NC low win-rate - where is the balance?

You were talking about Vanguards having the best ability because the shield can in cases protect the tank against C4.
My reply is, most of the time you will not even be able to put the C4 on a Magrider because of the unpredictability of the strafing movement.

Now suddenly you talk about a turreted gun...in case you did not notice, the Prowler has one, too. OP right?

Seriously, are you ret.rded?

No, NC do not have a AP hitscan cannon. Neither has VS. Most "hitscan" AP cannon is the Lockdown Prowler one.

Where do I talk about VS weaponry being "skill-less"?

Please quote the passage in my text.

Where do I talk about any weapon else than the Lancer which, indeed, actually has "no bullet drop "?

Again, please quote the passage. Otherwise admit you just spout cr.p like the sh.tter you are.

Yeah it is. You just need to GIT GUT.

(Nah you don´t actually need to be GUT, a trained ape could do that.)

And yet again, you purposefully ignore everything written before, even your own stories, to make up a whole new story because you cannot cope with the arguments.

First you talk about "clearing rooms", now you talk about Ravens...I don´t often see vehicles in rooms (Raven Maxes neither), so again, what is wrong with you?

Again, YOU were babbling about NC having "the fastest TTK weapons".

I just proved you wrong, and now you say it´s not relevant to the discussion? YOU brought it up, now don´t cry if you get trashed for your stupid points (I won´t even call them arguments, because there is nothing backing them up.)

And to surprise you, on Miller, TR do win alerts regularly. Maybe your server's TR is just bad like you?

That was my first post in this thread.

Please quote the passage where I call for nerfs or speak about Sniper Rifles or any other weapon than the Lancer.

Otherwise, again, you are just full of sh.t.

On another note, every ES small arm (except Sniper Rifles and Slug-Shotguns), all VS MAX weapons and also some ES vehicle weapons like the Saron or PPA have no bullet drop.

Again, inform yourself before you make yourself obvious as the dum.ba.ss you are.

Where did I blame other for "my failures"?

Again, please quote or -> full of sh.it.

Really, we have good players, too? Oh thank you, your mercy. Do you have any facts pointing to NC mostly being farmers and griefers? Griefing, like in being purposefully malevolent towards other players for the sake of ruining their game experience?

I did not whine, I trashed you and your stupid opinions.

Just like in this post.

Stop taking drugs and spouting your uneducated b.llsh.t.

P.S.: You just enforced my viewpoint on you being absolutely incompetent. But as the stupid people guys like you are, I see forward to just trashing you again as you won´t stop.

You are like the Terminator of Stupid.

Either you are underestimating the advantage provided by the floating, or you are discounting other advantages. Magrider is generally the most effective tank statistically, with the prowler occasionally coming on top in things like KPH.

No, not virtually hit-scan. Not even close. There is drop on magriders, but it is not more difficult to compensate for this drop than for other tanks. You are also far more likely to be shooting at a stationary target, while you are moving. All RL's, with exception to the ESRL's have literally the exact same stats, the only difference being the aesthetic of the rocket.

It's not difficult to shoot them down. It is rather difficult to hit things accurately with them, especially if your point of origin is in low cover.

The differences in TTK for NC and the other MAX's are marginal at close range. You are more likely to be killed while fleeing an NC MAX at close range, but you are not significantly less likely to get it with C4. The NC MAX, like the vanguard, is the lowest rated of the three, statistically speaking. Ravens do not make for good AI weapons except for at long range, and they aren't particularly effective even then. You can look at the stats for that.

The low recoil and easy handling of VS weapons means VS players have the easiest time scoring headshots. This skews infantry balance slightly in their favor. As 90% of combat is decided by infantry, this gives the VS something of an edge on the other factions. You can check the stats for that.

We have good players. Very few will tell you they play better as NC, regardless of where their preferences lie. VS is, in general, an easier to play faction. The balance is not so skewed as to make things absolutely unfair, but that the balance still favors the VS.

Oooh. So you're just butting in and we're supposed to take your comment out of context? XD Go back to the first page. Maybe you'll also understand what my post is about.

This thread is yet another "NC so poor, nerf VS plskthx" thread like the dozens that have succeeded in the past that have taken away all our toys. And I've had enough of it. If you're talking about something else, then go talk somewhere else. It's called a thread for a reason.

Do you....do you even read. No where did the OP say that VS needed a nerf, in fact, he merely called for a NC buff. He shows his proof with stats across the board of W/L ratio, VKPH, and others, and yet you believe he is merely saying "buff nc, nerf vs, plzthxbai."
Its as if you are too dense to see that there is a problem, and too afraid that any change to the NC will knock the VS and TR off their high horse.

And you are doing the same with the numerous disadvantages the Magrider also has. The drop you already admitted is one of them. Same with the higher profile, slower speed, and a gun that only fires forward.

Regardless, are you saying then that we win more alerts because of magriders? Why aren't the statistically far better prowler not doing the same thing for TR?

Spoken like someone who has never been up against a scatmax. A scatmax doesn't have a TTK. It kills you instantly. This has been something BOTH TR and VS has been complaining for years. Yet they nerfed the VS ZOE and gave the TR max a useless special ability instead. Because Higby. Lowest rated, my ****. It's the most effective max in terms of what maxes are actually for: close range room cleaners.

The fact that you can still lose alerts with them is embarrassing. Since almost all cap points are inside rooms.

Whut? Low recoil? ROFL Where the heck did you hear that? Like most NC, you seem to be confusing "no bullet drop" with "no recoil". Both of which are lies.

Our faction advantage is reload speed. TR have better ammo capacity, NC have better damage. Recoil among three factions are more or less the same.

So again, exactly WHAT makes us win more alerts? What makes our faction "easier to play"? Why doesn't TR also do the same?

Why haven't you been winning more alerts since SOE/DBG began nerfing all of our stuff? How much more worse do our equipment have to be for you to catch up?

Remember, NC just convinced DBG to nerf our battlegooses a few months ago. Why are you still losing then? How about we just run around naked with knives. Maybe that's more your speed?

I dunno. Maybe the fact that WE are actually the top alert winners? LOL It's as if you're too dense to see that the reason may not be your equipment, but your people.

Here, let's try an experiment: tell me how we, the notoriously sexy Vanu, have been winning more alerts than you. Details on what equipment actually makes it possible. Go on.

And conversely, explain why TR are not doing as well as we are.

Instead of asking yet another nerf/buff to further tip odds in your favor artificially, try paying more attention to alerts and how they are won.

It's about populations and deployment. If you want my explanation for why you seem to lose more alerts, it's either you have low population in your server, or in my server's case the simple fact that NC seldom split their zergs. You have a tendency to field 96+ platoons against bases defended by 12 people. Taking one base by storm, but losing two in the process. Like TR, you also have a tendency to defend bases already cut off, as if you don't know when to retreat, abandon bases, and cut losses. Wasting entire platoons on bases that do not contribute to territory percentage.

It does, sometimes. As does the prowler. These obviously aren't the only reasons, nor are they ever really the deciding factor. In any case, statistically speaking, the VS and TR are going to get better use out of their tanks. This is an advantage that translates into victories.

The scatmax instagibs at extremely close (<5m) ranges. Beyond that, the TTK quickly falls behind its VS and TR counterparts. The problem with forced CQC is that you do not have the option of utilizing your instant TTK without putting yourself at risk of getting C4'd. Scatmax's also do not have the ability to suppress and sustain fire like the other MAX's due to low mag sizes and the incredibly long reloads. This means that accuracy and trigger control are essential to using the MAX properly. Again, the NC MAX statistically underperforms because of these drawbacks.

The VS weapons have a tendency towards less and more controllable recoil. I'm surprised you didn't know this. The TR have more horizontal recoil, the NC more vertical. The VS weapons occupy a comfortable middle.

The VS have a slight edge over the other factions because they have a slight edge when it comes to MBT, ESF, and infantry weapon balance. They are all slightly easier to use when you're new and tend to perform better in the hands of skilled players than the weapons of the other factions. Again, these aren't deciding factors, but gives the VS enough of an edge to tend towards winning the most alerts on practically every server.

Statistically Prowler outperforms Mags and Vanguards heavily. Vanguards outperform Magriders slightly. To claim that we're winning because of our MBTs is hilarious.

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/ps2/index.php?threads/current-mbt-balance.234237/

Listen to the comments of your fellow smurfs there. Notice the gloating. In every other thread, it's very common knowledge that Magriders are the weakest tanks. Fun to drive with a skilled driver, but bad for regular rank and file. Funny how in here it seems you're the victims, eh? Vague wishy-washy mebbe this mebbe that explanations of our alert dominance being due to "various factors" that you can't seem to pinpoint is exactly the point. What do you want DBG to do then? Nerf everything we have? You'd like that, wouldn't you?

"Risk of getting c4ed" contradicts "instagib". I repeat scatmaxes are the most difficult maxes to c4 ever. Even beyond 5m, scatmaxes do roughly the same damage as our AI maxes, killing infantry in 2 shots instead of one. Not really that much of a disadvantage isn't it?

Beyond 15m in open terrain, you have no business engaging infantry with a max. Not even VS or TR AI maxes should.

And like tanks, here's the funny part: NC maxes are statistically better than either TR or VS maxes. With 50% more kills than both factions. So again, why aren't you winning alerts?

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/ps2/index.php?threads/ai-max-statistics.125925/

So we have BOTH vertical and horizontal and that's "easier"?

Enough of an edge. LOL No we don't. Everything you've mentioned can be disproven very easily in stats:

http://ps2oraclestats.com/monthlystats/

TANKS Primary Weapon, Avg. KPH, Avg, Vehicle KPH
Supernova PC
15.49
5.42
Supernova FPC
7.6
11.42
Supernova VPC
41.71
4.88
Titan-150 HEAT
16.06
5.65
Titan-150 AP
17.08
10.55
Titan-150 HE
34.68
4.27
P2-120 HEAT
20.92
6.08
P2-120 AP
23.61
13.05
P2-120 HE
50.67
4.7

AI MAX Avg KPH
AF-34 Mattock-Left 33.13
AF-41 Hacksaw-Left 24.73
AF-23 Grinder-Left 26.7
M6 Onslaught-Left 27.52
M2 Mutilator-Left 22.41
MRC3 Mercy-Left 22.89
Nebular VM20-Left 26.24
Cosmos VM3-Left 21.96
Blueshift VM5-Left 26.95
M1 Heavy Cycler-Left 17.91
M1 Heavy Cycler-Right 24.27
M6 Onslaught-Right 26.9
M2 Mutilator-Right 23.43
MRC3 Mercy-Right 23.59
NCM1 Scattercannon-Left 17.24
NCM1 Scattercannon-Right 30.3
AF-34 Mattock-Right 34.58
AF-41 Hacksaw-Right 25.9
AF-23 Grinder-Right 28.51
Quasar VM1-Left 19.38
Quasar VM1-Right 27.31
Nebular VM20-Right 26.28
Cosmos VM3-Right 25.66
Blueshift VM5-Right 27.52

ESF Primary weapons, Avg. Aircraft KPH
Saron Laser Cannon5.89
Hailstorm Turbo Laser7.62
Light PPA1.14
Antares LC7.63
M20 Mustang5.67
Vortek Rotary7.3
M30 Mustang AH3.92
M20 Kestrel7.39
M18 Needler5.54
M14 Banshee1.76
M18 Rotary6.34
M18 Locust5.68

ES Heavy Guns Avg. KPH
NC05 Jackhammer 32.82
T7 Mini-Chaingun 27.63
Lasher X2 24.82

LMG, Avg. KPH
Betelgeuse 54-A 59.21 (NERFED)
NC6A GODSAW 46.92
T9A "Butcher" 44.96
LA1 Anchor 43.47

SMG, Avg. KPH
AF-4G Cyclone 38.99
SMG-46G Armistice 33.18
Shuriken 32.58
Skorpios 32.16
Tempest 31.27

Sniper, Avg. KPH (excluding directive weapons)
KSR-35 34.43
SAS-R 34.02
TSAR-42 33.9

Scout Rifle, Avg. KPH
HSR-1 35.77
AF-6 Shadow 33.14
TR NS-30 Vandal 32.98

Carbines, Avg. KPH (excluding directive weapons)
Gauss Compact Burst 26.74
Solstice Burst 26.58
TRAC-5 Burst 25.02
19A Fortuna 22.95

Assault Rifles, Avg. KPH (excluding directive weapons)
Equinox VE2 Burst 31.71
Gauss Rifle Burst 31.11
T1B Cycler 30.81

I feel like purple dudes are way over powered and they have lasers......

No, the VS has sexy butts in tight fitting spandex and disco orbs. It is too much party on the battlefield for the TR and NC to cope with.

"I can't aim because my Faction is underpowered and other Factions are cheated. Devs, halp me ASAP !!!"

Sorry to destroy you dreams, but You too completly wrong Stats! KPU is way more important because in cripled way show +/- PERFORMANCE of a a weapon. To be honest standard K/D would be perfect in that case, because KPU do not show nomber of deaths when you were equiped with weapon and havent menaged to kill anyone (as far as I know).

Showing KPH stats to prove something about PERFORMANCE of weapon is like claiming that moon is perfect enviroment for human beings to live, and showing statistics of deaths on moon to proove that. Noone havent died on moon yet...but it doesn't mean that it is a perfect enviroment for humans to life.

And another thing: you should not include lowest and higherst performances (not BR!).

And in case of Tanks you also have to include stats of Secondary weapons.

p.s.
Oh... and that topic about maxes is from 2013... maybe something has changes, maybe not. Someone have to check.

Before you start to think. Wrongly balanced game affect sales in very cruel way. It is a product like anything else.

So you are saying, DGB should start buffing the VS because they have the lowest number of active players?

THIS! This right here needs to change! I'm still an NC vet from playing since 2012 and this right here is a problem. If we can't keep our new players, how in the hell are we supposed to survive as a faction?

Let me propose a radical idea, what if every NC primary weapon, had a slight nerf to it's recoil? Give the NC more control over their guns and I can guarantee you will see a noticeable difference. Maybe not immediately, but it will shift the statistics.

It might just be me, but almost everytime i am leading an platoon, i see NC messing their own alerts n stuff through poor strategy. One example... lately, we were fighting for Indar. Vanu 7, TR 5, NC 10 (victory Points). NC was fighting mainly TR (easier - less pop at that given time), instead of their real opponent in this case, Vanu.

They lost the Alert to Vanu, and Indar to TR...

Now that made me think, and a kinda poor explanation for that could be:

- NC is the "rebel-faction"
- Rebellion is very appealing to youth
- Younger ppl just aint got that strategic skills, yet

Please dont get me wrong, i am far from saying... meh, those NC players are all kiddies. I love playing NC myself, but ... its just what i have experienced - in my own perception.


Another point that could make it worse - NC is great at defending, but not that good in attacking. Most weapons seem to be better for CQC.

Can you tell me, how you possibly logically connected those two things?

I see that this is based on associations not on reasoning but... ahhh! It is not refering to the subject. It is changing it.

I'm 37. A lot of guy that play with me are around that age. Most of them have a lot of experience in project managing, like me. I cant even remember when I started to play FPS.... long long time ago before internet (clans, leagues, clan leading, tactics, training other to nation cups... just name it - off course before I started to work full time). For me games are nice "run away from reality" before and after hard work.

Like in any other fractions You have full spectrum of age in NC....but there is one thing: Visible insufficiency of really young players. Before 20.

P.S.
NC weapons are useless in CQC. I have written all reasons why before. I do not want to repeat myself.

You are right. NC weapons are better at defending than in attacking. It doesnt mean that they are good. They are just better in defending than in attacking.... but even when you are defending base you have to attack points.

I'll just add this as I only just started playing NC. My friends and I play TR on the EU servers but server pop is way too low in the evenings so we just started NC and I'm getting bigger kill streaks with my NC than I did with my TR and I'm on a new character with hardly anything certed. I've noticed a lot of firefights where I thought I would be dead, like when you come around a corner and there's a guy in ur face. In these i'm hip firing but win out a lot more. Maybe it's the freedom fries