?
  9. Halkesh

    See my answer to Kdog559.

    I don't know your logic, but personally if everyone take the same loadout then there is a problem. Currently we have 2 possibility : they aren't enough choice or that specific loadout is OP.
    If after many new items C4 is still the go-to that everyone take no matter the circonstances, then it's a solid proof that C4 is OP and should be nerf (or the other items are underpower).

    On these items proposition where I'd nerf C4 (note I also proposed new item that you just ignored by focusing on C4), it still allow to instant kill the same things as before since you have now access to 3 C4 by default.
    It shouldn't change a lot of thing against vehicle (it will work against AF or tunnel vision people, won't work on others) but it's a use improvement against MAX that now need 2 C4 to be killed by default and 3 when they use flak armor. Against infantry, people should use AP mine, not C4.

    What do you think about other proposition than C4 ?

    Items and grenade in general, but some people read "C4" and "change" in the same line so they went mad. I honestly regret to have put C4 on this topic, now I can't edit it and this topic is doomed.
  10. Halkesh

    It will still happens (mine sweeper, spotted grenade), but now you'll be actually able to get kill with a frag grenade. ;)

    You should have used nanite furniture, not wood furniture. :p
    About termite paste, it's not powerful enough to kill vehicles by itself and won't instant kill things since the damage are dealt over 5 sec. But it can be used to deal extra damage and create a denial area (and it's long enough to wait for your shield to recharge).
    After rethinking of it, I'd made it's CD too short. It should be something like 45-30 sec, like the decoy grenade.

    The only reason about these change is I personally think these items/grenade should be modified to be more balanced each-other : IMO item slot completely lack the principle of "side-grade" (I may be wrong, tho). For the new/reworked items, I'd simply think we need more more choice.
    For example, medkit and restoration kit are now clearly different and both are useful without being OP. Termite and mining drill will make good alternative to C4 on some situation. Etc.
  11. FateJH

    Most people feel everything else does far too little damage compared to where they think it should, making C-4 the unhammered nail.

    Edit: by the way, thermite(?) paste may as well be "super C-4" in the form by which it's described.
  12. ObiVanuKenobi

    Termite paste sounds funny. Imagine termites chewing tanks and maxes.
    Pretty sure you meant thermite.
  13. Halkesh

    D'oh !
    Yeah, you're right I mean thermite paste. But for whatever reason, autocorrect decide to underline thermite in red and propose termite as a correction. (I use standard "anglais (Etat-Unis)" language verification : it help a lot but it's not idiot-proof as you can see :p ).



    Now I understand your joke a bit more.
  14. Blam320

    C4 was the go-to for Light Assaults long before CAI, purely because their mobility combos so well with it. You don't see many Heavies or Engineers with C4 for that same reason; they lack the mobility to use C4 effectively.
  15. Halkesh

    I have brought C4 on this thread and I honestly regret it.
    Let's pretend C4 is unchanged, what do you think about the other items change and the new items ?
  16. Blam320

    I see Thermite paste as an anti-Construction tool, for when a base has invincible walls thanks to the way Repair Modules work. Currently a very well-defended base is nearly impossible to breach without starving it of Cortium first via a prolonged siege. That tactic may have worked when assaulting normal bases in PlanetSide 1, but we have a long way to go before we can feasibly reach that level of dedication and coordination.

    On another construction note, replacing the drill with a portable Mining Laser and Cortium canister, equip-able in the tool slot, would finally make filling up all the seats of an ANT useful.

    Medkit with it's current burst healing is fine. I run it on my Heavy for sustainability and independence, for when friendly Medics are few and far between.

    The changes to Aux Shield would be super beneficial to new players, and probably make it more competitive against other, more popular slots.
  17. moriarrr-ceres

    Maybe i can add more
    Maybe i can add more:
    comossion/flash mine
    av grenade: maybe add more grenades without bandolier? or increase alpha damage by a little
    jump pad mine: one use, aoe, a squad moving on it will jump at Icarus jump height with mine detonation(can be both useful for your team or against enemies)
    antigrav grenade: can lift a max suit or a flash. The direction is random.....
  18. DemonicTreerat

    C4 isn't the problem. The problem was giving the same version to all classes, when 3 of them have to struggle just to place the charge while one (LA) is all but assured of at least delivering their payload. If C4 is balanced for the majority (as now) then the LA's mobility - which removes the primary downside of requiring being pointblank to place - makes it "OP". Yet if they balance C4 around the LA then its functionally useless for the other three. The solution? Don't give the same version of C4 to everyone.

    A) Remove C4 from light assaults and give them AV mines instead. Light Assaults still remain effective against stationary vehicles but now mobile vehicles have a true chance to not get blown up due to the need.
    B) Split current C4 into two types. One for LA's requiring 3 charges (ie your suggestion), and having a timed detonation only, to destroy most vehicles (Harassers and Flashes being exceptions at 2 and 1). The other the current 2 charges (or 1 for Harassers and Flashes) with the option for manual or timed detonation.
    • Up x 1
  19. Blam320

    @DemonicTreerat For option A, replacing the Light Assault's C4 with AV mines would ruin their effectiveness against stationary vehicles. You need to get close to a deployed Sunderer to drop AV mines, then you actually need to throw a grenade or shoot them to detonate them, as they won't trigger themselves unless the sundie driver is stupid enough to try and move with mines under them. And that's assuming you aren't shot by the defenders first. AV mines are far more effective when you lay them as a trap ahead of an advancing armor column, or behind them to block their retreat.

    For option B, having different firing modes for C4 just complicates things for new players. If we were going to create a new explosive with a timer, I would name it Semtex or something other than C4.
    • Up x 2