[Guide] [maps] RESOURCES - further reasons why a revamp is desperately required

This thread is linked to these:
- https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2/index.php?threads/unscheduled-resource-revamp.83018/
- https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2...evamp-cant-come-soon-enough-heres-why.147221/

Here are the continents, with just the Resources shown.
* Circle size correlates (roughly) to Resource size.
Yellow = Infantry, Green = Air, Red = Mechanised


INDAR notes:
- Why does Scarred Mesa SKYdock give Mechanised Resources, not Air Resources?
- What's up with Feldspar Canyon all on its own? Also, the south-east warp-gate sucks for Air Resources.
- Note the separation from warp-gates to the Infantry Resource rich hexes. (especially the south-west warp-gate)


ESAMIR notes:
- Basically, if you are warp-gated on Esamir, you are only getting Infantry Resources.
- Bio Labs are special on Esamir, they give you Mechanised and Air Resources, not Infantry Resources.
- Bit of a mix around Andvari Bio Lab.
- Note the lack of evenly distributed Air Resource nodes.
- Want Mechanised Resources, cap the centre of Esamir!


AMERISH notes:
- Look at that swathe of Infantry hexes up the east flank.
- Look at that vast field of Mechanised hexes in the south half.
- Why does Ravens Landing and The Ascent give Mechanised Resources, not Air Resources?
- A lot of the 'PITA to capture' hexes, give few resources. (Splitpeak, Bastion, Firearms, Lithcorp)


So we can plainly see on all of the maps that there are 'regions' of hexes all containing the same type of resource.

Supposedly, this means there is some 'strategery' when it comes to territory capture and trying to deny your enemy certain resources to gain an advantage.

Example a L33T tactical outfit decides:
"Let's cap all the enemies Air Resource hexes so they won't have air cover, then we will have air superiority!"
However, this is a flawed idea because an enemy will then just spam tanks and/or infantry with plenty of AA options anyway.

But it you are primarily a pilot in that enemy faction and have invested many 1000's of certs into your aircraft, but all of the Air Resources hexes are captured by the enemy - tough luck...


So I propose:

1. Have a 'universal / single' resource.
Let's call it a Nanite. (or a Higbyte? )
Each player gets a pool of 3000 Nanites to spend on Aircraft, Vehicles or Infantry items.
If the player is a pilot they can spend all 3000 Nanites flying.
If the player is a driver they can spend all 3000 Nanites tanking.
If the player is a grunt they can spend all 3000 Nanites on Infantry gear.

OR

2. Make each hex provide each of the three current resource types.
(So a small outpost might provide: 2 Air, 2 Mech and 2 Inf resources,
A main facility might provide: 30 Air, 30 Mech and 30 Inf resources.)
That way, no players are disadvantaged based on their preferences and certs investments.

Keep resource pools separate, 3k in one common pool would enable a game breaking level of focused spamming. That's 30 blocks of C4, half a dozen tanks back to back, 7 ESFs, 6 libs etc.

The idea of removing resources by sector though is good. I think resources should just be granted to the player constantly in all three pools based on how far they are from their own warpgate. The closer you are, the more resources you get, the further, the less. This would make it much harder to sustain a mechanised push for an overpopulated faction that already controls most of a map and is on the doorsteps of the opposing factions.

I personally like the idea proposed by SOE. A single resource type (Araxium) that is pooled at each base for general consumption by all players of the faction that owns the base. Though problems of, I guess, grieving could accrue: Some people being wasteful of the resource, but this would be good for attrition, something this game really doesn't have.

The problem with how the system is set up now is it is completely irrelevant to decide what base to attack or defend based on resources. Because of the Lattice we don't have the freedom to actually choose what base we should attack based merely on the resources it provides. Never have I come across the problem of needing to capture a base based purely on its resource output.

One thing that would actually make the regional resources work along with the plan to have resource pools is harvesting. If we are able to freely roam for resources no matter what territories are owned we can then make 3 resource system work properly.

Actually, making it so there's only one type of resource would probably have a positive effect on gameplay, just as long as it's still accumulated for each person individually still. Then you would actually have to put some thought into what you want to put that resource towards. Do you want some C4, a Lightning, or a Liberator? As opposed to the mindless "oh, I crashed an ESF, guess I'll pull a tank now."

Back in Planetside 1 we didn't have no stinkin' resources. We only had timers. We got along just fine! Though I suppose that might just be my nostalgia talking...

Great point!
I couldn't really bring myself to talk about how the Lattice setup impacts on Resources...

Yes!
It's been mentioned, I'm sure.

Timers AND Resources seems redundant.
(One or the other please SOE!)

The uneven distribution of the 3 resources was IMO a good idea to get some meta going, aka 'we lackX, so either lets go cap over there or alter our unit composition around Y'.


Sadly, just like the hex system, it didn't work out. SOE revamp idea (according to the roadmap thread) sounds solid though, can't wait until they put it in.

This system is bad because the individual is limited based on the actions of his faction mates, even without malicious griefing.
Want to spawn your full certed MAX? Nope, all the lowbies already spawned their ****** stock maxes.
Its the whole 'sundy placement' argument again, but worse.

Barebones system they have allready suggested (which is very similar to what a LOT of players have been calling for) is a vast, night and day improvement on the mess we have now.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Planetside/comments/1txv7j/make_continental_lattice_resource_revamp_the/

https://forums.station.sony.com/ps2...-lattice-resource-revamp-the-priority.165486/

http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?p=946145#post946145

Its what needs doing next and there are a number of workable proposals out there.

Depends on how it is done.

My understanding is that every vehicle you pull will have a maintenance cost attached to it, that prevents chain pulling of a dozen vehicles (Because eventually you are maintenancing too many vehicles to pull another). Further, it'll all be tied to the pop imbalance for that area. Overpopped groups in an area will end up draining resources from their home base, to the point they will have trouble supplying themselves. It should work in a way that you have a "Timer" between vehicles you can pull just based on the recharge rate of your resources, So people who are good at vehicles will be able to stay in those vehicles longer (Arguably better IMO, because tankers should be allowed to be Tankers).

I would bet the resources will be less too, just so you can't provide tanks for a squad of people. I bet around 1,000-1,500 will be your resource pool.

Edit: As to the OP... Yes, we need a resource revamp. Thank you for making a post about it, frankly I feel we should have a post about this up every day, just to remind SOE that this needs to be done next, and that it is more important than something silly like Death Screens or the Harasser 2.0

Just this one thing though,

if they abandon vehicle aquisition timers as a mechanic they need to playtest the hell out of the new system. PS1 actually had both resources (in the form of facility power levels) AND vehicle timers, and for good reason. Namely, the same reason MAXes had a timer slapped on them in beta.

If the only limiting factor to how many tanks (for example) a zerg can pull is the rate at which you can run resource trucks - or even worse, the rate at which you steamroll enemy bases to use their resources for resupplying - then Vehicleside '13 is going to look like a joke compared to the abomination this will create.

Plus, I don't think they intend to give Warpgates resouce limits - prepare for endless streams of suicide whales...


You need both resources and timers in PS2. The former for 'meta', the latter for balance.

I do think that it could use some changes but if they're ever going to make one big pool I'll quit right there and then.

Do you have any idea of the horror it would cause if Ace pilots / Tankers could just respawn ESFs and Tanks all day long? And what about Maxes, imagine people just picking a max to rush into your group of allies protecting something, shooting randomly because ''hey who cares, can spawn 6 more after this one anyway!''

It would be chaos and everything will end up getting nerfed in the game turning it into water pistolside 2 and I do not want that to happen

Why not just remove the resource income from every small outpost and tower, thus making facilities the sole resource generator on all the continents combined. They already have minor roles except the Tech plants (MBTs), so giving them a far greater importance will be better off than completely revamping the system.

What do I propose, it's simple really; link up all the continent facilities to generate a global resource income for each pool (Air, Ground Infantry) across all continents, not just the one your fighting on. This will spread the fighting out across the entire planet as you need to hold as many facilities as possible for greater income. This helps with the situation on Indar, as no one ever leaves it for Esamir or Amerish, and possible Hossin when it arrives for that matter. It's also good for Meta-game, as alerts have proven that global facility conquest brings out the best in outfit coordination, driving fun and enjoyment to full extent in this game.

The lattice system will of course be unchanged, it works so why break it.

I would say the focus for balance would by thouse resource trucks.

For one if it likely they will go with ash87's suggestion and make them modules, then they probably should not have normal sundy surviability.

And so that zerg spitting out vehicles, maxes... whatever, is going to have to put one of its many eyes on that chain of highly vunerable sundies going back and forth from the auxaium mines to their closest forward base.

And if I was the opponent, i'd be mining the **** out of thouse routes.

I've allways been an advocate for this system, because even on the most abstract level its what prevents sheer blob warfare in reality.

Balancing around resources sounds like a good idea - in theory. So did the old resource system


All I'm saying is that they should test the new system with and without timers thoroughly. And keep the timer mechanic code somewhere close by if they chose to not implement timers. Just in case everything goes haywire.

So you want symmetrically balanced continents, in PS2- An MMOFPS ABOUT ASSYMETRICAL BALANCE? Sorry, no. I'm not touched at all, reading about pilots forced to fight on the ground or invest in other stuff than their ESF. We ALL are kind of forced to run particular roles depending on many things really. And by doing that, we enjoy(Or at least I found out I do) a wider PS2, we find new things to Cert and learn how new things work.

What we need is a NEW Resource system and that is actually on the way(Rather long way that, though) and from what I remember it was close to what you call for. Just not so off the track of "Rock-Paper-Scissors" in the sense that you can't fly to make Air Resources, to then fly more, to make more Resources and so on. This has many hidden dangers as a system and can severely limit a player's perception of PS2's full spectrum. We should not want that, there should be incentives to do one thing for a while, then a different thing. Keep things cycling. Allow players to invest their infinite Certs in new things.

Things. Things. Things. I think I used that word too much up there didn't I?.... :S

The lattice system works when pop is on low medium to guide them into bigger battles. However the moment lots of people log on the backside of the lattice system starts to show.

Battles go from big to lag fests and large areas still remain empty and boring. because everyone wants to stick around the mainstream battles. Which also has the issue of people jumping in and then leaving in large groups.

Lots of fights are not won due to progress but due to people leaving which isn't very fun.

It annoys me that we have such a large map to fight on yet half it rarely ever gets to see action. And thanks to lattice and map changes those areas are really turned barren empty and wasted. While those LOL lanes we run at seem smaller and smaller each time we fight on them. Lattice is a temporary patch work in my eyes not a long term solution because it doesn't work properly with high population.

I hope that with the resource rewamp they start looking into a change on the lattice to. It's not adding to the fun it's decreasing the "replay" value of this game.

To be honest, I really think the resource system will sort a Lot of what you are talking about, out. I agree that the lattice works best with mid-low pop servers, and when you get to a critical mass, everyone piling into the same areas, it starts to get too busy. Thing is, you need to manage this Critical mass point, so that in order for people to pile into an area like that, they have to have a strong support network in place, stretching out battles over multiple hexes, Not just one. If the resource system works as intended, what will happen in my opinion, is that you'll see massive zerg fights shifting more towards being sieges. To support the massive fights, people will need to be stretched out over 2-3 territories behind the lines, picking up resource loads and taking them to the area that is contested. This means that just sitting inside of the biolab isn't viable anymore, because you'll be loosing max suites, explosives, and vehicles, until your enemy is 10x stronger, just by nature of actually being able to pull things that are themselves force modifiers. This will mean that the zerg clusters will stretch out their numbers over a wider area, which means smaller groups can have a greater chance of disrupting and even Stopping them.

So the more people you want to pile into one hex, the more hexes around it are needed to shore up the drain that mass of people is having on that one hex, the more the battle gets spread out, and the more a smaller group can throw a wrench into the motor.