Mag-Scatter just isn't any good.

With the Testing Intensives going on, I've gotten to try my hand at the Mag Scatter quite a bit now. And I have to honestly say, Its just not any good. Don't get me wrong, there are some awesome "Surprise! Buttsecks!" moments, but thats really ALL there is too it. And even in those instances where it does do good (see above), A Commissioner would have done the exact same thing. With the added bonus of a bigger clip and actually being able to be used at range.
Not only that, but it seems to suffer from the same "dead zone" and the MAX shotguns suffer from; If you are too close (where a Shotgun SHOULD shine), good luck hitting anything at all.

All in all, Mag-Scatter still needs alot of work.

BUT, BUT BUT BUT... SURPRISE BUTTSECKS MOMENTS!!!!
To me, the Mag Scat was the BEST sidearm in PTS. The AMP was a VERY close second, and the Spiker was absolute crap. In my opinion. Although, it should be buffed. Give it a VERY tight CoF, OR revamp it to be a 600 damage Sawed-off>:] You NC might just like that

It just needs to hit for max damage out to 10m and maybe have an extra round in the mag. Not a whole lot of work really.

I know the magscatter isnt so good, but have you guys tried the AMP? its equally terrible.

Last time I checked it was 12m max damage.

Is it? It felt a lot shorter than that yesterday while I was using it in Allatum. Maybe it was the spread causing it then.

Yep, definitely 12m. I just gave it another run this time with the smart choke on it and only fired while ADS. Worked pretty well actually. Now it just needs one or two more rounds in the mag and it will be golden.

What if all shotguns traded their high damage low buckshot for low damage high buckshot.

For example shotguns have around 6 pellets with at least 100 damage per pellet. But what if they were 20 pellets with at least 30 damage per pellet. Semi Auto's could be high spread short range to get those pesky mice while pump actions were more long range shotguns so you could go huntin' for heads.

(I don't know, I don't use shotguns)

Then fix both.

Okay, for the sake of keeping it all on point here.
How about we just make everything simple and just conclude that ALL the new pistols are terrible?
And we just keep complaining that they are terrible. So that good things will happen.....
lol. Forumside at it's best.

With the recent instakillesque change to the Spiker, the Spiker is now by far the best with both the AMP and Scatter being both ineffective and redundant.

I bet you have not used the Spiker outside VR, because if you would have you wouldn't be saying something like that.

Its regular burstfire is awful to use since it fires when you release the button which causes small delay and the slowish firerate means it only fires every second time when you try to click bit faster. All that makes it bad on both close and medium range.

Now about the "instagib" charge. Well first off its not instagib as it just fires 6 rounds at the similiar RPM as you get to fire 30 rounds with fast firing Carbine. To miss one or more shots on a target that is moving is more than likely which also means you need to shoot one or two times more. First rank of nanoweave is enough to prevent the kill from charge even if you land all shots.

And that is after charging it up for one second while you cannot run or cloak.

I spend about three hours yesterday testing all the new pistols on live fight around the Crown and I can honestly say that the Spiker is one of the worst pistols in the game on its current form.

The Mag-Scatter isn't great either, but its miles ahead of the Spiker. Mag-Scatter is decent for stalker infiltrator if you like to sneak up close to your target and have a powerfull weapon with a silencer. Given its still very loud even with the silencer but anyways it still hides you from the minimap. For everything else I would use Commie instead.

The AMP is pretty good. Very powerfull at close range and just a perfect weapon for situations where pistol is usually needed. Which is to finish of a wounded target after the main gun runs out of ammo. However I find the Repeater better for stalker infiltrator due to its better accuracy and range.

I cant really think a situation where Spiker would be usefull. All other pistols does the finishing part better and on stalker, which relies on staying cloaked as much as possible and doing quick attacks, its just bad. You need to uncloak to charge in order to have a chance to kill something and even then its not that good.

Are you actually being serious? Do you actually honest to god believe that the Mag Scatter and the AMP are better than the current Spiker?
You accuse me of not using Spiker outside of VR (no i havent) but I dont think you have tried ANY of them if you are making statements like that. Have you tried the AMP or Scatter at all?
You say that the burst is only the equivalent of a fast firing 30 round carbine i agree, a pistol performing as well as a primary, sounds weak. Oh you will probably need a follow up burst to the charge to finish them off? Sounds hard. VS must have it so tough. Try a pistol that cant even kill beyond 15 metres. Or try a pistol that has the lowest damage per clip in the game coupled with the highest mag dump speed. Yeah VS have it hard.
Holey moley.
Nice troll.

Higby even said "Vanu wont use anything unless its blatantly overpowered"

Do I believe? No thats my observations from using all of the new pistols and some of the old ones (Repeater and Desperado to get little comparison) yesterday on PTS for three hours. I think you are the one who believes stuff as you haven't even used any of them on live.... Maybe you should since, you know, VR really doesn't tell much from weapons performance before starting to call others troll.

I used the Spiker the most as my main is VS and thats what Iam mostly interested in (not anymore), but I used the AMP for about 40 minutes and the Mag-Scatter for almost an hour, on live against real targets. Mainly with stalker infiltrator but I did couple runs as HA as well.

The burst is equivalent of fast firing Carbine AFTER you have charged it for one second or more. And well its hard to tell when its actually fully charged so often you just charge it bit longer to make sure. By the time it takes me to charge and shoot you could have killed me 2-3 times with AMP.

Now imagine a situation, you sneak behind someone as stalker infil. You uncloak, charge it up for over a second, then "instagib" the target and cloak again before anyone else sees you. By the time that is done I could have killed the guy much faster with AMP, Mag-Scatter or Repeater all while being uncloaked for less time. Heck even crossbow + knife or headshot with commie + knife is much better.

When I uncloak close to someone I need to kill him fast before the player can react to the sound and turn around or move. Now add extra time to that with charging up and extra sound from the charging itself. Yeah doesn't work too well.

The TTK of the Spiker is currently the slowest out of all the new pistols.

For refference:

Magscatter has a TTK of 0.5 seconds (( 60/120 x (2-1) = 0.5 ))

T4 AMP has a TTK of 0.57 seconds (( 60/934 x (10-1) = 0.57 ))

Spiker has a TTK of 0.81 seconds while doing the 2x burst. (( 60/366 x (6-1) )) TTK increases to about 1 seconds while charging, due to the 1 second-ish charge time.

Add on top of that that it makes a audible buzzing sound that is loud enough to be heard within its effective range. And the person CANNOT sprint while charging up, limiting his or her chasing potential and mobility greatly. The spiker cannot be charged in cloak either, so the T4 AMP and Magscatter are allready better for Stalker infiltrators right out of the box. The Spiker is only good as a flankingweapon where the opponent is unaware of your position and has poor situational awareness, or maybe they have music playing in the background so they cant hear you charging the pistol.

All in all i think the pistols are in a good place at the moment, The only thing i would like to see changed would be a RoF buff for the 2x burst on the spiker, so it does not feel as clunky to use in that mode.

All of this is only relevant at point blank, get back to me with the TTKs of all 3 at 10 and 20 metres. You know, the ranges that nearly all fights take place in. Want to know why the Spiker has the least DPS? it actually functions at range, of course its going to lose at literal point blank to the other pistols(unless its charged)
And you are right. At point blank the AMP and Scatter are 0.2 seconds faster, we are so lucky. VS be jealous.

Edit: btw I dont mean theoretical TTK im talking about out there on the range in VR and test it at 10 and 20 metres on top of this 0 metre range a few times, find the average and post it back here. And if you have to reload, the reload time counts too.
Actual TTK times are far different to theoretical.

This guy ^^ haha.

Can I get some TR and NC people to back this guy up on the obvious awesomeness of the AMP and the Mag Scatter compared to the Spiker? Perhaps some accounts of our killstreaks with these weapons on PTS?

Somehow a very slow firing weak semi auto shotty and a 21 round confetti blaster are BETTER than the Spiker.

God i love VS sometimes. Its madness

Im not saying the Spiker is OP or anything if you are just spouting this nonsense out of fear of a nerf.
Im just saying the AMP and the Scatter are rubbish.

And all Iam saying is that you really should go test them out (not in VR) before saying whats good and what is not... And you call me a troll.

They are all quite bad at bit longer ranges than CQC. Just like most of the other pistols. Again go try and kill people with the Spiker at that 15 meter range. And no, dont do it in VR.

0,2 seconds is a lot. Especially when the difference is like that if you happen to be always shooting the Spiker with its optimal firerate which is not very likely to happen. The difference between CQC carbines and longer range Carbines is between 0,2 to 0,4 seconds on most cases. And well pretty much every other weapon class as well. Yet the difference gives big advantage for the faster firing weapons on CQC and thats what people use when they are fighting at close range.

For close range you need good DPS. Spiker DPS is around 1018, AMP is 1561 and Desperado which is very similiar to the Spiker has 1391. Quess which sucks the most on close range where the pistols are being used?

Sorry but BS about the magscatter I spend 5 hours killing with it in indar and you know what I did? I switched to the rebel that how terrible the mag scatter is. I was using the ultimate stalker infiltrator tricks in the book and lmao the only infantry I got to kill were the one that were standing completely still and shot them from the back which I could have done with any gun.

The mag scatter has
LOW ROF
Long reload
4 rounds
HUGE spread
terrible at range
DEAD ZONE